9/11 Responders.. Lets support those that helped us

http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/12/22/how-did-republicans-end-up-against-911-responders-bill/?hp

End the damn partisanship and help these folks. I am fed up.

Been stalled since July..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OEplP2Fl0e8

In reply to Shim:

Yeah - I was watching Jon Stewart last week - he was interviewing some first responders about it. On the show (at the time last week) he pointed out, the only major media coverage of the Republicans' efforts to block this bill was on Al Jazeera.

Best argument I heard against it was..

"Shouldn't workers comp take care of them."..

These people deserve better. We owe them.

Wow, cant believe this is stalled in Congress. They cause such a stink about a mosque being built, but refuse to help with medical coverage for the first responders? Unbelievable....

Note - I haven't read the links.

IIRC though, the last time this was up for a vote, the Dems tied it to some other stuff that no Republican could vote for, for the express purpose of saying that they voted against 9/11 folks.

If I'm wrong, and they voted against coverage that was in a stand-alone vote, then berkeley em.

With this political climate, it is believable

DILYSI Dave wrote: Note - I haven't read the links. IIRC though, the last time this was up for a vote, the Dems tied it to some other stuff that no Republican could vote for, for the express purpose of saying that they voted against 9/11 folks. If I'm wrong, and they voted against coverage that was in a stand-alone vote, then berkeley em.

ehhh.. The dems wanted a 2/3 proceedural vote to make sure no ammendments could be made to it.. Republicans didn't like the proceedural vote thing and used that to stall. They basically said.. "We'd vote for it if you were using a normal vote, but we are against the proceedural vote thing... so therefore, We'll abstain.. But won't vote no cause we're a bunch of cowards.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2010/07/29/politics/main6724673.shtml <-- news story from July.

http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/getdoc.cgi?dbname=111_cong_bills&docid=f:s1334is.txt.pdf <-- TExt of Bill. From July..

I think republicans called it "Job Killing" at the time. I dunno.

Watch the Youtube video.. You'll see the anger... and shame that the republicans should have felt.

Anyway.. Water under the bridge. Vote for it now and support these folks.

I'm so sick of these criminals serving the needs of their parties instead of the needs of the people. It is disgusting.

time for a revolt

What thread can be started that cannot be turned into an us/them political debate?

Us and Them

And after all we're only ordinary men

Me, and you

God only knows it's not what we would choose to do

Forward he cried from the rear

and the front rank died

And the General sat, as the lines on the map

moved from side to side

Black and Blue

And who knows which is which and who is who

Up and Down

And in the end it's only round and round and round

Haven't you heard it's a battle of words

the poster bearer cried

Listen son, said the man with the gun

There's room for you inside

Down and Out

It can't be helped but there's a lot of it about

With, without

And who'll deny that's what the fightings all about

Get out of the way, it's a busy day

And I've got things on my mind

For want of the price of tea and a slice

The old man died

914Driver wrote: What thread can be started that cannot be turned into an us/them political debate?

I would say porn, but not even that can avoid it these days.

Thank you California.

Shim wrote:

DILYSI Dave wrote: Note - I haven't read the links. IIRC though, the last time this was up for a vote, the Dems tied it to some other stuff that no Republican could vote for, for the express purpose of saying that they voted against 9/11 folks. If I'm wrong, and they voted against coverage that was in a stand-alone vote, then berkeley em.

ehhh.. The dems wanted a 2/3 proceedural vote to make sure no ammendments could be made to it.. Republicans didn't like the proceedural vote thing and used that to stall. They basically said.. "We'd vote for it if you were using a normal vote, but we are against the proceedural vote thing... so therefore, We'll abstain.. But won't vote no cause we're a bunch of cowards. http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2010/07/29/politics/main6724673.shtml <-- news story from July. http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/getdoc.cgi?dbname=111_cong_bills&docid=f:s1334is.txt.pdf <-- TExt of Bill. From July.. I think republicans called it "Job Killing" at the time. I dunno. Watch the Youtube video.. You'll see the anger... and shame that the republicans should have felt. Anyway.. Water under the bridge. Vote for it now and support these folks.

It's 115 pages and the first line says it's to help 9/11 folks "...and for other purposes." The 115 page part means that it isn't being read to figure out what the other purposes are.

I think it's retarded that these first responders aren't being given VA type treatment.

I also think it's retarded that it takes 115 pages and a loophole you could drive a buick through to actually get a bill on the damn floor.

914Driver wrote: What thread can be started that cannot be turned into an us/them political debate?

