Road Race / AutoX Project 1964 Dart Grüne Hölle

What carb are you using?  Maybe it was previously stated, and it sounds/looks like an Edelbrock.

In reply to pres589 (djronnebaum) :

Ding, you are correct sir!

No Metering Rods in a holley (usually)

Its an edelbrock Performer series / Carter AFB 500 CFM.

I would sure like to try the same carb in a 750 CFM Flavor too.. But that might be a moot point if I am going to do some MPEFI in a year or 2.

Greg

In reply to MadScientistMatt :

Yes Matt it sure is..Got the valves tidy'd up as well as a better tune in the Metering Rods / springs / primary jets in the Carb.. Ready for a roadtrip this weekend!

Maybe you  would consider coming up to the slant 6 race in wilkesboro NC Next weekend the 18th/19th? I plan to theve th car there as well.  so you could see it im person if you wanted to :-)

Greg

I think a 500 CFM AFB is plenty of carb for almost any 225 out there.

Floating Doc (Forum Supporter) said:

Definitely looking forward to that driving video!

Well I don't have any sophisticated video equipment but here's a quick video with the loud ass Burns Stainless 2 stage quiet muffler with no resonator on it, going up the mountain.

I am not sure what the audio is like on the phone..so here you go!

Greg

pres589 (djronnebaum) said:

I think a 500 CFM AFB is plenty of carb for almost any 225 out there.

Yes that is the conventional thinking.  Hoverer when I was happy with the tune of this exact 500CFM carb on my drag car... I  tried the Edelbrock/Carter 750 It picked up 0.2 in the 1/4 Mile. I just tried it for the sake of experimenting.. and it worked. This engine has less cam / lift than the other engine , but most everything else is the same.

And the 750 Holley was waaay too much... I tried one of those as well. I believe the edelbrock/carter CFM ratings are not apples to apples between holley / Edelbrock / demon / barry grant Carbs.

Greg

slantsix said:

Maybe you  would consider coming up to the slant 6 race in wilkesboro NC Next weekend the 18th/19th? I plan to theve th car there as well.  so you could see it im person if you wanted to :-)

Thanks for asking. Got kind of a limited budget (both time and money) for travel this year, so I'm kind of holding out for a later event to see if I can actually bring the Dart.

In reply to MadScientistMatt :

Got it. I understand.

6/14/21
Went on a bit of a trip this weekend to Chardon Ohio.. There was a MoPar Car show there and we also Made it a point to stop by Nelson Ledges on the way back.

Car was a blast to drive and did well - Got Caught in the rain on the way there and back, but while in Ohio it was sunny and dry pretty much the entire time.

- Car does not get great fuel mileage - maybe more carb tuning or double check the distributor timing.

- At Nelson Ledges it was a test n tune day and we got to stop in and spectate.

At the Show:

This car was interesting to me.

Of course you can't go to a well stocked mopar show with out a Christine Movie Car there..

Hisss..

Cool Stuff at Neslon Ledges too,

(this one's a Movie, Clicky to watch)

Greg

6/17/21

I got the secondary Bog sorted on the edelbrock performer 500. 2 solutions available for this problem in my research...

1. Modify / remove the small supply tube on the secondary venturi.. some models of carter / edelbrock  do not have this tube on the secondary venturis.. mine did.
I wanted to avoid this mod as its not easily reversible.

2. Drill the counterweight in the secondary air door. I did this and it's spot on.

Can be reversed by filling the hole with leas/ nits/ bolts or welding. The AVS and thermoquads have infintetly adjustable secondary doors with no drilling.

Bog is gone....ready for road trip and dragstrip blasts.

Greg

6/25/21

After coming home from the trip last week I wanted to Investigate the timing Curve. As I just got the engine fired and running say 3 or so weeks ago, I wanted to fiddle with Valve lash, Carb tuning and the like, which i did. After a few weeks of driving and fiddling with those settings I turned my attention to the timing. I was limited by the Stock slant 6 distributors' mechanical adjustment from ma MoPar, and with no proper parts to convert to a claw style hold down from a newer lean burn or 1980's up Slant 6 Distributor I had to do some grinding and clearancing / slotting on the stock hold down plate.
Before My Trip last week I was limited to 10° initial advance on the Distributor the limit was caused by the adjustment plate hitting the block as well as the arced slots - the hold down bolt(s) was hitting the end of the arc on the adjustment plate. I modded that and now was able to put a seemingly ridiculous amount of initial advance into the curve.
I decided on 14° initial and 32° Total. I also experimented with the Ported advance instead of the non ported vacuum on the carb. I was running the full vacuum advance signal to the distributor before and that caused a bog / flat spot as the vacuum went away with more throttle angle. .... So I tried the ported vacuum signal to the advance can and it likes that better. Now it sure feels better below 2000 RPM.

