Need this here......... 54k euro fine for 63 in a 50

https://autos.yahoo.com/blogs/motoramic/finland-fined-this-driver--60-000-for-going-14mph-over-the-limit-225247649.html

Wonder how much Paul Allen's fine might have been???

Sorry, that's just nuts! I don't care what that guy's income was! I don't blame him if he moves, I would.

Let the Chauffer drive!

We need something similar not just for speeding though...for everything

Yeah...let's punish all those rich shiny happy people that create jobs and pay the vast majority of the tax base. That'll teach them.

This is not going to end well.

They should scale fines based on income. I had a neighbor who his wife and son died in an accident because some shiny happy person ferrari driver (who survived) felt the need to drive 130mph everywhere, had MANY MANY past tickets yet no suspended license because he's able to bribe people and $130 is like the price of bread for him.

Then you have these people living paycheck to paycheck getting warrants and jail time on them because they are so poor they can't budget a $130 fine and should be given some community service instead.

Yeah...let's punish all those rich shiny happy people that break the law

ftfu. $130 fine for someone of that income is not a punishment. $60k actually is.

This is not going to end well.

Why? Fines based on scale of income is common practice.

http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2005-10-13/news/0510130114_1_speed-limit-driver-s-license-supervision

Fine them appropriately please.

The guy i'm talking about was fined 42 times prior to his crash. Did he care about the fines? No. Did he kill 2 people? Yes. He would have stopped by the first couple of times if he was fined like this.

What about people that live WAY below their income? You know, the millionaires driving pickup trucks. What about them? Should they get a fine 3X the cost of the vehicle they were driving?

unevolved wrote: What about people that live WAY below their income? You know, the millionaires driving pickup trucks. What about them? Should they get a fine 3X the cost of the vehicle they were driving?

It's based on income, not the car. He can still drive 100+mph in a pickup truck and get fined 42 times with $130 nickle and dimes and then kill people.

On a $20,000 income a $130 fine for that person is a ton of money. For someone with a $500k income it is not, they will keep doing it because it's like a toll for them to drive how they want and then kill peoples wife and children.

unevolved wrote: What about people that live WAY below their income? You know, the millionaires driving pickup trucks. What about them? Should they get a fine 3X the cost of the vehicle they were driving?

Why not? The fact that their vehicle of choice is cheap is irrelevant- the idea of the punishment is to make the person feel it. $100 to a person making $10k vs. $100k vs. $1000k are totally different- one end it's really really hard, middle is nominal, top is eh...

So there's more incentive for the poor person to not break the law, and not much insentive for the rich person to not break the law? How does that make things better?

I think income-based speeding tickets are smart. As I've said before, if I was making 6+ digits and only facing 3/4 digit fines for speeding, I'd tell the cops to charge it to my credit card and go to town. If the car has carbon brakes it probably burns up more money every time it comes down from highway speeds, so why not?

This doesn't break the record for the biggest ticket BTW:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/1759791.stm

Wow, some of you guys think WAY differently than I do.

The guy in this story was making over $7m per year. That's 3-7 median American lifetime incomes...per year.

To put this in perspective, if you make $50k per year that's like a $400 fine. A good bit but not going to kill you (even though you spend at least 1/3 of that money on basic survival stuff, rather than it being virtually all disposable income as it would be if you made $7m.)

On the other hand, let's say he got a $1k fine and makes $7m per year. That's the equivalent of a $7 fine to the guy who makes $50k. That could easily go unnoticed. That's not a slap on the wrist, that's a fly landing on the wrist.

GameboyRMH wrote: The guy in this story was making over $7m per year. That's 3-7 median American lifetime incomes...*per year.* To put this in perspective, if you make $50k per year that's like a $400 fine. A good bit but not going to kill you (even though you spend at least 1/3 of that money on basic survival stuff, rather than it being virtually all disposable income as it would be if you made $7m.) On the other hand, let's say he got a $1k fine and makes $7m per year. That's the equivalent of a $7 fine to the guy who makes $50k. That could easily go unnoticed. That's not a slap on the wrist, that's a fly landing on the wrist.

I don't care. Not at all.

So when the fast-food worker runs over the millionaires' au pair and family and wipes them out, they'll get a wage-adjusted $50 fine and send them on their way?

This right here people....this is the same thought process that leads to mandatory auto-drive cars.

Sure, a $130 fine sucks more if you're poor, but last I checked everyone has the same amount of points on their license.

I'm glad that guy can afford his Konisseehehehehgegegeggegggg and we don't all wait in the same line to ride the same beige mass transit every day.

Smells like big government with a heaping side of envy.

