Autocross is not racing? Blasphemy!!!

In reply to Spoolpigeon:

Wow, 4.5 seconds on a low 40 second course, huh? I suppose sucking that bad might make you hate autocross.

Honestly, I couldn't care less whether other people think autocross is racing. I'll continue to tell people I'm "going racing" when I have an event scheduled. I'll also quickly add that I'm autocrossing and (if they ask) explain what that means, because I'm not trying to impress anybody.

By the way, by his definition, the fools on that "Street Outlaws" crap are "racing" just because they could hit something solid, including each other, so his "definition" sucks too.

So...do we have to refer to it as Land Speed Activity?

All I'm getting at is that if you suck at something, you don't have to bash it.

Knurled wrote: In reply to Spoolpigeon: I'm pretty sure that he had this opinion well before that. I don't see what the big deal is. Racing is a subset of motorsports, just because it is not racing does not mean that it does not take a significant amount of skill to be at the pointy end. The whole thing reminds me of people saying "They're not DOLLS they are ACTION FIGURES." No, Johnny, your GI Joe is a doll. Don't hide from it, own it.

Or similar to the old argument about whether golf is a "sport" or whether golfers or nascar drivers are "athletes." Is figure-skating a sport, since the winner is determined by judges?

But why does it even matter.....I road race, I autocross, I rallycross. I casually refer to all of them at racing. I know that one is directly racing a group of other cars, and that the others are time trials. There are enough words in the English language to distinguish between types of racing/motorsports/etc without having to lump them all into one single words.

Just for fun, we could expand this discussion into whether DRIFT is racing or not. After all, you are on a course WITH other cars in close proximity and have to drive in consideration of the other cars. But there are judges too that determine the winner, not "who finishes first."

I find it most useful just to use the term "motorsports" and not worry about what is and isn't "actual" racing.

^^ that said, no drifter I know refers to his car as a "racecar." They ALWAYS need to make sure to call it their "drift car"....

Until the 1800's come back and I can say "Yes, my good chap, I shall be engaging in an exciting round of motorsports this coming end-of-week!" I think I'll stick to telling folks "yeah, I'm going racing Saturday" when it comes up at work.

Hilariously, though, when I was explaining that I would be out of the office to go to the Rolex 24, everyone asked me what that was and when I explained it every single person said that they had never heard of that and then asked me if I was racing my car in it.

wbjones wrote: since when does the fastest time not count ? anytime I've had the fastest time I've been the winner …...

For the sake of simplicity, we're the only two people in our class. I run a 39.5. You run a 35.8 but nudge two cones hard enough to move them. You're significantly faster, however, I win.

Contest of precision driving, not a contest of speed. A lot of people forget that... often the people way overdriving their cars.

Your insurance company will still say its racing since its a timed event so...

SCCA National events might have that few runs but lots of local groups get way more seat time. Is it the hour+ on the track like a track day? no but its also only 60 bucks

wae wrote: Until the 1800's come back and I can say "Yes, my good chap, I shall be engaging in an exciting round of motorsports this coming end-of-week!" I think I'll stick to telling folks "yeah, I'm going racing Saturday" when it comes up at work. Hilariously, though, when I was explaining that I would be out of the office to go to the Rolex 24, everyone asked me what that was and when I explained it every single person said that they had never heard of that and then asked me if I was racing my car in it.

Yah, with non car people I say I'm going racing, as it's just easier. But I feel bad about it.

Your Rolex story reminds me of when I was doing track days years back. My co-workers thought it was cool idea, until they found out I wasn't going to be driving a rented car. "You're driving your own car? What fun is THAT?"

The correct answer is: Who gives a berkeley?

Seriously, it's a fun activity that a lot of us enjoy with our cars. What possible difference does it make if someone considers it "racing" or not? It's semantics. It's not important.

kanaric wrote: The Truth About Cars is not a good news site.

The fact that autocross isn't racing isn't news

around here, autocross isn't driving around cones in a parking lot: autocross is racing fwd beaters with the glass knocked out on a motocross course..

Knurled wrote:

wbjones wrote: since when does the fastest time not count ? anytime I've had the fastest time I've been the winner …...

