FMV for Recoups, Celica Edition

Hi all,

First time GRM Challenger here. I bought TB's 2002 Celica from last year's Challenge and I need to establish some FMV/recoup values for things I've changed or removed from the car for this year.  I hoard Celica parts (I'm told there are 12 step programs for this sort of thing... they tried to make me go to rehab but I said no, no, no...), so I chose to sell things back to my parts shelf rather than sell them off as I have other car(s) to use the parts for. If pics or more details are needed for any of the items please let me know.

A. First, I want confirmation of a claim under the Emergency Repair/Wear & Tear Rule.  The battery, alternator, and harmonic balancer had been replaced a month prior to our purchase and were within their respective warranty periods.  We flew in to buy the car in PA and drove it home to TX.  En route, the alternator failed and took out the battery with it. Being in the middle of rural VA late at night and 1,300 miles from home, obtaining the receipts and getting a warranty replacement from the original place of purchase was not an option so we found the nearest open auto parts store to get us back on the road. Likewise the brand new harmonic balancer failed 150 miles from home.  Rather than deal with getting the seller to obtain a warranty replacement and get it to us, we towed the car home and Rock Auto-ed up an OEM equivalent replacement pulley. So in the interest of transparency I wanted to confirm these 3 items as budget exempt under the Emergency Repair rule.

RECOUPS:

1. KYB AGX adjustable shocks, set of 4.  They came on the car - were bought new for last year's Challenge and were only on the car a couple months/<3000 miles so they were in excellent condition when removed from car upon my purchase.  Here are some eBay Buy It Now listings from 3 different sellers:  If you take the average and multiply that by 50% it's $250.67 which is what I'm seeking for recoup.

eBay $503.85 set of 4 https://www.ebay.com/itm/313635828003?epid=28035421984&hash=item490626f123:g:SX4AAOSw-pthFNmg

eBay $503.85 set of 4 (different seller) https://www.ebay.com/itm/313635828003?epid=28035421984&hash=item490626f123:g:SX4AAOSw-pthFNmg

eBay $496.30 set of 4 https://www.ebay.com/itm/251509309029?hash=item3a8f1f7e65:g:SqIAAOSw9r1V8g-Z

2. Megan Racing lowering springs, set of 4.  Same story as above - came on the car - were bought new for last year's Challenge and only on the car for a couple months/<3000 miles so they were in excellent condition when removed from car upon my purchase. Here are some seller listings.  If you take the average and multiply by 50% it's $101 which is what I'm seeking for recoup.

eBay $188 set of 4 https://www.ebay.com/itm/303544991228?fits=Model%3ACelica&epid=1156603873&hash=item46acb0fdfc:g:oDMAAOSw7QdenJlz

Fitment Industries $189 set of 4 https://www.fitmentindustries.com/store/suspension/70810/megan-racing-lowering-springs-00-03-toyota-celica

vivid racing $229 set of 4 https://www.vividracing.com/megan-racing-orange-performance-lowering-springs-toyota-celica-0005-p-150916753.html

3. Energy Suspension poly motor mount inserts.  They came with the car but were never used or installed, so they're in new condition. Here are some seller listings.  Taking the average including shipping and multiplying by 50% is $24.43 which is what I'm seeking for recoup.

Monkeywrench Racing $39 + shipping ($14.48 shipping to my address). https://www.monkeywrenchracing.com/product/energy-susp-bushing-kit-celicacorolla-engine-mount-inserts/

Amazon $44.96 https://www.amazon.com/Energy-Suspension-8-1101R-MOTOR-INSERTS/dp/B0018LMSD2

Amazon $48.14 (different seller) https://www.amazon.com/Energy-Suspension-8-1101R-MOTOR-INSERTS/dp/B0018LMSD2

4.  Yokohama Advan Fleva 205/45/16 300 TW tires, set of 4, 2019 date code. 8/32 tread (new is 9.4/32 tread).  Used by last owner for Challenge and under 3000 street miles before I removed them from car so that I could use them on my daily driver.  Taking the average including shipping and multiplying by 50% is $226.73 which is what I'm seeking for recoup.

Tire Rack $457.48 set of 4, https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Yokohama&tireModel=ADVAN+Fleva+V701&sidewall=Blackwall&partnum=045WR6V701XL&tab=Specs

Tire Outlet $466.88, set of 4, https://www.tireoutlet.com/tires/view/279646/yokohama-advan-fleva-v701-205-45r16/

Discount Tire $436, set of 4, https://www.discounttire.com/buy-tires/yokohama-advan-fleva-v701

5. Stock 16x6.5 5 spoke Celica GTS alloy wheels, painted pink.  I can't find any comp ads, but I've bought very similar non-pink wheels from the local Wrench-A-Part for $25.87 + $12.93 core charge each.  They could be stripped and refinished but I haven't made it a priority to do so.  Maybe I'll get to it, or maybe I'll just dress up the daily driver for Valentine's Day... Since the current pink paint may impact their value to the general public, I was looking for a recoup value of $10 each/ $40 total recoup for the set of 4.

