Why can't I find a replacement for my Mazdaspeed3

CyberEric said:

To me, what really interests me about the Focus St is the price, they are an incredible bargain at what, less than 20k out the door. I mean, that's just crazy. You have to spend a LOT more to get a GTI or Veloster or WRX. Oh, and the fact that they are competitive in their autocross class despite their shortcomings is another selling point. It's a good chassis, even in non-ST guise. The biggest knock to me is that it feels cramped, and doesn't have a real diff.

Not that I'm in the market, but just out of curiosity is that 20,000 out the door because they are discontinuing it and dealers are just trying to unload them? 

I still don't understand why Ford did not put a real diff in them. my favorite things to do in the GTI are any kind of driving that involves me getting the LSD involved lol. With an open diff I think I would probably not like this car at all. 

Same reason I never really considered the Elantra GT, which has a lot going for it including price. But no lsd.

Considering what some people pay for tunes and tuning, an LSD doesn't seem to be in a whole other league of cost unless you're buying one that costs well over 1k to begin with. 

Vigo said:

Considering what some people pay for tunes and tuning, an LSD doesn't seem to be in a whole other league of cost unless you're buying one that costs well over 1k to begin with. 

IDk, for most mainstream turbo cars, you can usually pick up an Accessport used for a couple hundred bucks. I got mine for the WRX used off a forum for $250 or so, and 5 minutes after it arrived my car gained 25whp and 35wtq with zero other mods (yes, it was dyno'd just out of curiosity). Then I sold the Accesport 10 years later for exactly what I bought it for when I got rid of the car. Or you just get a Tactrix cable (or borrow one) and get an open-source tune for even cheaper (or free).  There's no need to get a dyno-tune if you're just doing an ECU flash for 20-40 extra horsepower with a reputable tune on cars that are widely tuned. 

Now, if you're doing some kind of full engine build with a bigger turbo, etc....yeah, then the tunes can get expensive, for sure. 

Other part with LSD of course is that you either have to install it or pay someone to do it. Either way, it's more expensive and a lot more work than simply plugging a cable into the OBD port and pressing a button. 

Guess it depends on what you consider "in the same league" lol. 
 

Plus, if you're gonna go to all the effort of installing an LSD, chances are you're gonna get a tune as well now that you can put down more power  The slippery slope.

irish44j said:

CyberEric said:

To me, what really interests me about the Focus St is the price, they are an incredible bargain at what, less than 20k out the door. I mean, that's just crazy. You have to spend a LOT more to get a GTI or Veloster or WRX. Oh, and the fact that they are competitive in their autocross class despite their shortcomings is another selling point. It's a good chassis, even in non-ST guise. The biggest knock to me is that it feels cramped, and doesn't have a real diff.

Not that I'm in the market, but just out of curiosity is that 20,000 out the door because they are discontinuing it and dealers are just trying to unload them? 

I still don't understand why Ford did not put a real diff in them. my favorite things to do in the GTI are any kind of driving that involves me getting the LSD involved lol. With an open diff I think I would probably not like this car at all. 

Same reason I never really considered the Elantra GT, which has a lot going for it including price. But no lsd.

 

They didn't put a real diff in the car because they didn't have to. With the stock E-diff the car doesn't torque steer badly and it's very well mannered on normal roads.... where most of the ST's will stay.....

The car works very well in autox all things considered.... is it perfect... no...

but I've got nearly 50k miles on my ST and while i'm looking at adding a mechanical LSD.... I've been doing alright without it... 

Multiple days of repeated use/abuse on the brakes on the PCA TT course at Mineral Wells and a couple sessions at MSRC. Not to mention more than 100 runs at various autocrosses in the past 16 months.. I've only replaced the air filter, plugs and done oil changes.. 

Right now I need new pads, new rotors and a full fluid flush... but the stock pads and rotors have soldiered on quite well given the abuse they've been through...

these cars are a riot... and besides being cheaply built.. they're awesome.. 

I had a buddy hook me up.. but i paid $20k+TT&L for my ST1... 

