Learn me Audi A4s

I've been cruising around looking for a new DD for some time now.

I don't have a big budget... looking for something comfortable, sporty, and reliable. I don't intend to track it- maybe an auto-x once in a while but mostly just commuting 80 miles a day to/from work plus weekend duties.

I've heard some horror stories about the A4 1.8T... and some good ones. Here is a quick rundown of one I found local-

I'm selling this car For financial reasons it just has to go 2000 audi A4 1.8T, black 5 speed manual, Short shift kit, 138,000 on body, 60,000 on motor (motor replaced due to oil sludge), Front mount intercooler, Awe cool air intake, Apr 93 octane software, Awe/eurosport silicone boost tubes, Boost gauge, Carbon fiber hood, 3 different grills, 15' steel wheels and 16' a4 alloys, 30% tint all around, 5000 mile old bilstein shocks and springs , Lowered 2.5 in front 3 in rear, Full awe exhaust, Test pipe and test pipe software

I've negotiated him down to $4200... hoping for $4000. He listed it at $4700. Only cosmetic flaw is a crack in front bumper.

What do you guys think- it would fit my needs for a sporty DD plus he claims hes getting 24mpg city/28-30mpg highway.

What can I look for to avoid a headache? I know the t-belt and water pumps need to be replaced at 100k I think... I can do that at my shop when the time comes. I'm fairly mechanical or know people who are to fix just about anything.

An early 2000s VAG product? -shudder

The finicial reasons the owner refers to are probably from constantly having the car at the shop trying to find out why the CEL is on.

I'd say that it sounds fun. But I'd do a lot of investigation on the ins and outs of it first. My 2000 A6 was just starting to act up and all of the online talk scared me away from the impending doom of replacing everything. What with all the front end links and the electronics and the power windows with a mind of their own. I got rid of it in 2009 after 1 year.

the 2001's started coming with wideband. Unfortunately, yours has a narrowband on it.

I would flash it to Revo () for better adjustability...

working at a shop, I can pull CELs lights and that type of stuff- I'm just looking reliability long term. I drive all over the state for my job and don't want to be stuck somewhere.

I have heard of the electronic issues they have though....

Hows tuning these things- easy to get it up to 200hp? Again, i'm looking for reliability- the mods above I doubt it will have a serious bump over the stock power level.

I'll have to snoop around online to find out what the problems and symptoms are of these cars. The horror stories do worry me.... but, my 228,000 miles Ford Probe GT is starting to worry me too.

I have a new AEM wideband sitting at home... any way to use that to help? haha

There is no sharing of the wideband signal, so the AEM Wideband wont work. There are threads on Vortex about converting from Narrow to Wide.

Tuning to get to 200hp is pretty basic. All you would really need is a downpipe with a highflow/test pipe and some Stage 2 Tuning. No Injectors needed, no internals needed. That will get you very close to the 200hp mark.

With APR, their 93 Octane Program is only 93 octane that they have developed one boost map around. With our programming, it is Boost and Timing adjustable, meaning you have up to 9 different Boost Maps to choose between and 9 different Timing Maps. Timing is basically octane, so if you are running 93, you can set to Timing - 4, or log some runs with VAG-COM and adjust accordingly.

They're good cars. Check the normal wear items as well as the control arms. If they're squeeking, they need to be replaced. Timing belts every 60k miles, etc.

Put 95k trouble free miles on one and another 50k trouble free miles on another. My Dad put 140k miles on his with just normal maintenance.

My friends mom had one, and she was driving in a straight line at about 70 mph (dry pavement, no debris, etc) and the car suddenly exited the freeway backwards though a fence. A witness saw the wheels lock up unevenly, but other than that there were no apparent problems. Ever since then they have scared me a bit. I honestly have heard nothing good about them.

RUN AWAY!!!!

I'm seeing the reason for the engine replacement- the oil sludge. I wonder what's to prevent it from happening on the replacement engine as well.

more frequent oil changes. ^^^^

on the subject of being somewhere and getting stuck. what state? cause I work at a NAPA parts store in Nebraska, & we don't exactly stock a lot of Audi parts.

My P71 on the other hand.....

