Corona Vaccine - Anyone getting it?

*sigh* So much anger at one another. Some of us just want to be left alone to live our lives however long or short they may be. Apparently that's no longer allowed.

Subscriber-unavailabile said:

In reply to newrider3 :

Yes I would. Like I've stated before unfortunate E36 M3 happens all the time. Kid could pull their own sock off and choke on it. 
Would you stop driving your car if you get into a wreck? Do you make sure the water your drinking isn't from a bpa free bottle? Maybe we should cut down all the trees, one might fall and kill someone. Maybe we should ban and make illegal all food products known to kill people.

As much as we all want to control what happens to us in life, there's a lot of it that we can't. 

We CAN control C19.  And unexpected trees falling only kills one or two people per year  If falling trees killed 1.5 million people in the last 10 months, I'm quite certain we would have a Arbor Safety Administration.

In reply to Curtis73 (Forum Supporter) :

We can fix malaria, 100%, but we don't eliminate it globally because of side effects that weren't known early on. 

bobzilla said:

*sigh* So much anger at one another. Some of us just want to be left alone to live our lives however long or short they may be. Apparently that's no longer allowed.

I don't care if you live your life for as long or short as you want, I simply ask that you don't take hundreds of us along with you.  I'm not angry, just confused at how the group of people who tends to cling to individual rights is insisting on inadvertently removing my individual rights to not be exposed to a deadly virus.

In effect, it feels like those people are saying "I deserve my individual rights... at the potential expense of everyone else's right to not become deathly ill because of my vectoring a disease while exercising that freedom"  I agree with the first part.  The fact that so many people don't understand the second part is what confuses me.

bobzilla said:

*sigh* So much anger at one another. Some of us just want to be left alone to live our lives however long or short they may be. Apparently that's no longer allowed.

When doing so involves taking my life or those of people I care about?  Yeah I'm going to be angry.  I told you what I thought of this behavior of yours on FB, it still applies.

You wanna kill yourself?  Go for it.  Wanna take a bunch of people out while doing so?  That's quite shiny of you and should result in a lot challenges to your freedom.

Not sure how "left alone" turns into murder but you go people. You go. Worlds ending apparently

bobzilla said:

Not sure how "left alone" turns into murder but you go people. You go. Worlds ending apparently

I am pretty sure no one has an issue with you (or anyone) being "left alone" in general.  If you live on an isolated island, it will never be an issue.

It becomes and issue when there are 10's of millions of people who want to be left alone.  This is because they now become a potential threat to others (the point where freedom generally ends).  How big this threat is not entirely clear at this point (and is certainly up for debate), but the threat is still there.

Am I explaining that reasonably?  Do you find it an unreasonable concern? (not being snarky, I would very much like you to understand the concern many have)

Haven't we all been exposing each other to hundreds of viruses and bacteria on a daily basis? 
One drop of seawater has what 10 million  viruses,1 million bacteria in it, so let's vaccinate the ocean??

God forbid I run over a nail, have a blowout and swerve into a van full of kids. 

And that highlights why I'm so confused.  We just explained that to you.

Your "left alone" to be free to do what you want means potentially spreading death.  I get that you don't understand or believe that which is why I'm not angry.  I just find the refusal or inability to grasp it confusing.

Funniest part of all this. Come to Texas, we've had our freedom for long ass time. So much law enforcement doesn't enforce mask. Oh and before that gets flamed. My bosses husband is an ICU nurse. And you can't ever find my boss wearing a mask. Because he's evil, or knows something we don't..

Subscriber-unavailabile said:

Haven't we all been exposing each other to hundreds of viruses and bacteria on a daily basis? 
One drop of seawater has what 10 million  viruses,1 million bacteria in it, so let's vaccinate the ocean??

God forbid I run over a nail, have a blowout and swerve into a van full of kids. 

 Billions, actually.  None of which can kill you by slowly suffocating you and infecting countless others in the process.

If I shake your hand and it has some distilled water on it, it doesn't hurt you.  If I shake your hand and it has some anthrax on it and you die, you might be a little miffed... but hey... freedom.

If you are that concerned, get the vaccine and those that have are no longer a threat to you. Seems simple to me. Calling people murders and and everything under the sun seems a bit... wierd. What happened to live and let live?

