NASA Rallysprint thoughts?

Anybody else been looking into NASA Rallysprint?  I've considered rally in the past, but there are too many things keeping me from being willing to commit to it fully (money and time being big factors).  Rallysprint seems to solve a lot of those issues, with lower entry fees and single day events.  Not requiring a codriver also helps, in case logistics prevent me from finding one.  And finally, running over the same stages multiple times in the event, instead of several different ones seems like a good idea for a novice like me - I could take it easier the first go around, then build up speed as my confidence in the course increases.

My biggest concern would be going to the effort to prep or buy a logbooked rally car, and then have the series be canceled.  The first event of the season had 9 entries, the upcoming event has only 9 entries as of this writing, and the third event is going head to head against SOFR.  I remember SCCA tried to do something similar a few years ago, although they had some middle ground on car prep (that I thought might actually hurt them), and I think it died off after only one season.  It'd be nice to have an idea how well attended the events have to be for NASA to continue doing them.

This seems like such a good idea for people wanting to dip their toes in, buy an older rally car, and give it a shot, without having to commit as many resources if you want to run more than one event a year.

 Unfortunately in this country, rally has never really taken off. So, if on the professional levels they can’t get a good crowd and television time, Then how on earth will a grassroots level ever succeed in this aspect? 

As far as participants go, it simply needs to be a cheaper and simpler option. I mean, why would I go through all the hassle of getting a log book car if I can simply go grab a piece of crap from craigslist and run it in lemons?

I'm not sure if the series will last, but we hosted one of the SCCA events in Austin and have since done a couple more under different sanctioning. I like the format a lot. Logistically things are much more compact and easy to deal with. Stages are still fast enough to scare the poop out of you (which is why I didn't necessarily like the SCCA limited prep stuff but tha't's another discussion) and you get a chance to meet others in the community and form the networks that support rally in the US. We'll continue to do them as long as they're around in Texas as we really enjoy them. We've tended to do a Saturday/Sunday event and hold a rallycross on the Sunday. This allows for mixing of the groups and since it works on our site it's a better $ use of the site for the weekend. 

There are certainly events like Eastern Tenn and Hyperfest that not having a co-driver won't be too big of a deal. The BRS sprint you would probably want a co-driver. NASA does offer a co-driver dating service although I not sure if anyone uses it (I just don't know).

9 entries isn't that great but if the event runs I'm sure you will have fun regardless of the number of cars.

I’m sure it’ll be fun, though I’m not really in a place to go for it this year, but if it’s still around after this season, I could spend next winter converting my rallycross car into a stage rally car, or could sell it and go shopping for a preexisting rally car.  I know if it goes away, I can still rallycross the car, but I will have changed it from driving to events to being towed without any real gain.

In reply to mazdeuce - Seth :

Who’s sanctioning your events?  I’m curious to know if they are running any of them in the Midwest or Great Lakes area.

I think its a great idea for exactly what you want to do, it is also beneficial for the other side for people who are developing a car and want to shake it down because after travel expenses, entry fees, food you can easily spend 2000 in a weekend doing a 2 day rally + recce for a rally america event so it sucks to take that time off and get all the way there  only break down on stage 1 or 2 its heart breaking...

Also a lot of shakedowns you can do the street are often illegal (if you're really giving it the beans) dangerous and/or doesn't generalize well to stage use. Not many of us have private land to do so and there may not be enough seat time or high speed use in a given rallyX week to ideally show the weak links so having an extended testing ability would be nice.

NASA is pretty good about keeping things going and adding events. Anders is VERY active on that front. I've done a few NRS rallysprints (two in New Jersey, which no longer exist because the property was sold), as well as several regular NASA rallies. Most NASA rallies are also 1-day events with no recce so really not that different from the rallysprints, and less expensive than a 2-day+recce (like STPR, which really gets pricey I can tell you) just more miles and you need a co-driver. Frankly I would never want to do any "through the woods" rallying without a codriver. There are a LOT of experienced codrivers out there that are always willing to jump on with a driver who has an empty seat. Most will pay their own way there, split lodging, etc. Just don't charge them part of the entry (at least, I don't). But you can work out different deals depending on if its' someone really experienced who will TEACH you, or a newbie who will be learinng. 

