wlkelley3 said:
Yeah, helps to have connections a Rucker. Have you tried any of the quickie courses to get your A&P? Got mine at a full school, 1 year of night classes and shop time. But I used to teach at one of the quickie schools, NCI in Clarksville, TN. Designed for folks with military aviation experience, just need to learn to translate it to civilian philosophy.
Haven't heard of any shorter classes... all I looked into were two years. And the people I know that went were embarrassed to see how low the bar to go through was. I never looked too hard; wasn't looking for a local job - love the traveling contract work, as does my wife. But Life put me in a night maint. position at a local yeast plant. Great people, great bennies... good pay for area. I'm just spoiled by road money for over 20 years! I'll prolly stay at least another 4 1/2 years to get vested, and at 55...
If you can direct me to any info on a quickie school, I'd def. appreciate it... 'cause ya never know.
I've worked the TVA coal plant in Cumberland City. Love that area 'tween there and Clarksville.
In reply to AnthonyGS :
Also submariner, so similar training except for being an electrician. The boat I was on hooked up shore power through multiple Subsafe penetrations so my whole division was QA trained and we had the torque wrench calibration equipment onboard.
oldopelguy said:
In reply to AnthonyGS :
Also submariner, so similar training except for being an electrician. The boat I was on hooked up shore power through multiple Subsafe penetrations so my whole division was QA trained and we had the torque wrench calibration equipment onboard.
I qualified aux electrician just because I could and was bored after a few years. My wife's cousin was also an electrician on a nuc sub out of King's Bay. He is working and finishing up a degree in EE now. Working on a nuclear sub definitely teaches you the difference between being a good boss and a bad one very quick and how to identify each. That's the one thing that you really learn. Well you do learn, how to learn new things quickly when needed too. Outside of that, I'd say the biggest thing is mental toughness. I'm kind of laughing at my wife's reaction to social distancing right now. She thinks this is hard....
I've noticed bubbleheads get so comfortable being TOO close, that they can tolerate about any social conditions! I guess just getting used enough to ignoring, that stepping away doesn't even register!
As well as the mental toughness. Y'all wouldn'tt survive what sub duty throws at ya without that.
My dad was a career electrical instructor. He taught me early on that the ability to learn is first importance. Anything can come after that. He was not a great mechanic, but taught me to be great, by teaching me HOW to learn it!
03Panther said:
wlkelley3 said:
Yeah, helps to have connections a Rucker. Have you tried any of the quickie courses to get your A&P? Got mine at a full school, 1 year of night classes and shop time. But I used to teach at one of the quickie schools, NCI in Clarksville, TN. Designed for folks with military aviation experience, just need to learn to translate it to civilian philosophy.
Haven't heard of any shorter classes... all I looked into were two years. And the people I know that went were embarrassed to see how low the bar to go through was. I never looked too hard; wasn't looking for a local job - love the traveling contract work, as does my wife. But Life put me in a night maint. position at a local yeast plant. Great people, great bennies... good pay for area. I'm just spoiled by road money for over 20 years! I'll prolly stay at least another 4 1/2 years to get vested, and at 55...
If you can direct me to any info on a quickie school, I'd def. appreciate it... 'cause ya never know.
I've worked the TVA coal plant in Cumberland City. Love that area 'tween there and Clarksville.
What was your MO? Here's what the FAA says about that and the relevant section:
You can get the experience you need to become a certified power plant or airframe mechanic in one of three ways.
-snip-
3. You can join one of the armed services and get training and experience in aircraft maintenance. Make sure you are in a military occupational specialty for which FAA gives credit. You can get a current list of acceptable specialties from the local FAA Flight Standards District Office (FSDO).
You must present an official letter from your military employer certifying your length of service, the amount of time you worked in each specialties, the make and model of the aircraft or engine on which you got practical experience, and where you got the experience. You cannot count time you spent training for the specialty, only the time you spent working in the specialty.
With both types of on-the-job training you should set aside additional study time to prepare for the written and oral/practical tests. The FAA will give you credit for your practical experience only after we review your paperwork and you have a satisfactory interview with an FAA Airworthiness inspector.
