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Nathan JansenvanDoorn
Nathan JansenvanDoorn Dork
5/25/13 12:34 p.m.

Let me add to the tdi chorus - I loved mine for commuting, and am a little sad to see it go. Relatively refined, smooth riding, quiet on the highway and incredibly reliable and cheap to run. I've averaged just over 50mpg in all weather over 65,000 miles. I don't drive much any more, so replaced it with a Miata.

jere
jere Reader
5/25/13 1:52 p.m.

ecomodder 101 gas saving tips You might think about changing your driving style and doing some simple MPG mods.

I never thought I would but I am trying some of the above to make the camry wagon work for us

That site also has all the best the best performing MPG vehicles listed from that group. There are some jokers on their so take the ones that don't have that many fuel logs

Zomby Woof
Zomby Woof UberDork
5/25/13 4:32 p.m.
Jaynen wrote: I just wish my cruise control worked but I have not looked into it

It probably has a chunk of refinement stuck in the contacts.

mistanfo
mistanfo SuperDork
5/25/13 5:06 p.m.

I have enjoyed the wife's Jetta TDI (ALH engine, sadly with an sluchbox) so much that I am considering buying a new VW TDI as her next vehicle, and taking hers over as my DD. I will likely swap in a manual eventually, but it's got just short of 200,000 and it's been one of the most solid vehicles that I have had. She'll have a new vehicle, and I'll have something that is easy on the wallet.

ShadowSix
ShadowSix HalfDork
5/25/13 5:13 p.m.

So what's the cheat sheet on years, options, engines, transmissions to avoid on these things?

I have to say that these VW's are much more comfortable places to spend highway time than Insights, Metros, or even Civics.

Nathan JansenvanDoorn
Nathan JansenvanDoorn Dork
5/25/13 5:19 p.m.

The ALH motor'd cars (up to 2003?) with manual trans seem to be the most robust. Later cars are even more sensitive to oil type, with cam and lifter wear evident fairly quickly it seems. Ian can chime in with more detail. I found a basically zero option car (manual windows and less VW electrical to go wrong), with ALH and manual trans, and jumped on it. It's worth just about what I paid for it. Silly, but hey, the market speaks.

Ian F
Ian F PowerDork
5/25/13 5:28 p.m.

In reply to ShadowSix:

IMHO:

2003 and older; manual transmissions - good service records.

There has been some conjecture the 2003 was the best year. It was the last year for the "simple" ALH engine and by that point the Mk IV had been around for awhile and VW had many of the earlier bugs worked out. Is there solid evidence to support this? Who knows... although I can say my personal car - which i bought new - has been largely trouble free.

I agree it's a pleasant place to spend time, which is good since I spend over 2 hrs a day in mine. When I was using our (sold) 2007 MINI as a back-up DD, I was always happy to get back into the VW. While the MINI is a nice car, the interior of the Mk IV set a quality standard back in 1999 for compact cars that only recently have manufacturers (including VW) begun to equal.

Jaynen
Jaynen Dork
5/25/13 8:25 p.m.

99.5 to 2003 5 speed. I prefer the base model because it doesn't have things that can be troublesome like window regulators. Mine is cloth I have not sat in one of the leather models.

My likely planned replacement is the 2006 E320 CDI at some point. Kind of like the big brother to my Jetta

There is a lot of parts compatibility which can be kind of nice as well. A fair bit of the audi TT suspension/brakes stuff comes over the audi TT steering bushing being a common replacement when you refresh suspension

Jaynen
Jaynen Dork
5/25/13 8:26 p.m.
Zomby Woof wrote:
Jaynen wrote: I just wish my cruise control worked but I have not looked into it
It probably has a chunk of refinement stuck in the contacts.

It never has worked :) and out of everything else on a vehicle I will take that as a minor annoyance.

Ranger50
Ranger50 PowerDork
5/26/13 7:21 a.m.
jere wrote: ecomodder 101 gas saving tips You might think about changing your driving style and doing some simple MPG mods. I never thought I would but I am trying some of the above to make the camry wagon work for us That site also has all the best the best performing MPG vehicles listed from that group. There are some jokers on their so take the ones that don't have that many fuel logs

Shoot... I may as well just buy a Neon.

Kenny_McCormic
Kenny_McCormic Dork
5/26/13 7:53 a.m.

If you dont want to deal with VAG, Honda Tax, or dieing in a metro, the answer is Corolla/Prizm. My 99 5 spd pulls low 30s beating it. When I bought it, I immediately drove cross state at high speed until I hit a blizzard, the tank averaged 36 mpg, on winter blend fuel, with iffy plugs, wires, and a very dirty air filter.

Zomby Woof
Zomby Woof UberDork
5/26/13 10:02 a.m.
Kenny_McCormic wrote: or dieing in a metro

Says the guy who drives a real death machine. Some of the E36 M3 you guys come up with is unbelievable.

Mike
Mike GRM+ Memberand HalfDork
5/26/13 10:25 a.m.

No hybrid, no two seater, 190 mi a day, great mileage? Tesla Model S. Congrats!

EvanR
EvanR HalfDork
5/26/13 10:27 a.m.

Let me put in a vote for the newest Toyota Echo or oldest Scion xA or Yaris you can find.

They all share a drivetrain with my Scion xB. Because of the (lack of) aerodynamics on the box, I can only pull down 36-38 highway, but the smoother bodied-versions should pull down an easy 40.

Ian F
Ian F PowerDork
5/26/13 11:22 a.m.
Mike wrote: No hybrid, no two seater, 190 mi a day, great mileage? Tesla Model S. Congrats!

Sure... except it only exceeds his $5-6K budget by a factor of 10+...