Apparently none. But it is not OUR fault. THEY insist on messing everything up. If it wasn't for THOSE people, OUR lives would be perfect.

DILYSI Dave wrote: It's 115 pages and the first line says it's to help 9/11 folks "...and for other purposes." The 115 page part means that it isn't being read to figure out what the other purposes are. I think it's retarded that these first responders aren't being given VA type treatment. I also think it's retarded that it takes 115 pages and a loophole you could drive a buick through to actually get a bill on the damn floor.

This is exactly the problem I have with Congress today. If you want to make laws, that's great! That's your job, that's what you are sent to Washington to do! But don't attach other bull E36 M3 to the back end of other causes, especially one like this. Individual bills should stand on their own merit and stay on topic. If you need to attach crap to it to buy votes, then go back to the drawing board and try again.

/soapbox

If the bills were just as they were titled then all would be hunky dory, but there are so many riders to the bills that one party or the other uses the title to promote it but uses the bill to slip thru their pet projects. As in this case where the Dems used the title to say the Reps were the meanies. Before you post read the bill, you'll find out why no one wants to pass it as it is written.

The Healthcare bill and the Financial Reform acts were close to 1/3 about what they were titled and 2/3s of pet projects.

In reply to DILYSI Dave:

I read the bill and wonder where you see this loophole. Theres a bunch of stuff that talks about how they will be evaluated 1st to make sure they have issues pertaining to 9/11 and are not frauds. There is then a bunch of crap about creating a 9/11 community for these people, so they can get the VA like stuff they should.

Didn't see the loophole.

Carguy.. please show me why people don't want to pass this bill? I read it and can't figure it out. Did you read it?

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20101222/ap_on_go_co/us_congress_health_attacks

Conversation Over. It passed. I feel better knowing that some of my tax dollars will go to help these brave folks.

did anyone in this thread read the 115 pages?

madmallard wrote: did anyone in this thread read the 115 pages?

Yes I did.. I couldn't find any blatant pork or loopholes.. (such as bridge funding in Iowa or something).

if you did, its because you independantly sought this information.

sadly, i see no links in this thread to the text in question. lacking that, its hard for people to actually make a decision to support or disbelieve it will do whats claimed.

Ignorant wrote:

madmallard wrote: did anyone in this thread read the 115 pages?

Yes I did.. I couldn't find any blatant pork or loopholes.. (such as bridge funding in Iowa or something).

Is what DILYSI Dave said true about the first line?

No dancing, no BS, it's a yes or no response.

914Driver wrote:

Ignorant wrote:

madmallard wrote: did anyone in this thread read the 115 pages?

Yes I did.. I couldn't find any blatant pork or loopholes.. (such as bridge funding in Iowa or something).

Is what DILYSI Dave said true about the first line? No dancing, no BS, it's a yes or no response.

Here's the first line.. " To amend the Public Health Service Act to extend and improve protections and services to individuals directly impacted by the terrorist attack in New York City on September 11, 2001, and for other purposes."

Yup.. Now read the text.

I posted the link up higher in the post..

I cannot find a nefarious "Other Purposes" in it.. They talk about funding these efforts and taxing H1B's more to allow for this care.. (and companies that use them)..

http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/getdoc.cgi?dbname=111_cong_bills&docid=f:s1334is.txt.pdf

It is a disgrace that the bill was penned in June 2009 and we just passed it now.

madmallard wrote: if you did, its because you independantly sought this information. sadly, i see no links in this thread to the text in question. lacking that, its hard for people to actually make a decision to support or disbelieve it will do whats claimed.

http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/getdoc.cgi?dbname=111_cong_bills&docid=f:s1334is.txt.pdf

I posted it farther up the page...

Thanks Iggy. I've been thinking of posting on this but it kept turning into an incoherant rant and I try to avoid politics but I can't believe it took ten berkeley ing years to settle this. Hopefully like most people involved my brother and I will never need this but there are a lot of people who were healthy, strong people who are suffering some pretty horrific illnesses and couldn't get any kind of help.

Wally wrote: Thanks Iggy. I've been thinking of posting on this but it kept turning into an incoherant rant and I try to avoid politics but I can't believe it took ten berkeley ing years to settle this. Hopefully like most people involved my brother and I will never need this but there are a lot of people who were healthy, strong people who are suffering some pretty horrific illnesses and couldn't get any kind of help.

It is a total shame it took 10 years. A complete and utter black eye upon this nation. I hope you never need these services, but I'm glad they are there now. I have asthma, have had it since birth, and know what a total pain it is to live with breathing issues. I wouldn't wish this stuff on my worst enemy.