6.  Diehard Silver 500 CCA battery from Advance Auto, sticker says new in 11/20. The battery in my daily driver died 3/21, and this was a direct fit, so I took this one out of the Challenge car to use in my daily and bought a $121.70 lightweight motorcycle battery for the Challenge car.  So I need a recoup value for selling this one to my daily driver.  50% value would be $80.

Advance Auto Parts $159.99 + core charge https://shop.advanceautoparts.com/p/diehard-silver-battery-group-size-35-500-cca-35-1/2040050-P?navigationPath=L1*14920%7CL2*15000%7CL3*15597%7CL4*13646

B.  FMV of Cobra Monaco Race seat.  I posted up on some FB pages looking for old race seats.  Someone I knew responded and dumped this "gem" off at my driveway for Free-fitty.  It is old enough to vote, has lived outside through a decade or so of Texas weather in an open racecar, left a trail of crumbled foam behind it wherever it went in case you wanted it to find its way home (trust me, you wouldn't), and smells as good as it looks (I really can't describe the unique odor of the decaying fabric and organic matter and ??? that this thing put off, especially when I tried to hose it off and the foam just congealed into large squishy clumps...). I truly think I got the worse end of the bargain compared to the guy who got rid of it for zero dollars...  I'd like confirmation that it is, in fact trash with a value of nil.

C.  FMV of a used mattress pad with areas of cat claw damage and damage/stains from nesting rodents.  I think I paid around $15 when it was new several years ago though I'm not sure if I still have a receipt for it; it was used in our guest room for a while, and then stowed in a closet and some animals, uh, molested it.  I was going to throw it out but decided to salvage what I could for padding for the above race seat and making cat beds out of.  Used mattress pads are a common dumpster item.  Can we agree that this is trash with a value of $0?

D.  I have a pair of used Eibach springs that I've had on the garage shelf for years - I don't remember where or when or how much I got them for but I want to use them on the front of the GRM car.  I have another pair of Eibach springs that I bought this year off a Facebook buy/sell page to use specifically for the rear of the car for $55.  And two other pairs of Eibach springs I bought off eBay earlier this year with the Challenge car in mind for $85/pair but decided not to use.  I have receipts for all of these. I'd like to average the prices of these three pairs of springs as FMV for the used pair off my shelf that I want to put on the front unless the hive mind says otherwise. That would be $75.

E.  Final FMV question (for now).  Used eBay coilover sleeves (without the springs).  I know it's come up before, but I couldn't find the post(s).  What was their agreed upon value?  $15?  $20? 

Thanks for all the help!  This has certainly been a learning experience.

To be honest that's a lot of stuff to be asking us to go through.  Looks like most of it can be done by looking at Ebay finished auctions and doing the FMV yourself.

Roadside repair A is fair. Though buying TB's handiwork could arguably be construed as "known poor condition" :) 

Let me just say that in general I really dislike FMV for self-sales. It takes a ton of actual effort out of the Challenge, which in my opinion goes against the spirit of the event. However self-trades are allowed in the rules and this is racing, so I understand our collective obligation to push those rules to the limit. So recoups 1-6 I agree are all very fair, but I am not sure about #4. Tires are free in the budget, so I don't know if that applies to recoup as well. If someone can clarify that we're allowed to recoup tires, then I agree on all accounts. It just seems kinda cheaty because theoretically if your car came with brand new tires you wanted to race on, you could sell those for reocup to yourself then re-buy from yourself for free. 

B and C I literally threw away a seat that looked exactly like yours. That's free, and also gross. But not as gross as a used mattress pad.

D sounds fair to me. 

E a quick ebay search shows the only used coilover sleeves available are $20 (each, not a pair). Without pictures of condition of yours, I'd call them $20 each.

maschinenbau said:

 Though buying TB's handiwork could arguably be construed as "known poor condition" :) 

I cannot dispute this, you all know me way too well...

I'm probably not the right guy to offer advice on the finer points of budgetary issues, but I just want to say that it is nice to see the old girl still alive and kicking. Good luck

maschinenbau said:

Roadside repair A is fair. Though buying TB's handiwork could arguably be construed as "known poor condition" :) 

Let me just say that in general I really dislike FMV for self-sales. It takes a ton of actual effort out of the Challenge, which in my opinion goes against the spirit of the event. However self-trades are allowed in the rules and this is racing, so I understand our collective obligation to push those rules to the limit. So recoups 1-6 I agree are all very fair, but I am not sure about #4. Tires are free in the budget, so I don't know if that applies to recoup as well. If someone can clarify that we're allowed to recoup tires, then I agree on all accounts. It just seems kinda cheaty because theoretically if your car came with brand new tires you wanted to race on, you could sell those for reocup to yourself then re-buy from yourself for free. 

