Yah 500 torques is 500 torques but 6mpg isn't 12mpg!
Yah 500 torques is 500 torques but 6mpg isn't 12mpg!
novaderrik wrote:Jay_W wrote: Diesel or gas? IIRC they were all bigblock gassers. Ugh. Big things should be dieseled. I would advise a test drive, followed by a test drive of something with a diesel in the back, that rides and stops on air. It may or may not make enough of a difference to help you decide whether to get one of these or something else or nuthin a'tall. These two testdrives pushed me into what I have now, which is the 2nd of the above testdrives...they have a 455 Olds "Rocket" powering the front wheels... i'd think that a 500 Caddy wouldn't be too hard of a swap- and 500 torques is 500 torques regardless of whether they are made with a spark plug or from the heat of compression...
Also, 500 lb ft of torque at 1200 RPM is not the same as 500 lb ft of torque at 3500 RPM
In reply to Toyman01: Although I would love to do something like this, now is not the time. If you pursue, let us know what you find out.
tuna55 wrote:novaderrik wrote:Also, 500 lb ft of torque at 1200 RPM is not the same as 500 lb ft of torque at 3500 RPMJay_W wrote: Diesel or gas? IIRC they were all bigblock gassers. Ugh. Big things should be dieseled. I would advise a test drive, followed by a test drive of something with a diesel in the back, that rides and stops on air. It may or may not make enough of a difference to help you decide whether to get one of these or something else or nuthin a'tall. These two testdrives pushed me into what I have now, which is the 2nd of the above testdrives...they have a 455 Olds "Rocket" powering the front wheels... i'd think that a 500 Caddy wouldn't be too hard of a swap- and 500 torques is 500 torques regardless of whether they are made with a spark plug or from the heat of compression...
true, but gearing and the cheaper and easier to get service parts for the gas engine makes it about a wash..
also, the 455 and 500 inch gas engines were the best choice compared to the diesels of the day.. unless you think that comparing them to a modern Duramax or Cummins is fair...
novaderrik wrote:tuna55 wrote:true, but gearing and the cheaper and easier to get service parts for the gas engine makes it about a wash.. also, the 455 and 500 inch gas engines were the best choice compared to the diesels of the day.. unless you think that comparing them to a modern Duramax or Cummins is fair...novaderrik wrote:Also, 500 lb ft of torque at 1200 RPM is not the same as 500 lb ft of torque at 3500 RPMJay_W wrote: Diesel or gas? IIRC they were all bigblock gassers. Ugh. Big things should be dieseled. I would advise a test drive, followed by a test drive of something with a diesel in the back, that rides and stops on air. It may or may not make enough of a difference to help you decide whether to get one of these or something else or nuthin a'tall. These two testdrives pushed me into what I have now, which is the 2nd of the above testdrives...they have a 455 Olds "Rocket" powering the front wheels... i'd think that a 500 Caddy wouldn't be too hard of a swap- and 500 torques is 500 torques regardless of whether they are made with a spark plug or from the heat of compression...
Fair enough, but compare the contemporary gas big blocks with the Cummins 5.9 - there is no gas engine like that.
other than crate and replacement motors, who still makes gas big blocks and puts them in any factory built vehicles any more? the last one that i know of was the 8100 that GM quit putting in trucks in '06 or so in favor of the more profitable Duramax, followed by the 460 that Ford quit using in the late 90's. Dodge hasn't had a big block since forever..
which brings up an interesting question: which would work better in one of these motorhomes- an early 70's 500ci Cadillac, or an early 00's 8100(496ci).. i'd probably lean towards the newer motor, which is a simple adapter plate away from bolting up to the Toronado transaxle..
The 500 Caddy can make plenty of power and I am pretty sure it weighs a far amount less than the 8.1. If I was going to swap in a new engine I might look into 4 cyl turbo diesels since i'm pretty sure there is no way to add overdrive to the transaxle.
you would honestly put a 4 cylinder in one of these things?
They move those little box trucks alright.
Wally wrote: They move those little box trucks alright.
how many forward gears and what kind of a final drive ratio is involved? how would they do in a brick that google tells me weighs 12,000 pound that has 3 forward gears and something like 3.23 final drive ratio?
I don't know yet. I've got time before I can get a motorhome so hopefully I can figure it out by then.
novaderrik wrote: other than crate and replacement motors, who still makes gas big blocks and puts them in any factory built vehicles any more? the last one that i know of was the 8100 that GM quit putting in trucks in '06 or so in favor of the more profitable Duramax, followed by the 460 that Ford quit using in the late 90's. Dodge hasn't had a big block since forever..
Ford and Dodge replaced their old-school big-blocks with V10s, and now Ford has the new 6.2L V8s. So not technically big-blocks, but still large displacement gas motors.
