GRM Gran Turismo Series 8 Testing

@ Matt

Looks like

• F500 thing of Mudds as a tuner

• 90's Japinees Cars as a tuner

• Lotus thing we tested as a Non tuner.

That leaves the need for one more non tuner. That is why I was testing the Autobacs Garaiya last night to see how people liked it. We should run it again with the lightened 499PP tune this sunday. Hopefully more people will be there to give input.

We should test the other FF cars people have suggested and see if they are decent.

I also have the GT series that you and I were testing last night. I think that can be made to work. We just need to eliminate the ringers and the cars that are slow. Hopefully it would leave 10 or so cars that are close. I was hoping to run it as a limited tuner (power & weight only to the prescribed pp tuned as I noted). There are two ways to run it. The first is to use the muscle car series format where the leaders at mid season have to change cars and we could also use the "bonus" system but make it cumulative to try and further even out the field. Or we could implement the grab bag rules. I kind of like the grab bag rules as it forces people to move from car to car (also using the cumulative bonus system). The only issue I see is there may be cost issues for some as these cars are not the cheapest. Most are over 100K and there are some over 200K so the muscle car format may be the better option for now.

Spoolpigeon wrote: In reply to dean1484: Then quit being a Bob Costas and go straight to the Yellowbird or the F40!

Ok spool stock f40s on comfort soft. You in for a one off race? See who else wants to join the madness. We can run it this sunday

I'm in!

So, I am assuming we are good with starting the Sunday after Thanksgiving then?

I'm in!

aircooled wrote: I'm in! So, I am assuming we are good with starting the Sunday after Thanksgiving then?

Thought this was always the plan.

I am hoping to have the euro GT series sorted so I can lay out the cars and tuning for testing next Wednesday. I just hope we get a decent turn out.

Ok, if the Lotus is a lock for one of the non-tuners then I'd vote for an FF car rather than the Garaiya. We don't need both non-tuners to be MR cars, even though the Garaiya is more pushy than a typical MR.

I ran a few laps with each of the 3 proposed FF cars and liked the mm-R and Alfa. The Integra was ok, but the other two were better balanced and easier to drive. The mm-R is a really fun car that is generally neutral but does exhibit normal FF tendencies at the limit and if driven too roughly. The Alfa drives 100% like an FF and requires some patience. It would probably be a good car for teaching people to drive a FWD car fast because if you get it wrong it just plows. We can test them out on Sunday and see how they do in a pack, that may be a better test of what works and doesn't.

I actually prefer the Autobacs Garaiya to the lotus simply because I am not a fan of low power aero cars. They don't rely on slip angle it is all about the aero down force. And then the aero grip changes with speed further complicating things. I just look at it as a un necessary complication. It is a very different skill set that I am just not as good at putting to the limit all the way around a track. I like constant mechanical grip.

In reply to dean1484: Perfect! Dean's not good at it. I'm in!

Yup, sounds like the perfect reason to keep em'

I definitely prefer the Lotus to the Garaiya. It drives more as an MR should and requires a bit more to get the full potential from it. The Garaiya by comparison is easy and much more forgiving, and though it isn't bad it isn't as much fun due to its tendency to push.

I think the Lotus and the Alfa are both cars that require good, but very different driving to be quick in. Both would serve well as cars that can help train the drivers to both respect and become quick with the platforms.

Interesting. I did not have any pushing in the Garaiya. Must be a driving style thing.

Its not that it really pushed, its that it doesn't turn in or rotate nearly as quickly as expected for an MR. You can get the rear end to kick out but you really have to upset the car to do so. And sometimes when you want it to be a little loose, it isnt.

I prefer the looseness of the elise over the unexpected neutralness of the gariya.

for another oddball japanese MR there is the tommy kaira zzII. I have not ever driven that one so dont know how it behaves. or how expensive it is. or what the PP is.

EDIT. Its not MR. Its AWD. I never knew that.

In reply to failboat:

That car is a amazing, especially with some tweaks. That is my go-to car for any challenge that is 500+ pp and comfort tires.

failboat wrote: Its not that it really pushed, its that it doesn't turn in or rotate nearly as quickly as expected for an MR. You can get the rear end to kick out but you really have to upset the car to do so. And sometimes when you want it to be a little loose, it isnt. I prefer the looseness of the elise over the unexpected neutralness of the gariya.

