I came here for an argument

This could be regional, but I disagree with what everyone is saying about 'bolis and 'zones

Stromboli is like a pizza folded up with no sauce inside.  Usually cheese, ham, and pepperoni inside, served with sauce on the side.  It is an American invention, started in Philly in the 50s.  Romano's made the baked version of a pizza folded over and originally called it the Pizza Imbottita which basically means stuffed pizza.  Ham, sausage, cheese, and peppers.  No sauce.  From Wiki:  [the owner's] future brother-in-law suggested he name it after the recently released movie Stromboli, notorious for an off-screen affair between married actress, Ingrid Bergman, and married director, Roberto Rossellini, resulting in a love child.

Calzone is like a pizza folded up WITH sauce inside and usually mozzerella, pecorino, and ricotta.  It originated in Italy and has many variations like the Panzerotti that Duke mentioned (the fried version), the Pastizz or Pastizzio which usually has ricotta and an egg, or the Cuddiruni which often has tomatoes and other vegetables.

In Italy, Calzones are always sealed up in a pocket with the exception of some recipes of Pastizzio.  With the egg in the ricotta it is less likely to ooze out, so some Pastizzia are made like a nut roll.  Calzones originated as on-the-go street food designed to be eaten with one hand.  Basically they invented hot pockets before hot pockets did.  Nearly all of the Bolis in my neck of the woods are sealed up as well.  Lots of fat and juice in the meats and there is no way to keep it inside unless you pinch the edges.  Most have slices on top to let steam out.

In the US, we have kinda mutilated pizza.  The original pizzaiolo was tomatoes, fresh mozzerella, olive oil, and basil on some stretched out bread dough.  The red, white, and green was symbolic of the Italian flag.  Now it's sauce from a can, shredded mozzerella, and all sorts of craziness.  Don't get me wrong... I love me a good hawaiian or taco pizza, but it's a far cry from an original pizzaiolo margherita.

If you visit Italy, many times you can just order "a pizza" and you'll get the regional take on it.  In Naples, you'll probably get a Margherita.  In Venice, you'll probably get anchovy.  In Sicily you'll likely get a Pizzolu which has crust top and bottom, or you might get slices of chewy bread with just crushed tomatoes on it and no cheese.  Kinda like if you traveled all over the US and just ordered "a piece of cake" you might get pineapple upside down cake in Hawaii, Angel food cake in Minnesota, and gluten free organic fair trade chocolate cake in Portland.

I'm Buzz Killington, and I approve this message.

The Sicilian Pizzolu is awesome.

In reply to Curtis73 (Forum Supporter) :

More importantly your thoughts on hot dogs and bologna. That, my friend, is the real question.

Eh... to me calzones and strombolis are interchangeable.   A folded or wrapped pizza dough with something inside and baked in an oven.  I never really understood why my ex- ordered them instead of regular pizza (there never seemed to be a rhyme or reason to which one she'd want). Regardless, I think she thought they re-heated better.  Being indifferent, it fell under the "happy something, happy something, something..." rule.  

The OP wanted an argument. I think he got it. 

Now I want some crusty bread, drizzled with oil and topped with roasted red peppers and anchovies... Mmm... 

thatsnowinnebago (Forum Supporter) said:

Oh buddy, you're missing out. Ricotta most certainly will stay on a slice of pizza. 

Not enough to count.

Curtis73 (Forum Supporter) said:

This could be regional, but I disagree with what everyone is saying about 'bolis and 'zones

Toppings / stuffings aren't particularly relevant to whether something is a calzone or a stromboli.  Sauce in, sauce out, ricotta or no, meats or veggies, that is a matter of ordering, and either one can be had either way.

The real difference is that a calzone is folded in half and sealed, all crust outside, whereas a stromboli is rolled up so there are crust and stuffings interleaved like a cinnamon roll or sticky bun.

In my experience, anyway.

So:

All pizza is good, some better than others.  Some people like different things and styles.  I had a thin crust margherita pizza the other day from a some millenial type joint, and it tasted like burned toast with tomato juice spilled on it.  There was a few wads of cheese and about eight leaves of some sort spread around the surface. I ate it, but was unable to generate any enthusiasm for it.  Mmmmm.  Black spots on the dough make it better. Not.

Miracle whip is a lovely addition to sandwiches.

Fresh bread is lovely.

Bologna and hot dogs are food only when there is absolutely no other food available.

Ketchup is salty, not sweet.  It is a nice addition to some foods, but does not belong on a steak.

Pineapple is a fine addition to pizza.