Build the car to stage rally spec, and you'll find that you will want to do real rally as well as rallysprint. SCCA also has rallysprints (which require a logbooked car) - we have run the Wellsboro winter rallysprint 3 years in a row now. So you can cross over organizations to find events near you. You can still rallycross the car as well.  But SCCA still does rallysprints - there were at least 2 of them last month here on the east coast (PA and NH, as I recall). Turnout varies based on proximity to other rallies and weather (the winter rally this year was low due to no snow but lots of mud and ice), but who cares? It costs you the same whether 5 or 50 people show up....unless you just care about "the scene" more than the driving.

Also to put it in context - the WM Winter RallySprint in PA has been an SCCA event for 3 years. But for years before that it was a Rally America event with pretty much the exact same format, stages,etc. It's not some glorified rallycross, it's an actual stage rally that just uses the same stage 3 times in both directions. It's the first and second stages of STPR, basically. Still 40-50 miles of stage, and entry for SCCA events is subsidized by "big SCCA" so cheap (like $300). The SCCA rallysprint up in NH last month had like 40 entries, lots of serious stage cars, in the snow and ice.

Building on what Kevin said, though....my stage car (which has now completed 7 or 8 stage rallies/rallysprints without breaking) is barely more than a rallycross car with a cage. I don't have fancy suspension (just Bilstein HDs), just additional underbody protection and safety gear. You don't need to spend $5k on shocks to go rally - you just need to know when to not go HUGE over jumps and stuff that can break the car. 

In reply to Trackmouse :

If you do a stage rally, you will not want to do it with some POS LeMons car with a sketchy cage. The danger in LeMons is mostly body damage to the car. The danger in stage is rolling a car 10 times down a hill while hitting trees that don't move. That's why stage cages are much more heavily built than road-racing cages, especially some of the stuff I've seen in LeMons, which is pretty questionable safety-wise. We do stage as well as Chump/Lemons. Two totally different animals, and you can't really compare them at all - either in cost or driving.

That said, an old Mercedes, a veteran of many LeMons races, modified its cage and gear to fit stage rules and competed in Sandblast Rally last month. It was slow as hell, but finished. So you can do it on the ultra-cheap. Logbooks dont' cost you anything, they just certify that you actually have a safe cage and not some E36 M3 built of PVC lol.....And if you rally, you WANT a safe cage. 

Also once a car is logbooked, its resale value probably doubles. Nobody is going to buy your non-logbooked POS car. But soemone will always buy your logbooked POS rally car..

HFmaxi said:

There are certainly events like Eastern Tenn and Hyperfest that not having a co-driver won't be too big of a deal. The BRS sprint you would probably want a co-driver. NASA does offer a co-driver dating service although I not sure if anyone uses it (I just don't know).

9 entries isn't that great but if the event runs I'm sure you will have fun regardless of the number of cars.

^^ This guy has an affordable, well-built 2WD stage rally car for sale , I hear ;)

In reply to irish44j :

Is there any centralized schedule of SCCA Rallysprints?  I went looking on the SCCA site and motorsportreg and came up empty.  Checked google, too, but didn’t find anything other than the page for the WM event.

I really don't know, to be honest. I usually hear about them in the north american rally facebook group. SCCA sucks at publicizing anything that isn't Solo or road racing....

I think most sanctioning bodies will keep running rallysprint, even if it operates at a slight loss. They are doing that to feed the regional and national rally series.

Up here our Rallycross series routinely sells out (50-60 cars), Regional rally is struggling and so is National. The hope is to convert some of the Rallycross folks into Rallysprint and then on to Regional and National events.

The event we had last summer only got 5 cars at $200 each but still made a little bit of money. The plus side is that the  event insurance for Rallysprint is cheap.

For me - my rally car is not licensed or insured yet, so Rallycross or Rallysprints are my only choice.

In reply to eastsideTim :

I know Dave was talking to Anders, but in the end I'm not 100% sure who got the check. I was out of town for the organization of the last one. 

As far as road legal and insured, that's a HUGE bonus to rallysprint. The car we use currently was bought for cheap because the title was lost several owners back. The car lives at Rally Ready and runs events at Rally Ready and that saves the owner a TON on registration, insurance, and trailering.