This is so sad.

http://www.timesunion.com/local/article/Gunshot-erases-a-young-life-917605.php

12 year old gets killed by playing with a gun. Today's paper says that manslaughter charges are on the kid (shooter) and not controlling a firearm are laid on the Dad, the licensed owner.

That is sad. I'm all for the right to have firearms (not that i have any myself), but anybody with a brain should keep them safe. If a 12 year old can find an unlocked, loaded gun, the gun owner wasn't doing his/her job, and should be responsible as well.

Also why not educate the children about guns? like, and this might sound crazy, teaching them NOT TO PLAY WITH A REAL GUN!!!

Rufledt wrote: If a 12 year old can find an unlocked, loaded gun, the gun owner wasn't doing his/her job, and should be responsible as well.

There's a fine line here.

Would you lock up your fire extinquisher? Even if recharging it "only" took ten or fifteen seconds, would you keep it empty until the time when your life depended on it?

IMO, the real answer here is proper education. Even if you personally despise guns, you and your children should at least know how to pick one up and make it safe (drop the mag, clear the chamber, drop the hammer/set the safety, etc).

Rufledt wrote: Also why not educate the children about guns? like, and this might sound crazy, teaching them NOT TO PLAY WITH A REAL GUN!!!

Crazy talk!

My 10yr old can check, clear, disassemble, clean and reassemble a .22 bolt action as well as anybody can. He can also group pretty well at 100yrds. They aren't laying around here but he were to stumble across one somewhere else - like Boy Scout camp... where I'm not hovering like a worrysome nanny... he has the tools he needs not to screw up. One of those "other" things I say over and over is that if your buddy pulls out his daddies revolver - LEAVE.

Kids are smart. All you have to do is teach them.

As a child, my grandfather taught me all about his firearms. He also taught me that he would kick my ass if I got anywhere near them.

ReverendDexter wrote: Would you lock up your fire extinquisher?

umm..

Seriously though, these biometric safes have been around for more than ten years.

A sad thing for sure. I wouldn't want to wish that on any parent.

Education is the key. There are two 9mm handguns and two rifles in my house. The hand guns are loaded and none of them are locked up. I have four children and no worries about them ever touching a gun without permission. They know they are loaded. They know if they want to look at them or hold them all they have to do is ask. All of them have fired them even the 8 year old. I usually use watermelon as targets so they get a very graphic view of what happens when someone gets shot with one. The two youngest just got BB guns for Christmas so their learning can continue.

I also agree education is key. I was just having this coversation with my hippie dad, who seemed to forget taking me to the shooting range when I was in 4th grade to learn how to shoot a .22 and handle a firearm safely.

A kid having knowledge and using knowledge is two different things. Kids don't always make good judgement calls. That is why parents are responsible for them when under 18.

I teach my kids mostly the same thing: if some kid pulls a gun, leave in a hurry. No need to explain why. I don't have any, mainly because I don't need them and can't afford the hobby.

DoctorBlade wrote: I teach my kids mostly the same thing: if some kid pulls a gun, leave in a hurry. No need to explain why. I don't have any, mainly because I don't need them and can't afford the hobby.

This

If you want a firearm, get a firearm. Wanna put it in a safe? Put it in a safe. Bottom line is, its your job to make sure that your kids cant just get a hold of it for fun. Theres WAAAAAAAY too many variables in each persons home...size of the house, number of kids, number of weapons, sizes of weapons, number of parents, number of closets, number of whatever to make a blanket statement like "safes are ineffective", or "you should always lock up your weapons". Yes education is the key, but so is responsible parenting...the 2 MUST go hand in hand.

I actually have a scar on my arm from being hit by a bullet from a kid playing with a gun. I was walking home, he was playing with his dads gun in the garage and it went off as I was walking by and grazed my upper left arm, I was lucky that is all that got hit.

When I was 5 I started shooting with my dad, part of that was learning to maintain and all of the guns from my chipmunk to the AR. I was taught to clear any weapon and treat them as if they were loaded at all times. All it takes is educating your children to be responsible. When I was a kid I would walk home from school and stay there alone until my folks got home from work. I was told if anyone tried to break into the house grab the gun either in the office or my parents bedroom then head for the back yard with our dogs (a doberman and 2 wolf hybrids), if someone came at me I was to shoot then let the dogs take care of them.