Vigo
Vigo UltraDork
5/26/13 12:02 p.m.
I think Vigo on here has one that has dead batteries that he disconnected and he was still in the 50+ mpg range.

ALMOST correct! I get 47-48 currently, with a much closer to 50/50 city/hwy mix than i was driving last year. It will still do over 50 in straight freeway driving with batteries turned off. My bigger/wider/heavier wheels/tires seemed to cost me 1-2mpg over the setup it had before, which was probably a bit down from stock (stock tires are super LRR and tiny), so one with completely stock wheel/tire would probably still avg over 50 with no battery action.

BUT! The car is not fun with no batteries. I still love my car, but that is because i know i can get off my lazy butt and fix it. If you have no plans to have a working battery system in an Insight, i would NOT recommend owning it.

Ive been wanting to get a TDI to try out for a while now. I just have to be ready to jump when i see the broken ones for 1-2k and im not really looking often enough to see those deals before they're gone.

I had an 85 CRX HF that avg'd 43 in mostly highway driving, 75mph. I liked the car a lot. I bought an 86 auto for the significant other but havent gotten it on the road yet.

I have a SOHC/5spd neon too. It's POSSIBLE to get really good mpg in one of those. Ive never done it. Mine averages 29-32 depending on how i drive it, but has never once gotten the high 30s - low 40s most people claim to have seen for hwy mpg. Upside is, it's punchy and handles good and super cheap to fix. My absolute highest mpg ever seen on straight highway is 35. However, im not going to claim the car is working perfectly. Supposedly rear 02s can affect mpg on these things, and i am suspicious of mine.

Had an 04 2.0/auto mazda3 that would get 35-37 hwy all day, and 42 if you were on a flat road with the a/c off. Talked to a 5spd owner of same car and he reported the same numbers. That was a GREAT car (other than the fact that fiancee bought it with an auto), and the early ones are WELL within the price range. I sold our beat up one with 130k for $4350 in 2009 or 10 (cant remember..).

accordionfolder
accordionfolder Reader
5/26/13 2:48 p.m.

Also related to the insight: the 5spds second gear synchro is notorious for going out. You can work around it with double clutching, but it's rather annoying. On the flip side those little engines will literally run forever. I'm serious on that one. Just go to insight central and check out all the 200/300+ examples.

Jaynen
Jaynen Dork
5/26/13 4:22 p.m.

I REALLY REALLY want my clutch to go out so I have an excuse to upgrade it. Then I will do chip/injectors/5th gear swap and probably gain highway mpg while also gaining about 40hp and 80lbft of tq

Ian F
Ian F PowerDork
5/26/13 4:43 p.m.

My clutch is going... actually - the throw-out bearing and/or flywheel - the clutch itself still holds fine. I got the "mild" upgrade kit from idparts.com Now I just have to sell the BMW so I can buy something else to use as a DD so I can take the VW off the road long enough to change it.

Jaynen
Jaynen Dork
5/26/13 5:54 p.m.

I could always daily my miata for a few days

Ranger50
Ranger50 PowerDork
5/26/13 6:52 p.m.

I believe I am going to bite the bullet and come Tuesday, I am going to look at one of the two manual, one base model black sedan and one blue SE model hatch, Fiesta's at the local dealer. Depends on the payments OTD, it is a savings of not much, but quite a lot in other ways.

Vigo
Vigo UltraDork
5/27/13 1:12 p.m.
the 5spds second gear synchro is notorious for going out. You can work around it with double clutching, but it's rather annoying. On the flip side those little engines will literally run forever. I'm serious on that one. Just go to insight central and check out all the 200/300+ examples

At 341k miles (original motor, still makes oil pressure on 0-20) my 2nd gear synchro is plenty good. Sometime around 300k i started noticing the 1st gear synchro getting picky, but i am fairly sure it not because the synchro is worn out. It is a double cone synchro where the two elements are 'keyed' together in the middle with a square sticking out of one and a notch in the other where it fits. Over time the receiving end can wear a kind of 'ramp' that the other part rides up and forces the two elements apart, which keeps you from completing the movement of the shift fork. The fix is to grind the key off, but i have to take the trans apart to do that. I wont until i have a better reason.

Rupert
Rupert Reader
5/27/13 2:23 p.m.
Ranger50 wrote: I believe I am going to bite the bullet and come Tuesday, I am going to look at one of the two manual, one base model black sedan and one blue SE model hatch, Fiesta's at the local dealer. Depends on the payments OTD, it is a savings of not much, but quite a lot in other ways.

If you're thinking about spending more than your mentioned $5K-$7K I strongly suggest you consider a Honda Fit w/5-speed. 35-40mpg fully loaded, a/c on, & cruise set at 80-85 all across Texas. 38-42 in town all the time except during the cold of winter. Lot's of room for cargo or the occasional 3rd or 4th person.

The one in my garage has over 65K on the clock & has depreciated $2,500 from new MSRP in '99. Total repair expenditures other than gas and the 7,500 mile services (at about $40 each) are one set of tires at about 45K.

Yeah it cost a little more than your original budget. But I've owned several Hondas including a 1st gen. CRX-SI. I typically trade at 125K-150K miles and have never needed any serious repair work on any of them. Well except when my wife put a Civic Wagon through a ditch and then a board fence, but I can't blame that on the car.

Ranger50
Ranger50 PowerDork
5/27/13 2:29 p.m.

In reply to Rupert:

Hondas? No. They don't agree with my body proportions.

Too bad I don't have $2500. http://charlestonwv.craigslist.org/cto/3830980001.html

Jaynen
Jaynen Dork
5/27/13 2:41 p.m.

not sure if thats an ALH motor or not. If you are thinking of buying a brand new car. Can't you get 2500 bucks if thats the right car?

Always ask about timing belt changes, its the most important thing to check

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