 

MTechnically said:

In reply to CrashDummy :

Did I miss something? What exactly is wrong with the current MS3? Maybe I've been dealing in old cars too long, but 160,000 miles doesn't sound like that much to me. Why not just keep it if you still like it as much as you clearly seem to? Wouldn't it be cool to see your MS3 hit 200, 300, or even 500k miles?

I get your point, but after a time a car is just old.  My C30 is now over 120K.  I"ve loved every mile over the last 11 years, but it's starting to feel old.  Creeks and rattles and it's just starting to get annoying with maintenance needing new front calipers and a half shaft in the next couple of weeks.  No problem now out of work, but keeping two older cars and three houses up to snuff takes time, and there comes a point where I just want my DD to go with no hassle.  Nothing wrong with keeping a car until 200-300K miles, but there's also nothing wrong with just wanting something newer and better after 10 plus years.

aircooled said:

The Focus ST is very close but has known issues, and is going away.  

Having worked at Ford until the end of last month I know lots of ST owners.  Non have had anything more than regular maintenance needed since new, some with well over 100K miles.  If you need to do the engine mount it's less than $100 and a couple of hours on the drive to replace it. 

MTechnically said:

Have you been in a Mazda after MY2013? All the cars with the Kodo design language have markedly improved interiors. I still think the MK7 GTI is a step ahead in terms of overall interior quality/design, but the newer Mazdas are nothing to scoff at.

I had a MK7 GTI SE for 2 years and I think you nailed it. Obviously we are talking about how the car feels to drive so in many ways that is subjective, but it did feel a bit artificial and disconnected. 

But the OP is looking for a hot hatch.  MS3 died in 13 so never got the better interior.

Adrian_Thompson said:

 

MTechnically said:

In reply to CrashDummy :

Did I miss something? What exactly is wrong with the current MS3? Maybe I've been dealing in old cars too long, but 160,000 miles doesn't sound like that much to me. Why not just keep it if you still like it as much as you clearly seem to? Wouldn't it be cool to see your MS3 hit 200, 300, or even 500k miles?

I get your point, but after a time a car is just old.  My C30 is now over 120K.  I"ve loved every mile over the last 11 years, but it's starting to feel old.  Creeks and rattles and it's just starting to get annoying with maintenance needing new front calipers and a half shaft in the next couple of weeks.  No problem now out of work, but keeping two older cars and three houses up to snuff takes time, and there comes a point where I just want my DD to go with no hassle.  Nothing wrong with keeping a car until 200-300K miles, but there's also nothing wrong with just wanting something newer and better after 10 plus years.

 

I totally understand wanting to move on from a car that is showing it's age and losing it's luster after 10 years of ownership. I had an '03 S2000 that I let go of after 6 years because it wasn't what I wanted anymore. But the OP started this all of saying the the MS3, "it might be the best car in the world". With no mention of mechanical failures, worn interior, or love loss I thought my response was perfectly reasonable.Ultimately, people can do whatever they want with their cars, but I thought I would voice an alternative opinion. 

Adrian_Thompson said:

 

MTechnically said:

In reply to CrashDummy :

Did I miss something? What exactly is wrong with the current MS3? Maybe I've been dealing in old cars too long, but 160,000 miles doesn't sound like that much to me. Why not just keep it if you still like it as much as you clearly seem to? Wouldn't it be cool to see your MS3 hit 200, 300, or even 500k miles?

I get your point, but after a time a car is just old.  My C30 is now over 120K.  I"ve loved every mile over the last 11 years, but it's starting to feel old.  Creeks and rattles and it's just starting to get annoying with maintenance needing new front calipers and a half shaft in the next couple of weeks.  No problem now out of work, but keeping two older cars and three houses up to snuff takes time, and there comes a point where I just want my DD to go with no hassle.  Nothing wrong with keeping a car until 200-300K miles, but there's also nothing wrong with just wanting something newer and better after 10 plus years.

 

Man, my Suzuki SX4 has just under 125k on the clock and it still feels really solid.  And this seems like it should be the norm, right?

