How much truck do I need?

I have a 2000 Silverado with a 4.8 and a five speed.  I have pulled a 32 foot enclosed trailer with a super late model and stuff in it, from one side of town to the other.  I would not go out on the highway with it.  It will tow an open trailer with a Neon on it anywhere, anytime.

I won't suffer the aggravation of a huge truck for the four times a year I use it for towing, but I would be a bit nervous using an S sized truck.  Dakota is the answer, probably.

My KJ with the V6 with tow package was rated 5000 lbs.   I towed 4K with aplomb .

 Some pretty good hills in Pa.    One point, I never tried to hustle it.   Right lane all the way.

iceracer said:   ...One point, I never tried to hustle it.   Right lane all the way.

This is a very important thing to keep in mind when people are talking trucks and towing.  If you're towing in the northeast where speed limits are low and you're content with slowing down for hills then you'll be happy with a lighter, lower powered truck than if you're out in the Midwest and you want to tow from Dallas to High Plains in Colorado while maintaining the speed limit plus a little. 

Any full sized half ton truck of any brand will haul it's own weight around on a carefully loading car trailer with trailer brakes. A v8 and automatic will be easier to drive, but a manual will typically last longer as long as you don't ruin your clutch and a i/v6 might return better fuel economy during the 90% of the time you are empty. Stepping up to a bigger truck lets you get away with less careful loading, poor trailer brakes, hauling more junk, and driving less carefully.

With a smaller truck you have to play careful with everything: weight, speed, momentum. It's possible, but hard to recommend to someone who may or may not have the skill set.

I'd also recommend a minimum 1/2 ton truck. 

Personally, I just about refuse to tow a car with anything less than a 3/4 ton. 

And I flat refuse to tow a car with anything less than a 1/2 ton. 

IMO the smaller trucks are not safe to drive in traffic towing more than about 3000#.

Keep in mind rated capacity includes gross trailer weight *and* anything in the vehicle itself, including occupants. 

Just tools, jack(s), stands, spare tires, and gas cans will probably put you over the limit with a car/trailer for a S10. 

A good friend of mine has towed lots of things with a 93 dakota ext cab with the 318/auto. Riding along to pick up my parts wagon. 2k lb trailer, 3500lb car he informed me that the brakes are way overworked and if anyone pulls out in front of us were going to die. I live in a flat place and daily drive a ranger, i wouldnt tow more then a go kart with it.

ebonyandivory said:

In reply to AClockworkGarage :

I had a few thoughts but realized I’m one of those pricks that drive a big, useless SUV so my opinions wouldn’t carry any weight.

At this point you don’t drive them so much as supply the northeast with 6.0 donors 

I've towed with a Chev Astro for the last twenty years. Open trailer, VW GTI and a Miata. Because the Astro has 250K on it I rented an F250 crew cab to tow down to the Challenge last fall. For local work the Astro is enough, but the rental truck was gross overkill, and completely effortless at 70-80 mph. Something the physical size as an Astro , but with more power and brakes would be ideal for my needs. 

I have a friend who towed a 1964 Ranchero from Michigan to the Gulf coast with his Tacoma. It's a V6 and manual transmission. He says it tows well.

I have previously towed a 79 Firebird from Indiana to Florida on a U-haul trailer behind an Olds Bravada with the 4.3/auto combo.  It was borderline sketchy/overloaded, and wouldn't do the speed limit well.  That being said, it was a one-time deal, and it wasn't too bad.  If that was a regular route, I'd step up to a 1/2 ton and a lighter trailer, minimum.

More recently, I used an '02 Suburban 5.3/auto/2wd to pull my '11 Mustang on a light 16' utility trailer, and that pulled that combo pretty well.  I went from Biloxi MS to NOLA MSP about once per month.  Only issue I had was that the 2wd had a tendency to get stuck in the pits at tracks if the pits were grass and there was moisture.

I ended up trading up to an '04 F250 crew cab/short bed V10/auto/4wd to solve the above problem.  It rode way worse empty, got terrible mileage, but never got stuck, and I really liked how it pulled.  Fast forward a bit, and I traded up to a 24' enclosed car hauler.  With the enclosed car trailer fully loaded, this truck got pushed around a bit too much for my liking.

Current tow pig is an 07 F350 crew cab/long bed diesel/auto/4wd/SRW and it rides like a Cadillac with the 24' trailer behind it.  Rides very well empty, and the mileage isn't abysmal. 

