Concours Judging

Not sure if time for suggestions has passed but in having to come up with a build plan quickly for a class and car different than anticipated it's occurred to me there's a potential for a problem if the concurs is done how it has been jn years past. 

I'm thinking it would be wise to group classes together, it stands to reason GTU$ builds are likely to be more "interesting" than a GTN$ car. For example the 3400 swapped Miata is insanely cool and had just as much effort/engineering into it as say a Nelson family car but where are you going to gravitate? 

Byrneon27 said:

...it stands to reason GTU$ builds are likely to be more "interesting" than a GTN$ car.

LMP360:

I'm just not feeling this part of the challenge.  I bought a car.  It's red.  I did some stuff to it.  Look at it.  Or not. 

In reply to AnthonyGS (Forum Supporter) :

That's fine--register for only the drags and autocross and skip the concours.

The concours is why this is called the Challenge: Your car needs to be attractive, not just fast. 

In reply to Tom Suddard :

The car will be attractive.  It'll be very attractive.  The word I hear is that attractive doesn't mean much though.  I was working to making it more attractive and then it was recommended I was wasting my time.  It won't be fast enough....  so attractive was my only chance.  And it would have to be the car, not me....

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=PxuUkYiaUc8

In reply to Tom Suddard :

I've never had the chance to attend. I'd never heard of it befor I joined this site to ask a particular car question. 
But I was under the impression that the "Challenge" races were to show that an inexpensively built car could still be raced competitively. 
From everything I've read on here from folks that love it, I have been under the impression that the "concourse"was a tongue in cheek way to have fun. 

In reply to 03Panther :

The concours is an important (and competitive) part of the event. Here are details from the rules:

Concours:

Cars will be parked in a centralized location, with hoods, trunks and doors opened for the judges and competitors to view. Entrants will have 3 minutes maximum to present their cars and share their story with the judges. We’ve compiled a list of of open-ended questions (view them here) that entrants may use to help present their cars if they haven’t prepared their own presentation. One minute of bonus time may be awarded by the judges. Cars will be judged on innovation, execution and presentation, and scoring will be as such:

Innovation: 0-10 points

Execution: 0-10 points

Presentation: 0-5 points

“Innovation” covers things like design, engineering, creativity and modifications.

“Execution” covers things like perceived safety, cleanliness, workmanship and attention to detail.

“Presentation” covers things like originality, theme, showmanship, team spirit, moxie, chutzpah, backstory and anything else that falls under the heading of “je ne sais quoi.”

Any entrant that does not want to go through the concours judging process may decline to be judged by writing "Don't Judge Me" on a piece of tape placed on the upper driver-side corner of the windshield of their car. Cars properly displaying this message that are parked in the centralized concours judging location for the duration of judging will be awarded 12 concours points.

Before judging, Concours judges will be shown the 12-point Concours Example. This will be done in an attempt to calibrate the judges.

Running engines are not allowed under the concours pavilion during the concours (see the schedule for exact times); violators will receive a five-point concours score deduction.

To answer the original question: Yes, we'll group classes together. 

There can only be one overall winner. Sooner or later they have to be judged against each other, no matter how random or arbitrary the criteria seems. 

SV reX said:

There can only be one overall winner. Sooner or later they have to be judged against each other, no matter how random or arbitrary the criteria seems. 

In the challenge, such as in life - there's what you do, and there's how you present what you do to the world. Both are important and lots of good 'do-ers' sell themselves short by never learning how to present the good work they do appropriately. 

Just another reason all high school kids should build a challenge car...

In reply to Robbie (Forum Supporter) :

I agree

03Panther said:

In reply to Tom Suddard :

I've never had the chance to attend. I'd never heard of it befor I joined this site to ask a particular car question. 
But I was under the impression that the "Challenge" races were to show that an inexpensively built car could still be raced competitively. 
From everything I've read on here from folks that love it, I have been under the impression that the "concourse"was a tongue in cheek way to have fun. 

Concourse is very important. Just look back at how much Captdownshift whined after I beat him with a strong concourse score. He's still a little butt hurt but then again I would be also if I lost to an 84 Buick Riviera. 

Concours is a really cool part of the Challenge. It's like a E36 M3box triathlon: running and biking use your legs, but why should you use your arms for swimming? The point is you're still using your fitness to go the distance. Likewise, we use our grassroots building methods to make a car powerful (drags) and nimble (auto-x), but also to make it look good and improve the overall quality. 

Autocross is the opposite of drag racing. Doing both well means compromise. 
 

Concours is the opposite of low budget. Doing both well means compromise. 
 

The event is not the event without the Concours.

Make good choices in your compromises. You can't win without all 4. 

My car is too slow to win.  That's just a fact.  Looks was all it had to offer, and I was told by a former competitor it doesn't factor in because of the "innovation" and "presentation" portions of the concourse.  I was told it will help getting photo'd but that's about it.  There is little to no innovation in my car honestly.  It's pretty basic and it will be slow in the drag race.  Oh well; we'll see.  The wife already has plans around this trip.  Maybe I will feel differently after being there.  Right now I feel like the challenge for me happened in 2000 when I really wanted to go and could not.  Now, I'm not so sure it's for me. 

In reply to AnthonyGS (Forum Supporter) :

Tom may correct me but I'm pretty sure you can still "take a 12".  That means they don't judge you in concours and you get a score of 12.  You get to hang out and chill and the judges don't have to spend time looking at your detailed stock car.  Not going to name names but some Escort people should have taken a 12 last year.

In reply to Stampie :

My car isn't stock..... close, but not stock.

In reply to Stampie :

Pretty sure Tom already said that halfway up the page, my man.

In reply to AnthonyGS (Forum Supporter) :

Have you seen the 12-point Concours Example? That might help your decision. 

And looks absolutely matter, but they're not everything. I thought I outlined it fairly well when quoting the rules. 

Anyone who has lived longer than 5 minutes knows there are unwritten rules in anything especially if judgement comes into it.  I get it.  If I'm going to the challenge, I'm doing all parts of it. 

Stampie said:

Concourse is very important. Just look back at how much Captdownshift whined after I beat him with a strong concourse score. He's still a little butt hurt but then again I would be also if I lost to an 84 Buick Riviera. 

Oh, yea. I get the importance. I just couldn't agree with the statement "The concours is why this is called the Challenge" that Tom made. 
Again, I have no horse in this fight  Since the crazy started, I might not ever make it!