For some reason, people associate the 90's VW/Audi products with the new millennium ones... which is plain stupid.

There is nothing wrong with a 1.8T A4. The biggest issue is the kazillion ball joints in the front suspension... but you can get a whole front end rebuild kit off ebay for ~$300, and it's nothing a GRM'er can't handle. Otherwise, besides the odd electrical glitch (window switches and door locks for the most part), they are super reliable motors, make good power with all the usual bolt ons (I prefer unitronic, a Canadian company for tuning) and away you go.

They also ride and handle AMAZINGLY compared to a Subaru (imo).

Because the 90's ones were poo, too. New Beetle anyone?

VW hasn't been decent since the late 80's/very, very early 90's. A 2000MY is smack-dab in the middle of their POS stage (which is still ongoing).

Pennsylvania- long trips on the turnpike from Philly to Pittsburgh and in between.

From what I'm finding, if you don't follow the 7,500 mile semi synthetic oil change rules and go with a 5,000 or less full synthetic oil change rule, you can prevent the sludge build up.

I'm a firm believer in preventative maintenance.

For all those crazy front end components, I talked to the local tech I had working on my 2000 A6 (basically the same front suspension as the A4) and he said there was a fairly complex way of installing the parts. Certain preloading and torque specs to follow or the parts had a tendency to fail quickly. He may have been blowing smoke, but he was shooting straight on everything I was reading about the cars up until that point.

I loved my car when I had it, but I dont really miss it. It felt a little like Russian Roulette by the time I got rid of it. The bi-turbo 2.7 was sweet though...

And the windows, I was driving and they would go down on their own and then not want to go up. Pretty sweet living in a state that has only 3 months of spring/fall weather and 9 months of winter.

you blow a plastic coolant elbow off and you're still up e36 m3 creek

I know a ton of people who had A4's. I've had 3 Audis and 8 VWs, including a B5 Passat which is super close to being an A4.

NEVER AGAIN. I can sympathize with the feeling like you're driving around in a time bomb. If you aren't doing all your own repairs, you'll easily have $2K in the first few months just on stupid E36 M3. If you're doing your own repairs, expect dozens of hours spent berkeleying around with stuff that wasn't designed to be serviced by a human.

These are not good cars. Period. I might consider an Audi 90 20v coupe some day, but no way in a million years would I buy an A4. No one I know had good experiences with an A4. They drive great at 8/10ths, but that is all they have to offer.

If you want a 1990's German sedan that is only slightly more trouble than more sensible vehicles, get a BMW, preemptively replace the entire cooling system and control arms, and be done with it. Simpler, better built, similarly priced (maybe cheaper) parts and good design for the shade tree mechanic. Oh yeah, and they don't understeer like pigs. This is where you'll wind up eventually anyway, and there are tons of 3 and 5-series cars out there for $4K. DO IT.

ppddppdd wrote: These are not good cars. Period. I might consider an Audi 90 20v coupe some day, but no way in a million years would I buy an A4. No one I know had good experiences with an A4. They drive great at 8/10ths, but that is all they have to offer. If you want a 1990's German sedan that is only slightly more trouble than more sensible vehicles, get a BMW, preemptively replace the entire cooling system and control arms, and be done with it. Simpler, better built, similarly priced (maybe cheaper) parts and good design for the shade tree mechanic. Oh yeah, and they don't understeer like pigs. This is where you'll wind up eventually anyway, and there are tons of 3 and 5-series cars out there for $4K. DO IT.

i don't know how anyone could have said that better

I do all my own work and the VW engines just scare me ha ha I don't mind spending hours fixing stuff as I have other toys I can run to work in, but I figure if I am worried now, I'll be worried while driving it all the time.

I do like BMWs... I don't know if I can find a similar year 3 series with lower miles for $4k though.... I'll look.

The 60k on the Audi's engine is what tempting for me.

Thanks for the input!

We got rid of our A4 around seven years ago. With the healing passage of time, I'm now only irritated with it.

Run away.

VAG died to me after 92.

I've been daily driving an 85 Scirocco for 4 years now. It has manual windows (the regulators still suck BTW), manual steering, no A/C, and no sunroof. It runs like a champ.

