MadScientistMatt wrote: Rumor has it that the stock Ecotec block can stand up to more horsepower than a stock 350 block. Supposedly the safe limit on a factory 350 casting is around 360-375 hp.
That sounds awfully low. Even Ford 302s can put up with more than that.
But try to make much over 550-600 on a 400 block and you've lit the fuse.
What I don't get is what the big deal over the 350 is, at all. There was only ever one performance 350, everything else was truck engines and smog motors.
My roommate has blown up more chevy small blocks than i have blown up rotaries, im also inching close to that ratio myself.
Knurled wrote:MadScientistMatt wrote: Rumor has it that the stock Ecotec block can stand up to more horsepower than a stock 350 block. Supposedly the safe limit on a factory 350 casting is around 360-375 hp.That sounds awfully low. Even Ford 302s can put up with more than that. But try to make much over 550-600 on a 400 block and you've lit the fuse. What I don't get is what the big deal over the 350 is, at all. There was only ever one performance 350, everything else was truck engines and smog motors.
they made probably 20 million 350s and put them in production vehicles from 1967 to 1999, so they are the most common... and since they are the most common, they make the most parts for them... and since they make the most parts for them, they are the cheapest...
and it's also painfully easy to make over 400hp with them and have a pretty civilized engine that doesn't drink a lot of gas or get all 'splody when you beat on them too much...
The third gen cars are all Chevy's anyways. The last Pontiac was built in 1981.
The third-gen is really more of a big Vega than anything.
MadScientistMatt wrote:Knurled wrote: Trick question! There are no perfectly good 400s. Trying to make power with one is a time bomb, so you have to go to an aftermarket block, at which point you just order one with normal sized mains. (That's kind of a loaded statement. You need an aftermarket block for ANY Chevy if you want to make power.)Rumor has it that the stock Ecotec block can stand up to more horsepower than a stock 350 block. Supposedly the safe limit on a factory 350 casting is around 360-375 hp.
Which motor do you think will be around in 10 years of daily driving? A 400hp 350, or a 400hp Ecotec?
Neither? 
Trans-Maro, your initial response is my nomination for post of the year!
As a 2nd Gen Trans Am owner, I cringe at the thought of someone plopping the lame 350/350 combo in these cars. When I was getting sick of the pain in the ass 403 my car came with, many people told me to swap the 350 in there. BORING. Pretty much every other 2nd gen F-body around here, no matter the make, has that combo under the hood. Weaksauce. I've even seen a first generation Firebird in my travels with a 305 and Saginaw box! PUKE!!!
I swapped a Pontiac 400 into my car. It had a BOP TH350 to begin with, so it was easy. The starter and alternator swapped over too. All that stuff would have to go if I installed a Chevy 350. The wiring harness is different (like you said), the fuel lines are on the wrong side, as is the battery and battery tray for having a 350 under there, so all that would have to be changed too.. Plus, the 2nd Gen Firebird was designed to have a Pontiac mill anyway, so it was easy to swap in and it fits better under the hood.
Also, Pontiac engines are a lot cooler than a dumb 1st gen Chevy small block motor anyway. They sound great and make lots of torque. All that said, I'd love to have a 3rd gen LSX under there, because of how modern they are and how easy it is to make power with them.
novaderrik wrote:yamaha wrote: ROFL Shawn. And oddly enough, nobody bothers with the bastard offspring of the 383 stroker.......the high winding 377 destroker.......which is hated amongst the chebby faithful because it revs past 6k.why would you wreck a perfectly good 400 by making it smaller with a crank out of a 350?
Well, when you grass roots together a 383 for drag duty and have cannibalised engines laying around, why not. The 383 blew to high hell within a month, the 377 is still being used AFAIK 10 years later(the 377 put in quicker ET's too)
Trans_Maro's post on the first page is hilarious. Unfortunately have seen a lot of the same hack work he describes, and I also meet a lot of die-hard Pontiac fans like him.
The funny part is that both of my 2nd gen Bird's are SBC equipped - but they came from Van Nuys that way!!! I can see the appeal of the 400's and 455's, and down the road I could see dropping one in my '81. But getting misty-eyed over 301's (or 403's)makes no sense to me.
SEADave wrote: Trans_Maro's post on the first page is hilarious. Unfortunately have seen a lot of the same hack work he describes, and I also meet a lot of die-hard Pontiac fans like him. The funny part is that both of my 2nd gen Bird's are SBC equipped - but they came from Van Nuys that way!!! I can see the appeal of the 400's and 455's, and down the road I could see dropping one in my '81. But getting misty-eyed over 301's (or 403's)makes no sense to me.
Cali-produced Firebirds that came that way are OK in my book. Some are actually quite rare! I've seen and drooled over a basket case '81 Special Edition ("Bandit Edition" according to the typical car show derps) with the rare 305/4-speed combo. It's fine to ditch the 305 for another SBC in that case. When you take a perfectly good Poncho 400 out and replace it with a turd, that's just not cool.
Yeah, Pontiacs suck to work on but they're soooo much cooler.
Especially nowadays with Ram Air IV clone heads so plentiful.
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