B and C I literally threw away a seat that looked exactly like yours. That's free, and also gross. But not as gross as a used mattress pad.

D sounds fair to me. 

E a quick ebay search shows the only used coilover sleeves available are $20 (each, not a pair). Without pictures of condition of yours, I'd call them $20 each.

I agree with these thoughts: The tires are questionable, FMV self-trades are "not-well-liked" but legal. Also I'm a bit confused about the battery - you emergency repaired it and then FMV self-traded it? I'd probably simplify that transaction and say that you just FMV self-traded the original good battery to yourself. 

For the FMV self-trades, since you seem like a celica person, do those values feel right to you? Would those items sell for your prices on a celica forum? 

As for the battery, whatever the local yard sells batteries for. Prorating a price on a battery based off of age is something that's done for warranty work but I've never seen one sold based off of the percentage of warranty remaining. 

For used springs and struts to get more than yard prices, I would want to find forum, Craigslist or Facebook marketplace listings. As the value decreases extensively once they're installed. Even if they only have a few thousand miles on them it's not remotely close to the value of never installed. (I'm admittedly curious what you're installing to replace the AGXs as well, as good condition AGXs are likely to out perform it). 

Tires are budget exempt for up to 4. So there's no need to have the value on them. 

For the other items I'm good with the values. 

Just thought of something. Pretty sure you can use tb's budget and remove those items at full budget. Brb for a hopeful edit.

Edit. Sometimes I think I'm the only one that reads the rules.

Previous $2000 Challenge cars that have been bought/sold for less than $2000 may start with a fresh budget on a blank sheet of paper or maintain the original budget at the entrant’s discretion.

In reply to Stampie :

You're definitely not the only one who has. I'm surprised that you haven't utilized this as you have entered multiple cars and then traded parts off of previously entered car A onto previously entered car B or even onto new build car C. 

Robbie (Forum Supporter) said:

... FMV self-trades are "not-well-liked" but legal

i didn't have to scroll up again to see who that comment was from.  ;-) 

In reply to Stampie :

I'll admit that I don't really read the rules. Reading is less fun than wrenching...

iirc, I handed in my budget sheet with my buld book so it might take some work to come up with those figures 

In reply to Robbie (Forum Supporter) :

Celica forums (and most car marquee forums TBH) are pretty much dead, but on the Celica FB pages aftermarket mods including suspension bits tend to get snatched up fast, so yes, I think that half of new cost for barely used suspension components is a bargain.

In reply to captdownshift (Forum Supporter) :

Thanks for weighing in. I'll take the tires out per the concensus.

Regarding the shocks and springs, new listings are all I could find for those brands. Celica forums are pretty well dead, but on the FB pages, aftermarket parts tend to get snatched up fast, especially the more reputable names like KYB and Megan Racing (it's not a well-supported platform for performance parts, so these are in fact among the better brands for Celica parts). I FMV'd them at 50% of their new value which is my rule of thumb when shopping for a used item in good working order.  Since these are in excellent working order with no cosmetic blemishes, I'd personally consider 50% to be a bargain. 

In reply to maschinenbau :

Here is the requested photo of the used eBay coilover sleeves. After digging through my old, old archived emails I found the invoice from when I bought them new on 8/12/2009 for $48.80 ($20.80 + $28 shipping) for the entire kit of 4 sleeves, 4 springs, and hardware.  The sleeves were damaged by rubbing when I used them on my Miata and went back on the garage shelf after I sold the car but I'm now fungineering them to make them work on my Celica for the Challenge.  I'm just using 2 of the sleeves as pictured but not the springs or other hardware. 

In reply to 2HorsePower :

Your receipt makes FMV moot, so just use that in your budget. Divide your sale  price + shipping by 2 since you're only using half of them. If you can sell the springs, then do so and recoup them, otherwise they were part of the deal to get the sleeves.

In reply to maschinenbau :

With all due respect, 12 year old eBay coilover sleeves with damaged threads from use/spring rub (the damage is on both sides) aren't worth new retail value.  Yes, I bought them new for my street Miata back in 2009, long before I even knew the Challenge existed, I used them on that car for several years, and because I'm a pack rat who has problems letting go, I tossed them on a shelf, damage and all, after I put the Miata back to stock to sell it. I just re-found this thread (it was the one I'd seen but forgotten where I'd seen it) from last year's Challenge for an identical set (the box is even the same) where the consensus was a $15 for the whole set. 

https://grassrootsmotorsports.com/forum/2000-challenge/fmv-on-misc-coilover-sleeve-stuff/170627/page1/

In reply to 2HorsePower :

I think he's saying that the actual paid price of $48 /2 is $24 which is darn close to your fmv request of $15-$20, so you don't really need to fmv that item (unless the $4 puts you over budget).

Usually real paid prices are preferred to fmv (for a whole host of reasons) and it gets you where you asked quickly and easily in this case.

Just looked at your link, you have a pretty good argument for fmv at $15 I'd say.

I don't think you need us for that!