In reply to pres589 (djronnebaum) :

Great, really happy for you, but that's the opposite to my experience with small Suzukis.  My mom and sister have had several Swifts and Igniss (what's the plural of Ignis?) over the years, remember they still live in the UK.  Everyone has felt beat to E36 M3 and full of squeaks and rattles by 50K.  My mom was just commenting the other week she wishes she could afford a solid car built to last like a Ford.  This is nt a bash at Suzuki, they are great fun, chuckable cars.  But refinement and longevity are not traits I associate with them.

Adrian_Thompson said:

she could afford a solid car built to last like a Ford. 

I know I'm an outlier, but the 3.7 Ford engine in my wife's car has me convinced never to buy another FWD Ford product again. When the water pump went at under 70k miles, it was easier to drop in a junkyard engine than to try to change the water pump. The engine I took out is still sitting in my garage, waiting to get melted down into aluminum ingots.

Anyhow, I was thinking about the OPs original question.

How much would it cost you to refurbish the car to feeling new again? I'm betting it will cost less money than buying any sort of newer car.

Well, im off to see how easy it is to put a fwd 3.7 into.. anything. 

I think with some different parts up front it is the same as the 3.7 in the Mustang.

Brett_Murphy said:I know I'm an outlier, but the 3.7 Ford engine in my wife's car has me convinced never to buy another FWD Ford product again. When the water pump went at under 70k miles, it was easier to drop in a junkyard engine than to try to change the water pump. The engine I took out is still sitting in my garage, waiting to get melted down into aluminum ingots.
 

Got it, understood, I owe no allegiance to Ford anymore, but I will council you.  The reason I pretty much ignore statistics and probability is that personal experience and those of friends and family can and often show the exact opposite.

Toyota's are meant to be slightly more reliable than gravity and the sun rise. My experience is the opposite.  I have bought one Toyota in my life and it was crap.  In four years and 100K miles I had the following issues:

• HEadlamps melted within three months with OEM stock bulbs.  They tried to claim we'd fitted higher output bulbs.  That was fun.  After SWMBO finished reaming them out we had free oil changes for life and red carpet treatment.
• Steering intermediate shaft failed.
• Brake master cyl leaked and needed replacement.
• Something else in the steering, I forget what.
• IP soft touch material peeled off
• Floor matts wore holes through within 10 months
• HEater control unit died meaning random full hot or full cold air would blow out at random intervals. Cost was over $1K for parts alone.
• Drive shaft (AWD) center bearing failed and every one I found in a junk yard was also in some stage if failure.
• Paint so thin it scratched and looked 10 years old in two
• Rear wheel bearing was on it's way out when I traded the POS in.

That list contains actual quality failures and poor quality materials.

VW Products on the other hand are known to expire 30 seconds after the warranty is over and will leave you stranded every five mins.  I know dozens of people with VW.  Some new, some over 20 years old.  Some bought new, some bought used.  Some serviced at home, some only go to VW dealers and some serviced at third part shops.  Not one of those, from 20 to over 120K miles of ownership, have had anything other than regular service (yes including control arms on B6 Chassis).  The biggest issue I know of is the gas gage doesn't work on my next door neighbors 04 R32.

So, other than Discovery 2's and Bi Turbo's I don't believe the 'this is the most reliable car since plate tectonics' or 'this is the worst car/manufacturer since the big bang'  There are very few E36 M3ty cars made in the last 20 years so I'm a firm believer in get you want and don't let past experience influence you as no matter what your experience or those of your friends someone, amke that many many someones will have had the oposit xperience good or bad.

In reply to Adrian_Thompson :

I have similar sentiments. You never know how people actually treat their stuff so calling it reliable or not is a false reality. The problems come when you’re chasing down a POs neglect. I never caught up on my E36. It never stranded me but there was always something on the list.

Bringing this back around with an example: my MS3 has 61k on it and has original rear shocks. The forums will tell you that they should be blown and done but they’re perfectly fine. 

OP: maybe just buy another lower mileage speed. I picked my 08.5 up a few years ago with 30k. 

I agree with you Adrian. I find that perception is at least half of reality with car "reliability."

Especially when the internet blows up with tales of unreliability that are possibly corners cases, not the rule.

That said, as much as I find the Alfa Guila QV intriguing, there's NO way I'd ever buy one.  Not with all the issues the long term cars that the magazines have had...