I might try another lighter advance spring in the mechanism sometime. I found that I can run the car on 87 octane under heavy load with no pinging at all. But it does diesel at times upon shutdown.

Greg

That doesn't surprise me - at idle and low RPM, typically all the extra advance you'd get from full manifold vacuum mostly just makes the idle less stable. If it diesels on shutdown, maybe the plugs are too high a heat range?

In reply to MadScientistMatt :

Matt, they are already pretty cold plugs.  I would have to look up specs.. but I ran them on the 13.5:1 comp. Ratio Drag engine with no issues.  I do have a colder set on the shelf however.

Greg

7/19/21  More Güne Hölle fun in the summer.

Last week, I took the car to Carlisle - Met with some friends, did some Mountain Road driving, Did the Carlisle Real Street Shootout Friday nite, then Went to the Central PA Region of the SCCA for a Proper AutoX at Midstate Airport in Phillipsburg Pa..  It's essentially a nice wide 2 runway airstrip with plenty of taxi areas in the middle of a central PA Lush Forest.

Some Pictures:
While staying overnite at my friend's house I had access to corner scales...  So Lets do some science and data..

Started out with Just above 3000# without Driver and Gear - 3/4 Tank Gas.

Made Adjustments to bars and rear coilovers..  Was able to get pretty close to 50-50 F/R but L/R was Right Heavy.

Final after Adjustments with Driver and Gear:

At Carlisle there were some like minded slant 6 handling fans... This is Chris' '70 Duster..

Some other odd, instersting Mopars..
Aussie Valiant Ambulance:

And a pair of Modded - '62 Valiants:

The AutoX at Carlisle was not terribly interesting, but it was fun.
I have some oversteer to now work on ... the Car ran well, except idling in the hot - I need to change out the mechanical 4 blade fan for some electric units.

Then Onto the SCCA AutoX at the airport on Sunday - about a 2 hour drive in the morning over the mountains... was a blast.  Got everything in before the torrential downpours.

Also Installed Some New Front Shocks Yesterday:

Found a long lost Twin for sale on the way home... whoodathink it..?

Onto the PVGP Countryside Tour Tomorrow!

Greg

Have a great time at the PVGP!  I love that event.  Its been too long since I've been back for one but it is a great event.

In reply to wawazat :

Thanks will do.. It's not the Actual Grand Prix.. That's on Sat / Sunday and I will be outta town, But there are tons of events during what they call "raceweek" it' 10 days of all things cars and vintage racing.  I am taking Grüne Hölle in the Coutryside tour...  I will post up about it tomorrow or wed.

There is also a PVGP Car cruise tomorrow evening in, the next county over - maybe I will try to make it to that as well.

Greg

I forgot about all the events leading up to the actual Grand Prix.  Have fun!

We lived in Pgh in the early to mid '90's and went a few times.  I took my kids back with us about 8 years ago and they enjoyed the city, but not the race so much.  I'll be back for sure when I'm comfortable with the mods being solid on my '69 Cougar.

In reply to wawazat :

Got it.. I am about 15 Miles outside the city Center.  The countryside tour is in my county outside of the Main Grand Prix / Schenley park Area..

Greg

How do you like those shocks? I'm currently on KYB Gas-A-Justs and I'm not sure where I might go if I need an upgrade.

In reply to MadScientistMatt :

Don't know yet... as I have yet to do any serious testing or adjustments with them.

I can tell you they are quite a bit lighter than any other shocks I have picked up that were not coilovers.

Greg

7/21/21

Had a pretty Epic Day yesterday - Ran about 150 Miles of Local Country and Mountain Roads with Grüne Hölle on the PVGP Countryside Tour. The car was solid, quick, nimble and stuck to the corners like glue. - much better than doing this event in my '69 Dart

After the tour was Over there was a PVGP Car Cruise the next county over at the Waterfront (site of the 1892 Homestead Steelworks Strike)
Was able to get some glamour shots of the car in front of the stacks during the "golden hour" which was even a bit more filtered than usual due to the smoke from the wildfires..

Some Pics from the tour:

Rest of the day went fine without a problem. and Made it to the farm for lunch.

glamour shots in homestead:

Was able to share the car cruise fun with kid in tow....

Greg

Totally awesome. I enjoyed the build portion of this thread but I think the use the car portion is even better!

In reply to New York Nick :

Thanks for the kind words Nick.  

More to come on both volumes of this book

Greg

Nice pictures! Is that red car a TVR?

In reply to MadScientistMatt :

Yep next to mine was a TVR of some flavor.

Greg