I think an old Caddy 500 or 455 Olds rebuild to a more 'modern' spec w/MS TBI injection would yield a nice increase in power and economy for far less than a diesel swap.
The GMC units are well built, but as with anything 30+ years old, you'll have to tinker with stuff on a regular basis.
Off of another site:
Have had 3 of em over the years.
A stock 1 will get 8-10 driven right.
On the other hand my last (got rid of it 5 yrs ago) would get 13-16,out on the interstate, cruisin@ 65 -70 mph.
1 of the tricks is ,get rid of the OLDS, swap in a 500" Cadillac thats been warmed up a little.
Ya know- good rebuild, balanced, cam good intake, a turbo, and a good flowing exhaust system.
Also changing the final drive ratio. (It's a kit available from sum turbo 425 guys in San Diego)
The last big trip I took in my last 1 was over 6500 miles and I averaged over 14 mpg with it, and that was both flatland drivin and mountian drivin. The first leg of that trip was from Parker AZ (0' elevation) to Gettysberg South Dakota which took me over the continental divide (8000" elavation) down thru N.M. up the Raton pass, thru Denver (5200 elevation) into Wyoming and acroos the flats into central So. Dakota.
ITt can B done Al.
Kruzin in AZ
Don
Not to get all girlie on you guys, but if you're planning on spending much time in it, you would very soon discover that GMCs were notoriously low on storage, even compared to their contemporaries. Couple that with the similarly notorious airbag system, and you have a recipe for frustration.
I've been the "classic" motorhome route, and would not recommend it no matter what the brand. You have the difficulties of dealing with outmoded truck chassis that are truly, outrageously unacceptable by today's standards and at today's speeds: Think steering so imprecise that maintaining your lane becomes a combination of shooting for a line splitting the 2-foot wander on either side and a "meh, that guy'll shove over" casual attitude, a ride so harsh that even your packing-material-muffled dishes WILL chip, and drivetrain problems that were blissfully solved decades ago (when's the last time you iced down a carb to keep running?). Combine that with the problems of a house, only a 40-year-old one built to standards that today's mobile homes would view with disgust (40-year-old plastic plumbing, anyone?).
GMCs were a cut above back in the day, and revered because they suffered from these ills to a much lesser degree. However, some of the attempts to solve those ills bring their own problems (storage due to the aircraft-inspired construction, those ride-muffling airbags), and in the end, it's still a zebra you're not probably going to like trying to deal with if you're looking for a good horse. Now, if you truly like zebras, as many of us do, go for it. But be prepared.
Margie
Marjorie Suddard wrote: Not to get all girlie on you guys, but if you're planning on spending much time in it, you would very soon discover that GMCs were notoriously low on storage, even compared to their contemporaries. Couple that with the similarly notorious airbag system, and you have a recipe for frustration. I've been the "classic" motorhome route, and would not recommend it no matter what the brand. You have the difficulties of dealing with outmoded truck chassis that are truly, outrageously unacceptable by today's standards and at today's speeds: Think steering so imprecise that maintaining your lane becomes a combination of shooting for a line splitting the 2-foot wander on either side and a "meh, that guy'll shove over" casual attitude, a ride so harsh that even your packing-material-muffled dishes WILL chip, and drivetrain problems that were blissfully solved decades ago (when's the last time you iced down a carb to keep running?). Combine that with the problems of a house, only a 40-year-old one built to standards that today's mobile homes would view with disgust (40-year-old plastic plumbing, anyone?). GMCs were a cut above back in the day, and revered because they suffered from these ills to a much lesser degree. However, some of the attempts to solve those ills bring their own problems (storage due to the aircraft-inspired construction, those ride-muffling airbags), and in the end, it's still a zebra you're not probably going to like trying to deal with if you're looking for a good horse. Now, if you truly like zebras, as many of us do, go for it. But be prepared. Margie
Well said.
I wonder if craigslist has any zebras. 
Which is why those of us with even old Foretravels or Bluebirds look at every other RV on the road and think "they bought the wrong rig"
In reply to Jay_W:
Yep. To this day I cannot see a Bluebird on the road without hearing my father-in-law's voice exclaiming, "Ahhhh, a Bluebird!"
Margie
Ok then. Tampa delivers again!
Or, a little funkier.
No wait, with this one you can bring your Miata with you, enclosed!
Insert Mongo here >
Mental note: When I decide I want (and have someplace to put) a full-sized RV, I'm flying to FL with a wad of $100's, renting a car and cruising the state with a print-out of Bluebird CL ads. 
Just going to leave this here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jOkMMaQJGqY
Which lead me here. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L-bkq0CSzjQ
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