The planned tows for my current package are monthly 1.5 hrs plus at Interstate speeds, with said enclosed trailer.  A lot of folks are asking the trailer question, and I think that's the right question.  I only upgraded my tow rig to pull what I had comfortably, so I would guess with a light trailer, a V6 truck would be the bare minimum to even move the trailer.  The further and more frequent the tow is - that's the kicker.  If it's more frequent, or further away, I would lean towards a full size V8 1/2 ton for starters.  I would also avoid short wheelbase trucks, as you can get a pendulum interaction with bumper-tow trailers that can be very unsettling.

wearymicrobe said:

John Welsh said:

Tell us about your intended  trailer. 

Enclosed? Open? Aluminum? 

How long? 

How heavy? 

These are the real questions. Also how far and how often you tow the race car. I ended up getting a beat up but low mile F250XL. Its a regular cab so its easy to prk, it has the long bed so I can actually put real things in the bed. It was so cheap that I don;t care what it looks like cosmetically which is the most important thing to me. I have the V8 gasser and even I admit its a little underpowered for towing the race car with fuel and extra wheels and tires and tools. But at the end of the day it woks for 99% of what I need it to do and the last 1% I just drive slow. 

Truth.  If you're only ever towing it 5 miles to the local track you couuld do it with the Corolla.  (ok, not really)

If I were doing this, I would get a "real" 1/2 ton truck.  A V6 might do it if you're not doing hills, but a V8 would be better.

I snagged a cheap F150-7700 and it is just perfect for towing a car trailer.  A regular light-duty 1/2 ton would be fine as well.  Dakota wasn't much fun towing it.  I had an 02 Dakota with the V6 and there was a lot of tail wagging the dog.  I very much like overkill for towing.  90% of the time you would be fine, but that one panic stop or evasive lane change will kill you or someone else.  I'm guilty of it too... towing too much with too little, but overkill is your friend.

compact pickup is just not enough.  1/2 ton V8 is just right. HD 1/2 ton is better.  3/4 ton is really nice but if you're trying to go with minimum I would say 1/2 ton.

Edit... my trailer is an 18' steel/wood deck flatbed with ramps.

If you're stuck on getting a pick up, get a full sized. I've never found mid sized useful. Ever! If you're towing, a v-8 is better than a v-6 but the latest small engines are powerful. If you can get away with 2wd, stick with it. A lot less maintenance and better MPG. Also, I'd get, at least, a super cab. That extra room comes in handy.

FWIW, my tow pig is a 2003 F-250 Lariat 7.3 CC short bed 4x4, FX4. And, it is better than my 1500 suburban for towing in every way. 

My motto for comfy towing: wheelbase is king. I chuckle everytime I see a short SUV with a long car trailer overloaded or poorly loaded. You know its a white knuckle experience when the tail starts to wag the dog. I know that I'm more comfortable, and more relaxed towing with my small V8 crew cab short bed. Its more stable in crosswinds and more stable under emergency maneuvers and hard braking. I'd gladly DD that thing every single day. Sadly my wife says no. So I get a beat up Rio that gets 30mpg instead of the truck getting 18-20. Whatever keeps her happy and lets me do fun things. 

Curtis said:

Truth.  If you're only ever towing it 5 miles to the local track you couuld do it with the Corolla.  (ok, not really)

If I were doing this, I would get a "real" 1/2 ton truck.  A V6 might do it if you're not doing hills, but a V8 would be better.

I snagged a cheap F150-7700 and it is just perfect for towing a car trailer.  A regular light-duty 1/2 ton would be fine as well.  Dakota wasn't much fun towing it.  I had an 02 Dakota with the V6 and there was a lot of tail wagging the dog.  I very much like overkill for towing.  90% of the time you would be fine, but that one panic stop or evasive lane change will kill you or someone else.  I'm guilty of it too... towing too much with too little, but overkill is your friend.

compact pickup is just not enough.  1/2 ton V8 is just right. HD 1/2 ton is better.  3/4 ton is really nice but if you're trying to go with minimum I would say 1/2 ton.

Edit... my trailer is an 18' steel/wood deck flatbed with ramps.

I know Ford has continued to offer an HD 1/2 F150, usually denoted by the strange 7-lug wheels.  The 2015+ trucks have regular wheels, but the option still exists.  Do Chevy and Ram still offer an equivalent Heavy Half?  

I'll echo the same response that has been going around, the minimum to do the job should be a 1/2 ton truck.  I've been using my 6spd Frontier to pull about 5,000lbs of car and trailer, and while it does well on relatively flat ground I'm not comfortable with it in the hills.  I have upgraded the brake pads, took the time to find the right position for the car to get the right tongue weight, and have good trailer brakes.  I'll do 3+ hour trips at about 13-14mpg with small rolling hills.  To me the point of towing the car is to have less stress than driving to and from an event, make sure you have enough truck that can do the job comfortably.  

APEowner said:

iceracer said:   ...One point, I never tried to hustle it.   Right lane all the way.