This all is assuming that somehow "he deserved it."

I don't know about you guys, but I've gotten a ticket a while ago that was barely above entrapment from a legal perspective. I can't imagine how bad it would be if small towns could scale tickets to income. You wouldn't be able to drive across Texas in a nice car without getting half a dozen tickets while watching guys in beaters fly by that wouldn't be worth it to stop.

I've got a good friend fighting an obviously corrupt small town for a ticket where they "lost" the paperwork from several years ago, issues a FtA warrant, and now he owes almost $1k.

Tyler H wrote: So when the fast-food worker runs over the millionaires' au pair and family and wipes them out, they'll get a wage-adjusted $50 fine and send them on their way?

No it should be a hefty punishment, that's the point. If lightening a punishment for a poor person is bad, isn't allowing a punishment to be unnoticeable to a rich person also bad?

Another point to consider... So what if you're putting away the large majority of your income towards savings, crippling student debt, or God forbid, massive medical bills? It's not unheard of to have people making 6 figures, and not actually see half of it. How would you calculate the ticket then? Off of what they're paid? Or what they'd feel?

You guys are retarded. Traffic fines based on income? Really? You want to empower the police tax man to rob you based on a percentage of your income as punishment for a summary offense with no limit on how much it can be? Let's put our thinking caps on and compare that to what happened with civil forfeiture. Yeah... no thanks.

A night in jail is punishment that everyone can afford. Lets just jail everyone who speeds. Easy-peasy. Or... you want them to "feel" it? Singapore will cane you. How 'bout a few lashes? One for every tick over the nut?

Datsun1500 wrote:

GameboyRMH wrote: I think income-based speeding tickets are smart. As I've said before, if I was making 6+ digits and only facing 3/4 digit fines for speeding, I'd tell the cops to charge it to my credit card and go to town.

So having money would change who you are? I can afford a large speeding ticket, so I guess I'll start diving like an ass now just to keep up the status quo. I'll make you a deal. I'll pay your next ticket, will you start sending me videos of you speeding everywhere you go, just because you can?

I'm probably not a good example because the speed limits are extremely low by me and the cops are generally easy to spot well ahead of time...I'm sure I'm already speeding nearly all the time when low traffic permits, unless I'm driving the Samurai. If I lived in some place with more reasonable limits and sneakier cops I surely wouldn't be speeding so much.

Also I'd have to go to court for speeding tickets here, you get banned from driving for life if you get caught over 160kph, and I'd hate to see the cops reaction when they pull me over with the GoPro running

But yes money certainly could change my behavior - although speeding with gay abandon is probably the only way it would make me more dickish

GameboyRMH wrote:

Tyler H wrote: So when the fast-food worker runs over the millionaires' au pair and family and wipes them out, they'll get a wage-adjusted $50 fine and send them on their way?

No it should be a hefty punishment, that's the point. If lightening a punishment for a poor person is bad, isn't allowing a punishment to be unnoticeable to a rich person also bad?

Rich is a relative term. I know a lot of people I consider to be rich and they didn't get that way by laughing off $130 fines.

People are people. I'm sure the government found a more self-righteous way to spend that $50k they got for a daggum minor moving violation.

As was posted above, this thread won't end well.

I just want to underscore that there is a large overlap in the thought processes of hyper-socialists and those who don't really appreciate the sportycars that we all love.

Lining up to forfeit civil liberties and hand the government more money all in the name of 'making it sting' for the rich guy....whew.

Where am I again? Time to pack it up and head over to the CM forum, I guess.

unevolved wrote: Another point to consider... So what if you're putting away the large majority of your income towards savings, crippling student debt, or God forbid, massive medical bills? It's not unheard of to have people making 6 figures, and not actually see half of it. How would you calculate the ticket then? Off of what they're paid? Or what they'd feel?

What they're paid, it hits everyone equally regardless of fiscal responsibility that way. There's no way to cheat this system or make it more unjust than a fixed fine in any situation, the Scandinavians have thought it through well.

I would think that the intent of sliding fines is to get everyone's attention equally when they get caught. If that was the intent then it worked. This guy is really upset by his fine, just as my son was the last time he got nailed for $176, which was about 3 days gross income for him at the time.

I hate the "punish the rich" mentality. I'm disappointed to see it here.

Scale tickets to income? No. Never. Bad idea.

I have a friend who isn't rich by any means but is better off than me. He doesn't care about speed laws. He feels he's above them. I've heard him say it.

We pay the same amount in fines if caught. $200 in fines would slow me down. I promise you a $2,000 fine would do the same for him.

Take from that what you will.