Roast beef needs no seasonings other than salt and pepper.  Dry rub of any sort just makes it not taste like a delicious cow.  Rubs are for chickens and non smoked pig parts.

In reply to Duke :

I've never seen a stromboli rolled in such a way. I may need to try this. In SW PA, sauce is the main difference. Sometimes I've seen them as logs, but not actually layer rolled. 

Although there is something I want to try locally. NY style place, wood fired oven. They do some crazy pizza and some very traditional pizza. BUT instead of hoagies, they do "folds", from pics on Facebook they look like unsealed calzones. The other thing they have is a Pizzone. Half pizza, the other half rolled like a zone. 

Crazy pizza like this, with cheese sticks on it

More traditional offerings

I don't have Facebook, so pics have been hard to find to post here, but is Uncle Kokos in Belle Vernon PA. Worth looking them up just to see the shiny happy person owner respond to negative reviews.

I will say their pizza SUCKS once it cools off, the crust gets ridiculously tough and chewy, but fresh out of the oven and still hot? It's pretty great.

In reply to Streetwiseguy :

I left a girl at a restaurant on a date when she did the double whammy of well done steak with ketchup. I was almost willing to overlook the well done part, we were young she probably didn't know better, but when she opened the bottle of ketchup I just left.

I see no one has brought this up..... Ramen. In the cup. IT's really not bad. I had my first one about 2 or 3 months ago. 

Strombolis I have had, between NYC and Washington DC, more or less all look like this - rolled up:

Calzones in the same area more or less all look like this - folded pocket:

Since we’ve expanded to pizza related but not pizza foods, I’ll do a public service announcement for those of you who have bypassed this gem. 

Walmart has a some pretty good take in bake pizzas. Their cost to taste ratios are pretty high for $5-10. But those who have turned up your noses at Walmart pizza need to go try this “pizza.” 

Walmart breakfast pizza- 

The crust is a biscuit, the sauce is country gravy, and it’s topped with scrambled eggs, bacon, cheese, and sausage. Not pizza, but a damned good cheap easy breakfast. 

bobzilla said:

In reply to Curtis73 (Forum Supporter) :

More importantly your thoughts on hot dogs and bologna. That, my friend, is the real question.

I think they are a very important way to respect the animal by using all of it and not letting anything go to waste.  Those lips and buttholes are just as important as the Ribeye.

Hebrew National and Nathans, followed closely by a good old fashioned Ballpark.

RevRico said:

In reply to Streetwiseguy :

I left a girl at a restaurant on a date when she did the double whammy of well done steak with ketchup. I was almost willing to overlook the well done part, we were young she probably didn't know better, but when she opened the bottle of ketchup I just left.

It's for the best, you can't have the deplorables in your life that like that sort of stuff.

Also steak that is well done is not steak, it's actually leather at that point, possibly a form of footwear

Oy.  My friend let me use a bay in his shop one Saturday so when he stopped by, I bought a 6 of IPA and a chicken wing pizza.  (his choice).  They pour the orange grease from wings onto dough with chicken bits & cheese.

Good once, but leaning over a fender, we enjoyed that thing for hours!

Duke said:

In reply to bobzilla :

You have my deepest sympathy.  Warm, hearth-baked crusty bread with a little salted butter or herbed olive oil... I could eat just that, some days.

Agreed.  Add some red wine and good green olives and I've got fruit and vegetable requirements met too.

Antihero (Forum Supporter) said:

RevRico said:

In reply to Streetwiseguy :

I left a girl at a restaurant on a date when she did the double whammy of well done steak with ketchup. I was almost willing to overlook the well done part, we were young she probably didn't know better, but when she opened the bottle of ketchup I just left.

It's for the best, you can't have the deplorables in your life that like that sort of stuff.

 

Also steak that is well done is not steak, it's actually leather at that point, possibly a form of footwear

 

I can understand some people liking a well-done steak.  The ketchup is a deal breaker 

Curtis73 (Forum Supporter) said:

bobzilla said:

In reply to Curtis73 (Forum Supporter) :

More importantly your thoughts on hot dogs and bologna. That, my friend, is the real question.

 

Hebrew National and Nathans, followed closely by a good old fashioned Ballpark.

Don't know what they're called, but red with real snappy skin!  Hands down.

Back to pizza.

Curtis73 (Forum Supporter) said:

bobzilla said:

In reply to Curtis73 (Forum Supporter) :

More importantly your thoughts on hot dogs and bologna. That, my friend, is the real question.

I think they are a very important way to respect the animal by using all of it and not letting anything go to waste.  Those lips and buttholes are just as important as the Ribeye.