Ignorant wrote: Seriously though, these biometric safes have been around for more than ten years.

Just so you know, safes with fingerprint readers are fine for keeping things away from the kids or stopping burglars, but if anyone steals the safe itself or has any time alone with it, they're not that difficult to break into. Either a digital or mechanical combination lock is the best type - the downside of the digital one is that if the battery dies you can get locked away from your own stuff, the downside of the mechanical one is that it might be possible to break into it using a stethoscope.

rebelgtp wrote: I was told if anyone tried to break into the house grab the gun either in the office or my parents bedroom then head for the back yard with our dogs (a doberman and 2 wolf hybrids), if someone came at me I was to shoot then let the dogs take care of them.

Glad you never had to do that, but I'd be lying if I didn't say that your parents were pretty awesome in that regard.

Today's paper says they are rethinking the manslaughter charge on the kid.

No matter the court dances, you know some sheister lawyer is licking his lips and both family's lives are forever changed.

I was just looking at trigger locks the other day. I haven't fired any of my guns in over 20 years, but they are still in the house and I have ammo for each one. My kids will get the same education my brother and I did (similar to Rotard's) but the difference will be I am adding in DoctorBlade's comment. Dad never told us to leave if anyone else had a gun, but my kids will get that beaten into their head.

My wife and I have had some long talks about gun education for our kids. Unfortunately not every household has done the same.

I understand the rationale behind the gun safes and trigger locks, but if I have to get up to get my gun in the middle of the night I need instant access.

Fortunately now my kids have left home, but before then they were educated as to what a gun could do and the consequences. They knew how to shoot one and had personally seen they weren't toys. I never had a known instance of them even telling another kid we had a gun or where it was.

Good parenting is the best tool for most of the world's problems.

carguy123 wrote: Good parenting is the best tool for most of the world's problems.

+1

Reading through this reminds me of when my dad got his .357 6-shooter revolver and several .22 rifles also. But, our convo went about like this:

Dad: You see this? Me: Yes. Dad: This can kill people and you are to never touch it. You know what will happen if you do? Me: I'll be grounded to my room. Dad: And you'll be the only kid at your school with 3 feet. Me: 3 feet? Dad: Yes, 2 on the ground and one of mine up your ass.

That is all he had to say. He kept it loaded with hollow points and in it's holster on the bedpost all the time. I wish I was able to get that gun from him. It was a really nice looking piece.

It's really sad that this had to happen. Maybe more kids need a "preventative ass whippin" like some of us got when we were little.

The problem is- while all the preventative parenting in the WORLD can make your kid safe, it can't neccesarily make other kids safe. Was just having that convo with the wife the other day. I'm hell bent on protecting my stuff, and she abhors guns of any kind- so the thought of a 12ga under the bed does not amuse her in the least. I guess we get to add kids to the conversation now too.

I aagree w/4cylinderfury. I grew up around guns, in fact a lot of them were kept in my bedroom in an open case and a wall rack. Ammo was never kept where the guns were stored. I was taught to treat every gun like it's loaded and never, ever point it at anything you don't intend to shoot. Even if you know the gun is unloaded. I have a small collection, about half I inherited. I never kept them out, kept them in a closet and told the kids they touch them I'd break their arm. They left them alone. I now have a locking glass door case for the rifles, the pistols are still in the closet and the ammo is someplace else. As soon as kids are old enough to recognise what it is, they should be educated about guns. Parents responsibility to make sure they aren't laying around and that ammo is away from the gun.

Before you bash the glass door case, it is effective along with my retired military stuff on the wall next to it does insure that the guys that come around for my daughters keep their manners.

AquaHusky wrote: Dad: You see this? Me: Yes. Dad: This can kill people and you are to never touch it. You know what will happen if you do? Me: I'll be grounded to my room. Dad: And you'll be the only kid at your school with 3 feet. Me: 3 feet? Dad: Yes, 2 on the ground and one of mine up your ass.

If I ever have kids, I'm stealing your dad's line.

Build a recess in the wall, and put a revolver in the hole. Then cover the hole with paper and a light skim coat of plaster, then paint. Now you have a VERY well hidden gun that is very accessible if shtf.

Joey

When it rains it pours....

The 12 year olds grandfather was killed after a visit.

http://www.timesunion.com/local/article/Boy-s-grandfather-killed-after-grave-visit-935939.php