I have two more Sciroccos waiting in the wings since I'm in Michigan and, even with frequent washing, winters up here dissolve anything that's not galvanized.

RossD wrote: For all those crazy front end components, I talked to the local tech I had working on my 2000 A6 (basically the same front suspension as the A4) and he said there was a fairly complex way of installing the parts. Certain preloading and torque specs to follow or the parts had a tendency to fail quickly. He may have been blowing smoke, but he was shooting straight on everything I was reading about the cars up until that point. I loved my car when I had it, but I dont really miss it. It felt a little like Russian Roulette by the time I got rid of it. The bi-turbo 2.7 was sweet though... And the windows, I was driving and they would go down on their own and then not want to go up. Pretty sweet living in a state that has only 3 months of spring/fall weather and 9 months of winter.

You have to attach all the control arms but not snug them up, then lower the vehicle to the ground and tighten them up in their normal driving position. Try doing that! In a number of cases we are talking 18mm heads and you are trying to torque them while the car is on your chest. Your best bet is a set of ramps, so that you can still get under the car with the weight on them.

Having said that - I owned a 99 Passat - emphasis on the past tense. The engines are relaible in stock form and the rest of the drivetrain is good. I never went more than 6000 miles on an oil change and always full synthetic.

As others have said - RUN AWAY - using reliable and a B5 VW/Audi product in the same sentence should not even be done! When I sold mine the following items were not working:

• Power Mirrors
• Interior lights
• Gas Flap Opener

Slowly but surely everything connected to the Body Control Computer was failing. That is due to the screwed up wiring locations under the drivers feet.

The person that bought the car from me tried to re-sell it within 5 months.

Ninja Edit - BTW I sold my Passat for $1800 - $4K for a 2000 I think is ridiculous - all those mods will just lead to less reliability.

knb13 wrote: From what I'm finding, if you don't follow the 7,500 mile semi synthetic oil change rules and go with a 5,000 or less full synthetic oil change rule, you can prevent the sludge build up.

THIS.

Modern VAG cars do not seem to tolerate crappy oil at all. A full sythetic of decent quality (with a proper VAG rating) is required. For the first few years I owned my TDI, I could only buy oil at the local dealer. Fortunately, it's now more common. I'm currently running Mobil 1 0-w40 Euro Formula or Castrol Syntec 5-w40. Fortunately, a TDI runs a bit cooler than the gas cars and has been ok with a 10K mile OCI (factory spec). Some of the oil nuts on tdiclub have gone even farther between changes, but they test the oil for impruities at regular intervals.

I occasionally miss the '98 A4 Avant 2.8Q I owned for a few months. Really nice car. Unfortunately, the 24 mpg (driving it like a granny) was not working for me.

Having owned a '03 TDI since new for over 256K miles, it seems any VAG car can be hit or miss. Sometimes you get a good one... sometimes not. The folks who have had bad experiences tend to be very vocal about it... It seems to me, maintenence is key. They don't suffer American appliance treatment well.

RossD wrote: For all those crazy front end components, I talked to the local tech I had working on my 2000 A6 (basically the same front suspension as the A4) and he said there was a fairly complex way of installing the parts. Certain preloading and torque specs to follow or the parts had a tendency to fail quickly. He may have been blowing smoke, but he was shooting straight on everything I was reading about the cars up until that point.

This seems to be true. Replacing the front wheel bearings requires a bit of an odd torquing process. That said, I replaced the bearings on my Mk IV 82K miles ago (@ 174K) and they've been fine so far. I expected them to need replacing often, so I bought a OTC Hub Tamer kit to make the job easier (seemed to work).

Friend put 160k trouble free miles on his A4. We put 95k trouble free miles on our B5.5 Passat (A4), I put 50k trouble free miles on my A4. My Dad put 130k trouble free miles on his A4. My Mom has 80k trouble free miles on hers.

They need synthetic oil and OEM oil filters (Mann or Mahle) every 5000 miles. The engines will run forever if you do that.

Where you run into problems is if you pick one of these up used that's been neglected. Otherwise they're solid, reliable cars.