This is a very important thing to keep in mind when people are talking trucks and towing.  If you're towing in the northeast where speed limits are low and you're content with slowing down for hills then you'll be happy with a lighter, lower powered truck than if you're out in the Midwest and you want to tow from Dallas to High Plains in Colorado while maintaining the speed limit plus a little. 

Yeah, the roads in the east and west are very different.  There was a comment in this thread about hills in Pennsylvania -- the highest point in PA (according to wikipedia) is at 3300 feet, and that's a mountain peak, not the height of the pass on the highway.  OTOH, taking the 5 between LA and the central valley one is faced with the Grapevine, a 4400 foot pass followed by another 30 miles of up and down.  I-70 in CO is like 11,000 feet, IIRC.  A 3/4 ton diesel with an open trailer can safely do 75-80 over these hills, whereas a compact or medium pickup is likely to slogging along at 30-35.

The 54 Willy's I use to tow the MG local is on a 94 S15 4.3l 4x4 4 speed chassis.  The wind resistance of the Willy's is a bit higher than a S15 but I live in flat land and the MG (1600lbs) on a 900lb open trailer with 2 sets of 15*9 rims and tools in the bed taps it out.  Id look bigger.    I'm not sure you have to go full-size though.   V8 explorers can handle what you want and they are not to big.  

AClockworkGarage said:

My ideal truck would be like a turn of the century 4.3 auto GMC sonoma extra cab a lot like this one. That is small enough that I coulld easily commute in it but would I be able to get away with occasionally towing with something like this? Do I need to move up into a full size?

 

No. You want a Colorado. 

Bobcougarzillameister said:

My motto for comfy towing: wheelbase is king. I chuckle everytime I see a short SUV with a long car trailer overloaded or poorly loaded. You know its a white knuckle experience when the tail starts to wag the dog. I know that I'm more comfortable, and more relaxed towing with my small V8 crew cab short bed. Its more stable in crosswinds and more stable under emergency maneuvers and hard braking. I'd gladly DD that thing every single day. Sadly my wife says no. So I get a beat up Rio that gets 30mpg instead of the truck getting 18-20. Whatever keeps her happy and lets me do fun things. 

Preach.  Wheelbase, tire stiffness, amount of rubber on the road (SRW vs DRW), vehicle weight, brakes, chassis and frame stiffness, and drivetrain abiility are all kings for towing.

I towed my previous 32' travel trailer with a 9600 gvw when I fulltimed in it, so it was consistently at (or a little above) GVWR.  I used a 95 powerstroke F250 single cab long bed with E-range tires.  By all accounts it should have been more than adequate, but on windy days I was wishing for either a dually to get more rubber on the road or a longer wheelbase to make the "dog" longer relative to the "tail."

If I were just towing it 200 miles a few times a year to go camping, it would have been great.  But towing 500 miles a day for weeks at a time it meant serious white knuckles every day and it took away some of the joy of the journey.

Truth is, the things that make a vehicle good for towing more weight make them crappy daily drivers; length, weight, width, spring rate, etc.

The best tow rig I ever had used a 342" wheelbase.  It was a Prevost H3-45 when I was driving an orchestra around on tour with a 30' box trailer full of instruments.  I couldn't ever tell the difference when the trailer was there or not.

Nitroracer said:

Curtis said:

Truth.  If you're only ever towing it 5 miles to the local track you couuld do it with the Corolla.  (ok, not really)

If I were doing this, I would get a "real" 1/2 ton truck.  A V6 might do it if you're not doing hills, but a V8 would be better.

I snagged a cheap F150-7700 and it is just perfect for towing a car trailer.  A regular light-duty 1/2 ton would be fine as well.  Dakota wasn't much fun towing it.  I had an 02 Dakota with the V6 and there was a lot of tail wagging the dog.  I very much like overkill for towing.  90% of the time you would be fine, but that one panic stop or evasive lane change will kill you or someone else.  I'm guilty of it too... towing too much with too little, but overkill is your friend.

compact pickup is just not enough.  1/2 ton V8 is just right. HD 1/2 ton is better.  3/4 ton is really nice but if you're trying to go with minimum I would say 1/2 ton.

Edit... my trailer is an 18' steel/wood deck flatbed with ramps.

I know Ford has continued to offer an HD 1/2 F150, usually denoted by the strange 7-lug wheels.  The 2015+ trucks have regular wheels, but the option still exists.  Do Chevy and Ram still offer an equivalent Heavy Half?  