/bobzilla said:

If you are that concerned, get the vaccine and those that have are no longer a threat to you. Seems simple to me. Calling people murders and and everything under the sun seems a bit... wierd. What happened to live and let live?

What about those who are unable to get the vaccine?

In reply to Subscriber-unavailabile :

I'm not sure that approach is working for Texas.

bobzilla said:

If you are that concerned, get the vaccine and those that have are no longer a threat to you. Seems simple to me. Calling people murders and and everything under the sun seems a bit... wierd. What happened to live and let live?

No one called anyone a murderer.  And in this situation, it isn't live and let live, it's live and let me spread a disease.  Getting the vaccine may help me.  It doesn't help anyone who can't get the current vaccine due to allergies, people who are near the end of the list for the vaccine and die waiting, or people who are in the 5% that the vaccine doesn't help.

The vaccine is produced in enough supply to get healthcare workers and a few others.  New supply will likely be unavailable until June/July.

I could weigh in but my position would be totally redundant to Curtis73's, so I'll just say...

"yah, what Curtis73 has been saying"

The thing people often forget is it the virus has a success rate. Whatever it is, no matter how good the vaccine is, it is a number. That number could be very low, say 85%, but if the whole of the country gets it the virus will likely disappear. Even if the vaccine is much better than that, The fact that a large portion of the population doesn't get it means that the virus will still be raging. And those people that are vaccinated and in that minority that did not get immunity are going to be far worse off than they would have been otherwise.

Subscriber-unavailabile said:

Funniest part of all this. Come to Texas, we've had our freedom for long ass time. So much law enforcement doesn't enforce mask. Oh and before that gets flamed. My bosses husband is an ICU nurse. And you can't ever find my boss wearing a mask. Because he's evil, or knows something we don't..

Strange. I work in Dallas. You can't get into my building without a mask on. The armed guard at the front desk won't let you. Security is pretty tight around here. Cameras are everywhere. I park in the basement protected by a huge electric metal gate. My home is well protected too. I go nowhere else. 

Freedom ends where private property begins. 

In reply to Curtis73 (Forum Supporter) :

Problem is numbers can't be fully trusted. Been proven hospitals get more money for Covid deaths so there's an incentive to report deaths due to Covid. If I die in a car wreck and have a 1% viral load then on my death certificate it'll list Covid. Someone can have 1% viral load, have  diabetes, pulmonary disorder, heart disease, and have a stroke and they've now died from Covid.

84% of people that died from this had underlying conditions. Could Covid cause more issues, yes, but it's also plausible they're counting all deaths due to Covid. Again why would anyone report people  that didn't die from Covid when there's money to made

And I just want to say I'm not replying back in anger. These kind of civil discussions are very rare these days 

Subscriber-unavailabile said:

In reply to Curtis73 (Forum Supporter) :

If I die in a car wreck and have a 1% viral load then on my death certificate it'll list Covid. 

I do not think this is correct or that you know with certainty that it is correct, so why say it?

In reply to Subscriber-unavailabile :

there's a really big fallacy here that I'm surprised we haven't stumbled upon yet. Comorbidities are part of nearly every death certificate ever written. It's not covid specifically causing this, almost everybody who dies has more than one thing that they die from.

Yet the excess deaths this year (looking just at numbers compared year to year) nearly match the reported COVID deaths. And that is in a year when people stuck closer to home, which would correlate to fewer traffic and other deaths--meaning that if anything, year-to-year analysis probably under-represents COVID deaths. 
 

I have immune issues that put me at higher risk, plus I am pushing 60. That alone would convince me to get the vaccine. But first and foremost, as a member of human society, I have a duty to do my part to protect the world that affords me the ability to exist as anything other than a subsistence farmer. You don't wanna do that, fine, but I hope you're planning to move to a remote spot and withdraw from human relations, because otherwise, you are not holding up your end of the social contract. You're just allowing others to put in the work and hoping to suck off their efforts. And society should judge you harshly for that.
 

Sorry, that's just how the math works. 
 

Margie

I just appreciate that some people didn't live in London in the early 1940s, as they wouldn't have been able to be bothered to turn their lights off. 

In reply to captdownshift (Forum Supporter) :

I am just wondering how the polio pandemic of the 40s and 50s would have gone down if we had social media and the polarization back then that we have today. And yes, I am old enough to have been given the sugar cube when I was a kid.