Hebrew National and Nathans, followed closely by a good old fashioned Ballpark.

I agree with your philosophy.  I also used to eat Nathans dogs, until I saw the sodium count.  I think they're down to 800mg per dog now, but for a while they were over 1000mg.  Each.

Curtis73 (Forum Supporter) said:

I can understand some people liking a well-done steak.  The ketchup is a deal breaker 

I used to like my steaks well done.  Then I hit puberty.

I also used to put A-1 on steaks - which pretty much ketchup with added spices.  Now I have a bottle of A-1 in the fridge that I should probably throw away it's so old...  I don't really know what changed... other than now I can afford to buy decent steaks when I want one. 

I suppose when it comes to pizza, I'm pretty much agnostic about it.  While I have toppings I prefer, I can't really think of any I would actively avoid.

bobzilla said:

ALL bread is a delivery device. Its something the wife and I disagree on the most. Meat and cheese is what you want. The bread is just there so you don't look like a caveman with a piece of flesh in your fingers wolfing it down. Everything else has been devised to make us look more modern and refined. 

Also, I make my pizza on a cookie sheet but it ends up 2-2.5" thick with toppings

 

I've never read something on the internet I agree with so much! My wife is a bread eater, I think of bread as a way to enjoy the food inside or on top of it. 

dropstep said:

bobzilla said:

ALL bread is a delivery device. Its something the wife and I disagree on the most. Meat and cheese is what you want. The bread is just there so you don't look like a caveman with a piece of flesh in your fingers wolfing it down. Everything else has been devised to make us look more modern and refined. 

Also, I make my pizza on a cookie sheet but it ends up 2-2.5" thick with toppings

 

I've never read something on the internet I agree with so much! My wife is a bread eater, I think of bread as a way to enjoy the food inside or on top of it. 

Truth 

Antihero (Forum Supporter) said:

RevRico said:

In reply to Streetwiseguy :

I left a girl at a restaurant on a date when she did the double whammy of well done steak with ketchup. I was almost willing to overlook the well done part, we were young she probably didn't know better, but when she opened the bottle of ketchup I just left.

It's for the best, you can't have the deplorables in your life that like that sort of stuff.

 

Also steak that is well done is not steak, it's actually leather at that point, possibly a form of footwear

This makes me laugh, if I have to eat steak it better be well done and have ketchup. I don't like steak, I'd much rather have a cheeseburger 

my wife loves steak, eats it medium and it grosses me out. I like my food cooked 

914Driver said:

Curtis73 (Forum Supporter) said:

bobzilla said:

In reply to Curtis73 (Forum Supporter) :

More importantly your thoughts on hot dogs and bologna. That, my friend, is the real question.

 

Hebrew National and Nathans, followed closely by a good old fashioned Ballpark.

Don't know what they're called, but red with real snappy skin!  Hands down.

Back to pizza.

Red Hots? God I haven't had one of those in 20 years

There is a pizza place just outside of work that makes an Italian Sub pizza. Oil, Meats from an IS, Mozz, Prov, all melted an gooey, then topped with lettuce, tomato, onion, and pickles. Served with a side of seasoned oil. It is berkeleying delicious! I initially scoffed at the idea of pickles on a pizza, I was wrong.

Pineapple- YES with salty ham product.

Sardines- Not for me I cannot stand the things.

Stromboli and Calzone- As Curtis mentions, but I am from Central PA originally.

Pizza sauce- It goes under the cheese then the toppings. I cannot stand a vat of tomato sauce sitting in the midst of some melted cheese on a loaf of underdone bread. Heathens.

Toppings- They go on top of the cheese FFS. I got a pizza in San Diego once that had the pepperoni slices under the cheese. I want those small slices of heaven to be slightly curled up with a small pool of the Oil from Hell in them.

Hot dogs- They go in a new england style bun and ketchup (Heinz only, see that I am from PA) and sweet relish is my preferred. I'll eat most hot dogs, probably 4 at a sitting easily, pretty much any way minus chopped raw onions. Chopped in baked beans or in blue box mac-n-cheese too.

Scrapple- Nope.

Spam- Sometimes, but really only when I am in HI.

Bologna- Yes please, with american cheese on a white-ish bread. Add a little ketchup. Make me two please.

Lobster rolls- I will eat them either way but prefer mayo over hot butter. Once again a grilled new england style hot dog roll is required.

Cheesesteak- There is a difference between a cheesesteak and a steak and cheese.

I am sure I missed some stuff, but I made sure to add some important ones as well.