Chevy offered an HD1500 for many years.  My BIL has one.  It was basically a 1500 body on a 2500 frame and chassis.  8-lug wheels, 4L80E trans, and a 6.0L LQ4 engine.  When you look underneath it, it is identical to my Dad's Duramax 2500, just minus the diesel/allison option.  They rated it with a GVW that was somewhere in between a 1/2 and a 3/4, but make no mistake... it was a 3/4.  So don't let the name confuse you.  Just because it was marketed as something in between, it will turn, ride, stop, and handle just like a 3/4 ton truck.

Much like the HD-F150 7700 (which was called an LD F250 for a few years).  In that case they took an F150 frame and boxed it, then stuffed in all F250 bits like springs, axles, transmission, brakes, etc.  In the Ford's case, it is mostly an F250 after the frame, unlike the GM's HD1500 which is a 2500 after the body.

I mostly mention that to bring focus to the fact that nomenclature has almost zero to do with anything.  That GM HD1500 is almost identical to the LD3500 that it replaced a few years prior. I have put all three beside each other:  My BIL's HD1500, Dad's 2500, and Dad's SRW3500.  Finding differences in the chassis is very difficult.  Having towed the same flatbed with all three, its also hard to find difference in their abilities.  The only real nod for the SRW3500 was that it was a crew cab long bed,  while the other two are crew cab short bed, so the SRW3500 had the wheelbase advantage.

My F150-7700 rides like a 3/4.  It has 3.73 gears so it gets MPGs like a 3/4.  It also tows and hauls much like a 3/4.  Just don't get caught up in the branding and marketing.  The things that make a truck good at towing are the things that make it bad as a DD.  When you're trying to choose a tow pig that doubles as something that doesn't suck to drive every day, it can get tough.  Fortunately, towing a flatbed car hauler isn't a huge stress.  Any full size truck that isn't short wheelbase (I would say reg cab long bed or ext cab short bed should do.. just not reg cab short bed) and that isn't old and clapped out should do the trick.  Most tow-folks also know that newer is better.  Frame stiffness and weight have both increased over the years.  I would rather tow 6000 with current-generation F150 V6 than I would a 1985 F350 with its flexy frame, drum rear brakes, and wheezer smog V8.

I'm not sure about Dodge's offerings.  I was never much of a fan so I never paid much attention to them.

I had a Dakota. I hated that truck. 

codrus said:

APEowner said:

iceracer said:   ...One point, I never tried to hustle it.   Right lane all the way.

This is a very important thing to keep in mind when people are talking trucks and towing.  If you're towing in the northeast where speed limits are low and you're content with slowing down for hills then you'll be happy with a lighter, lower powered truck than if you're out in the Midwest and you want to tow from Dallas to High Plains in Colorado while maintaining the speed limit plus a little. 

 

Yeah, the roads in the east and west are very different.  There was a comment in this thread about hills in Pennsylvania -- the highest point in PA (according to wikipedia) is at 3300 feet, and that's a mountain peak, not the height of the pass on the highway.  OTOH, taking the 5 between LA and the central valley one is faced with the Grapevine, a 4400 foot pass followed by another 30 miles of up and down.  I-70 in CO is like 11,000 feet, IIRC.  A 3/4 ton diesel with an open trailer can safely do 75-80 over these hills, whereas a compact or medium pickup is likely to slogging along at 30-35.

While I agree, there is a huge difference.  I lived in LA and towed over the grapevine many times.  I grew up in PA and I will take the grapevine any day of the week.  I recall seeing signs between Flagstaff and Phoenix.  Going down to Phx, there are all kinds of warning signs for the deadly 4% grade, runaway truck ramps, apocalypse will happen, everyone will die.  Going up to Flagstaff there are water refilling stations, slow trucks everywhere, and warning signs about the 4% grade.

Here in PA, you get two signs on these mountains:  "trucks use reduced gear" and "caution 9% grade."  It's not the elevation, its the slope.

I remember laughing when I drove tours in Lousiana (where, incidentally, the highest elevation is a bridge in New Orleans).  The dispatcher was so concerned when I took a charter to Branson MO.  He was convinced I would lose control and overheat the brakes in the mountains, and he specifically instructed me to let the transmission shift itself because it knows best.  BullE36 M3.  I passed every other one of our drivers going up those mountains because I had spent 6 years driving buses in PA.

My 26' box truck towing a trailer had a combined gross weight of 36,000 lbs with a 180hp Cummins.  With careful shifting, I was able to go from L.A. to Austin without ever dropping below 50.  In PA, that same rig couldn't muster 30 mph crossing the 2500-foot mountain to get to my parents' house.

SVreX said:

I had a Dakota. I hated that truck. 

Good lord, so did I.  I had one for two months and sold it.  It did nothing well.

This reminds me

I was just thinking. I know someone mentioned a wagon earlier, but a van could fit the bill as well, and often times sell a lot cheaper than the truck variants. Same frames, and power train options typically as the truck variants. At least on the American models.