I received mine through ERAU's program 12 years ago. But it was 16 months and 40 hours a week for the program.
In reply to The0retical :
At 55, I prolly can't join one of the armed services to get training and experience, so #3 is not really applicable to the information WLKELLY3 mentioned. Even your 16 month training Is shorter than what I've heard of 'round here. He mentioned some quickie courses that MIGHT transfer some relevant experience. I've only heard of the courses that take people that don't know the difference in an adjustable wrench and a screwdriver, let them attend for two years, and then tells them where to take the test. Those "schools" would "let" me start with those folks.
I chose to serve my apprenticing in Nuclear Submarine and Aircraft Carrier construction, instead joining the military, but the closest MO would be MM. Woy more than an A-gang, but slightly less that Nuke School.
Been doing short term contracts as an I&C Commissioning Field Engineer, that I prolly won't have much luck trying to change careers, if someone thinks I have to start with people that don't have any experience.
What kinda work did you do before pursuing an A&P?
AnthonyGS said:
03Panther said:
In reply to AnthonyGS :
I did my apprenticeship as a civilian contractor on Nuclear Subs in early 80's. Used a click type a few times, but COUNTLESS Dial Torque Wrenches! Rebuild my first engine with a way cheap Sears beam and pointer... don't even know hou to explain how cheesy one is! But it did the job. Good mechanical practice and skill of the craft goes a long way, and I learned very little of that from degreed engineers
This was the most shocking part of getting my degree. There is a vast difference between a good mechanic and mechanical engineer. I spent most of my senior year in the labs actually building and making things work that smart people dreamed up.
You do come across as having some common since!!! Which ain't all that common...
03Panther said:
wlkelley3 said:
Yeah, helps to have connections a Rucker. Have you tried any of the quickie courses to get your A&P? Got mine at a full school, 1 year of night classes and shop time. But I used to teach at one of the quickie schools, NCI in Clarksville, TN. Designed for folks with military aviation experience, just need to learn to translate it to civilian philosophy.
Haven't heard of any shorter classes... all I looked into were two years. And the people I know that went were embarrassed to see how low the bar to go through was. I never looked too hard; wasn't looking for a local job - love the traveling contract work, as does my wife. But Life put me in a night maint. position at a local yeast plant. Great people, great bennies... good pay for area. I'm just spoiled by road money for over 20 years! I'll prolly stay at least another 4 1/2 years to get vested, and at 55...
If you can direct me to any info on a quickie school, I'd def. appreciate it... 'cause ya never know.
I've worked the TVA coal plant in Cumberland City. Love that area 'tween there and Clarksville.
Guess I should also caveat the quickie courses. To be eligible you have to have the permission slips to take the A&P test from the FAA and to get those you have to have >3 years documented experience working in aviation. Getting the powerplant can sometimes be difficult without going through a long school. There are usually 2 types a 5-day course which is >12 hours a day and 10-day which is 7-8 hours a day. You spend most of that time learning the answers to the written test and taking the written test. Then spend a few days on what to expect on the oral & practical test which you then have to schedule with a DME (Designated Mechanic Evaluator) which you have to pay separate from the school. These courses are designed for experienced aircraft mechanics (usually military) that want/need an A&P for work. Spent a year teaching this. Most fun job I've had but the pay sucked. Which is why I took a job at Army Aviation Command when offered.
https://nci.edu/ North Central Institute. Have both a 10 day (Part 65) for those that have permission slips in hand and a 2 year (part 147) for those that want to get into aviation.
In reply to The0retical :
Got mine in 1985 in Fairbanks, Alaska attending a 1 year night program for those with aviation experience and had permission slips from the FAA. At that time I had almost 10 years military aviation experience. Classes were 4 night a week for 4 hours a night, 6-10 pm. 2 nights a week in the class room and 2 nights a week in the shop hands on. Was also still in the military at the time then spent another 11 in to retire and finally use the A&P. Got to rebuild a radial engine and recover cloth covered wing in shop.
I need to replace my old Craftsman clicker torque wrench. One feature I use regularly is torquing up a nut rotating the opposite direction (one of the nuts in the Hewland transmission that needs to be torqued CCW to 105 lb-ft every time I change the gears on the Formula Ford). My old Craftsman does it. The Icon in the article shows a different accuracy spec for CCW vs. CW, so it must do it. The Sonic is described as Two-Way, so maybe that means it does it.