Adrian: We bought this car new, and it was religiously maintained. I'm of the opinion the water pump shouldn't have failed with under 70k miles. It seems I'm not alone. The sudden failure mode (no warning at all, not even some weeping) was also pretty awful.

Beyond the fault itself, the packaging of FWD cars poses challenges for the "hand tools in the driveway" kind of mechanic I am. I understand the realities of FWD car packaging. Picking a car with a larger V6 engine didn't help things. Having to remove the front K-Member and drop the engine out of the bottom in order to change a water pump seems excessive. Making it timing chain driven might have been a packaging driven decision, but greatly adds to the complexity. This is life now, pretty much, but that doesn't mean I have to like it.



It's pushed me away from doing jobs like this myself for the most part, simply because I lack the facilities and tools to do an engine removal from the bottom of the car quickly and safely.

 

The whole "GTI is too refined" vs the MS3 argument in this thread is funny to me.

Back about 7/8 years ago, I cross shopped a 1st gen MS3, an HHR SS and a Caliber SRT4 on the used market for my next vehicle, which was to replace an ION Redline. I can't remember why, but at the time I wanted nothing to do with a GTI, although I was pleasantly surprised when I was allowed to test drive a used example while waiting to sign the paperwork for the car I eventually purchased.

Although it seemed to be the best performer, I quickly wrote off the MS3 as "too refined" against the other two. The Caliber SRT4 was an absolutely ridiculous handful that I couldn't get enough of, and the HHR SS was somewhere in the middle while still feeling like a handful vs the MS3.

For the record, I ended up with a 2002 WRX Wagon for about 1/2-1/3 the price of the other three... 

CyberEric said:

I agree with you Adrian. I find that perception is at least half of reality with car "reliability."

Especially when the internet blows up with tales of unreliability that are possibly corners cases, not the rule.

WRX is a good example. According to the internet, every WRX will break its transmission and blow its head gasket. Meanwhile, pretty much nobody i know with a WRX has broken a transmission (CV axles on occasion for those who race them), and mine went 180k miles with no transmission or HG issues (tuned, lowered, driven hard). 

For ever 1 person who posts up an internet problem for a certain car, there are 100 people who don't post up about not having that problem on the same car.

I mean, nobody is going to start a thread titled: MY (insert car here) DIDN'T HAVE ANY ELECTRICAL PROBLEMS LAST WEEK lol

Here you go.

spacecadet said:

They didn't put a real diff in the car because they didn't have to. With the stock E-diff the car doesn't torque steer badly and it's very well mannered on normal roads.... where most of the ST's will stay.....

Whoa there, hold the phone.  Torque steer and diffs are two separate issues.  The "e diff" combats tire spin.  Ford also plays with the electric power steering to combat torque steer.

Personally, I like a bt of torque steer in a front-driver.  Makes the car feel lively instead of like some dumb boring video game.

irish44j said:

CyberEric said:

I agree with you Adrian. I find that perception is at least half of reality with car "reliability."

Especially when the internet blows up with tales of unreliability that are possibly corners cases, not the rule.

WRX is a good example. According to the internet, every WRX will break its transmission and blow its head gasket. Meanwhile, pretty much nobody i know with a WRX has broken a transmission (CV axles on occasion for those who race them), and mine went 180k miles with no transmission or HG issues (tuned, lowered, driven hard). 

You don't know anyone in Ohio then.  Hell, I've WATCHED people explode their WRX transmissions.  And a certain 2.5RS driver (not even a WRX) killed so many transmissions he bought an STi.  (Yes, I'm 100% sure that was the reason.  Totally not because someone decided to buy an Evo and sell his built STi for about 50% going rate)

For ever 1 person who posts up an internet problem for a certain car, there are 100 people who don't post up about not having that problem on the same car.

That meshes with Mike's theory that being on an Internet forum causes you to have problems with your RX-8.

I had a ton of problems with my RX-8, despite being steeped in the esoteric lore of the Wankel.

Not counting the low compression engine when I bought it (since that was a known issue, and happened with 125k miles on it), they all centered around the power steering rack and pigtail harness, though. 

But I'm on a forum, so...