That's a much better way to put it. When you get the line right you can just put your foot down and go, but if you need to make corrections mid-turn to get more rotation it doesn't want to do it. To have an MR car that doesn't rotate under mid-corner lift is just odd.

No tire and fuel wear for this season? The M5 was my favorite last season.

Nick (Not-Stig) Comstock wrote: No tire and fuel wear for this season? The M5 was my favorite last season.

We could run it. Even though the races are short there would be some degradation of the tires that could be intresting.

The ZZII was my drivers choice car. I love that car and would gladly run a season with it. We all should have it as well. I was apprehensive to suggest it as it is AWD and you all know me and AWD . We also did the EVO series a while back so I was holding off on that but then again we did do the HH series at the same as the Evo so I am up for testing the ZZII if you all want to.

e30Matt wrote:

failboat wrote: Its not that it really pushed, its that it doesn't turn in or rotate nearly as quickly as expected for an MR. You can get the rear end to kick out but you really have to upset the car to do so. And sometimes when you want it to be a little loose, it isnt. I prefer the looseness of the elise over the unexpected neutralness of the gariya.

That's a much better way to put it. When you get the line right you can just put your foot down and go, but if you need to make corrections mid-turn to get more rotation it doesn't want to do it. To have an MR car that doesn't rotate under mid-corner lift is just odd.

I never had any issues with it. Lift off would pick up front grip but not make the tail come around. I really like how that car is set up. As I was saying you have to plan your corner in advance and commit to it. I use the lift off similar to trail braking in that car. I just wait until the front picks up enough grip and then hammer down. If I get it rite like the sweeper at Apricot Hill it is very rewarding.

As for series choices the locks are the F500 and the 90's Japanese series. These were suggested by Mudd and Sauce (as series winners last season they have some say in this) These also seem to be very good series that will produce close racing. The other two are still open for discussion / testing. I would like to test the GT cars next wednesday. I hope to have the list sorted down to 10 cars or so that I will post up with the tuning rules. I am hoping that this would provide an interesting series and make for some good photo ops as well as close racing. This is more for a future series probably not for the up coming one.

Another one I would like to look at is a modern muscle / pony car series. Put the "big three" up against each other with the Mustang, the Camaro and a Dodge of some sort. I would hope we could find street cars that we could then set tuning rules for that would equalize them. I am not sure if there are race cars of all three. If so maybe we could make a series with that. Again it would look cool and hopefully fuel some close racing.

Another one would be a NASCAR series. I have not really messed with these much at all.

This is the car set I was thinking of to see if we can make a series.

• 500 Ford Mustang Boss 302 2013 45,000 North America Premium FR
• 498 SRT Charger SRT8 2011 46,660 North America Premium FR
• 498 Chevrolet Camaro SS 2010 35,000 North America Premium FR
• 490 SRT Challenger SRT8 2008 40,027 North America Premium FR
• 443 Ford Mustang V8 GT Coupe Premium 2007 48,500 North America Premium FR
• 456 Chrysler 300C 2005 34,780 North America Standard FR
• 451 Ford Mustang GT 2005 25,950 North America Standard FR
• 468 Pontiac GTO 5.7 Coupe 2004 34,490 North America Standard FR
• 460 Chevrolet Camaro SS 2000 22,150 North America Standard FR

I can see Spool in a 300C

And for the F40 Chalange on Comfort Soft we have

• Nick
• Air
• Dean
• Mudd (Ya I am volinteering him with out him knowing it)

Come on Spool you man enough? Or are you going to go back to hiding in the hair dressers car. cough cough S2000 cough cough. . .. . .

Wait I may have just about guaranteed that Spool is going to hand us a heaping helping of whoopass in the F40's.

Argo1 wrote: In reply to dean1484: Perfect! Dean's not good at it. I'm in!

I see that I am going to have to get up on the wheel for this series

dean1484 wrote:

Nick (Not-Stig) Comstock wrote: No tire and fuel wear for this season? The M5 was my favorite last season.

We could run it. Even though the races are short there would be some degradation of the tires that could be intresting.

Thinking about this some more the modern muscle cars with full on tire and fuel ware could be very interesting running them on race soft. Set the race length so you can make it but to a distance that you see the tires fall off. Intresting. .. .

I am board as you all may see. I am having convresations with my self here. LOL