For the sake of simplicity, we're the only two people in our class. I run a 39.5. You run a 35.8 but nudge two cones hard enough to move them. You're significantly faster, however, I win. Contest of precision driving, not a contest of speed. A lot of people forget that... often the people way overdriving their cars.

if I had moved either of those cones I wouldn't have the faster time .. as I'm sure you're aware, an out of place cone is a 2 sec. penalty … just as shortcutting the course during the Rolex 24 would have incurred a penalty …

the cones are part of the "race" if I can't drive faster than you within the rules … then yes .. .you win ….

anecdote… a very very fast driver was visiting our little club several yrs ago, and each of his first 5 runs were marked with calls of + 4 +6 +3 …etc … I was kidding him and pointed out that even I could win if I ignored the cones … of course his last run was clean and still significantly faster than mine

so to your example, if I were that much faster than you, I'm pretty sure I could come up with a run that was clean and still be faster than you (keep in mind that regardless of the event ..SCCA .. anyway), you'd get a minimum of 3 runs … if the best I could do was hit cones while running quicker than you.. then no I didn't have the quickest run … per the rules under which I had agreed to compete

and keep in mind, that all this is just my opinion

Zomby Woof wrote:

SyntheticBlinkerFluid wrote: My opinion is, if autocross is not racing, neither is drag racing.

And you'd be wrong. If you can pass, it's racing. If not, it's not. Because trying to pass the guy in front of you is what racing actually is

Well, like I said, it's my opinion, so I'm right.

And by your definition, there are several forms of racing that wouldn't be considered racing.

If a timed event with a start line and a finish line isn't racing, what is?

I use Gillete Mach 3 razors. Anyone have any suggestions for some other razor? I don't like electrics.

All in good fun, all in good fun. Srsly, if I can "win" by getting a better time than the other guy, then it's racing, against the clock or otherwise.

Spoolpigeon wrote: All I'm getting at is that if you suck at something, you don't have to bash it.

Truth!!!
And I would add that he doesn't get it. I suck at autocross too but still have a blast whenever I go. Even if I come in last.

I don't know about razors, but Ford has named two cars after shaving cream, the Edge and the Fusion. I'm waiting for them to come out with the Foamy.

T.J. wrote: I use Gillete Mach 3 razors. Anyone have any suggestions for some other razor? I don't like electrics.

I like to watch figure skating more than I like to watch Drifting.

The women in their outfits are way more interesting than Nissan 350s and 240SX spinning their tires instead of moving forward.

irish44j wrote:

Knurled wrote: In reply to Spoolpigeon: I'm pretty sure that he had this opinion well before that. I don't see what the big deal is. Racing is a subset of motorsports, just because it is not racing does not mean that it does not take a significant amount of skill to be at the pointy end. The whole thing reminds me of people saying "They're not DOLLS they are ACTION FIGURES." No, Johnny, your GI Joe is a doll. Don't hide from it, own it.

Or similar to the old argument about whether golf is a "sport" or whether golfers or nascar drivers are "athletes." Is figure-skating a sport, since the winner is determined by judges? But why does it even matter.....I road race, I autocross, I rallycross. I casually refer to all of them at racing. I know that one is directly racing a group of other cars, and that the others are time trials. There are enough words in the English language to distinguish between types of racing/motorsports/etc without having to lump them all into one single words. Just for fun, we could expand this discussion into whether DRIFT is racing or not. After all, you are on a course WITH other cars in close proximity and have to drive in consideration of the other cars. But there are judges too that determine the winner, not "who finishes first." I find it most useful just to use the term "motorsports" and not worry about what is and isn't "actual" racing.

Gees....Who cares really? It's all motorsports.

Using the word racing to explain Autocross is a lot easier then trying to explain to a non car person what autox is though.

Not sure how autox ISN'T racing,I do both autox and w2w and I get how someone could look at autox sideways.I enjoy both forms of RACING for different reasons,I love the racecraft aspect of w2w and trying to find a way by or force the other car into a mistake etc.

But I also enjoy the mental aspect of NOT knowing what the other cars in your class are doing so you have to focus on getting the best run possible with no mistakes.Having said that I've only been running pretty quick stuff the last few yrs and wouldn't get too excited about running stock class cars.

racing definition, per dictionary:

"compete with another or others to see who is fastest at covering a set course or achieving an objective."

Seems clear to me. Autox=racing, unless you make up your own word definitions... which is dumb.

kanaric wrote:

If you can pass, it's racing. If not, it's not. Because trying to pass the guy in front of you is what racing actually is

TIL that hill climbs and rally isn't racing.

Clearly you haven't seen enough rally. Attempting a pass in rally

Zomby Woof wrote:

SyntheticBlinkerFluid wrote: My opinion is, if autocross is not racing, neither is drag racing.

And you'd be wrong. If you can pass, it's racing. If not, it's not. Because trying to pass the guy in front of you is what racing actually is

Uh, what? RALLY isn't racing?!? Okay then...