How universal is that? Can I pretty much buy anything, or do I need to be careful? Some product descriptions online specify that the accuracy spec is for CW rotation, but CCW isn't mentioned at all.
I haven’t read the whole thread so maybe this has been answered, but how does the calibration scale? That is to say, if I’m dead on at 75 ft lbs, do I assume I’m good at 150? Do I test the extremes and assume that there is a linear relationship in between? Do I test every 10 lbs? It seems too that one could build an accurate albeit less sophisticated test rig. A bar, a weight, a pivot point and some math to account for the weight of the bar. Rotate that to level and there’s your torque.
wlkelley3 said:
In reply to The0retical :
Got mine in 1985 in Fairbanks, Alaska attending a 1 year night program for those with aviation experience and had permission slips from the FAA. At that time I had almost 10 years military aviation experience. Classes were 4 night a week for 4 hours a night, 6-10 pm. 2 nights a week in the class room and 2 nights a week in the shop hands on. Was also still in the military at the time then spent another 11 in to retire and finally use the A&P. Got to rebuild a radial engine and recover cloth covered wing in shop.
And when I’m flying over a glacier in Alaska looking down, I sure hope your torque wrench was correctly calibrated. LOL
wlkelley3 said:
Guess I should also caveat the quickie courses. To be eligible you have to have the permission slips to take the A&P test from the FAA and to get those you have to have >3 years documented experience working in aviation. Getting the powerplant can sometimes be difficult without going through a long school. There are usually 2 types a 5-day course which is >12 hours a day and 10-day which is 7-8 hours a day. You spend most of that time learning the answers to the written test and taking the written test. Then spend a few days on what to expect on the oral & practical test which you then have to schedule with a DME (Designated Mechanic Evaluator) which you have to pay separate from the school. These courses are designed for experienced aircraft mechanics (usually military) that want/need an A&P for work. Spent a year teaching this. Most fun job I've had but the pay sucked. Which is why I took a job at Army Aviation Command when offered.
https://nci.edu/ North Central Institute. Have both a 10 day (Part 65) for those that have permission slips in hand and a 2 year (part 147) for those that want to get into aviation.
If my understanding is correct, If I had the permission slip, I wouldn't need the quickie course? With the experience I have, I've not been interested in taking 2 years off work to go to school full time, in order to take a cut in pay to get a entry level position in a craft that requires the same skills I have been trained for. (while being told me training doesen't count)
I was told I'd have to do the same thing to go from being a very skilled mechanical guy, with a background in electronics, over to I&C; took me longer than two years, but I made it without having to take off work.
In reply to pkingham (Forum Supporter) :
I picked up an Icon this spring, and for the few times I've needed it it's worked well. While I've not needed to torque anything CCW nor even checked the tolerance difference, I will say that the calibration certificate with mine was way closer than the specs online. I don't remember the exact specs, but they were a closer tolerance than the published specs for the SnapOn built SK(?) ones.
I don't really think the price is a huge difference, but in my profession as an aircraft mechanic and also as an FAA Inspection Authorized A&P mechanic, they are required to be calibrated each and every year. I have had both expensive and cheaper torque wrenches over the years (52 years as a licensed mechanic) and yes, some are more accurate than others but if they meet FAA standards, and are used properly, which is an important issue, then I would use them. On Aircraft, that is. On an automobile, I would very much recommend using one that is calibrated. The main difference I find is that on an aircraft, you can't just pull over to the side of the cloud should something go wrong...
I change a lot of tires. This is what I've used for four decades. Finally gave up the ghost.
I bought a modern equivalent for my engine assembly tasks but for wheels, have instead started using a HF clicker for awhile. I did compare it against the beam and it seemed to produce the same output...at least in the range I am using.
Some food for thought regarding not needing to by the most expensive one:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ck_O5U1Tyz8
Use a Digital Luggage Scale to check your torque wrench. Clamp extension in bench vise, set torque value & pull the scale. If the wrench is off reset the torque & retest.
