1985 BMW 318 Stage Rally Build - 1988 Porsche 924S Street Build - Sequoia Build

irish44j wrote:

fidelity101 wrote: this is coming a long verrrry nicely! I'm hoping to see you guys in frostburg this year!

Hell yeah...though I don't know if I'll give you the same level of competition that I did at GLDivs a couple years ago, haha....I'm starting to mentally add up all the weight I'm adding to this car for stage and thinking about how little/much it's going to hurt me in rallycross SHould be a great event though - our region runs a tight ship and we get in a LOT of runs in a big area, generally, with few delays during the day. Hopefully if the national office is running the Eastern States Championship they can run it as efficiently (though somehow I doubt it).

that shouldn't matter all that much.

So, we're doing stuff

Love the new space location!

Looking really good!

Cage looks good so far, and I agree that the spare should stay where it is

I'm very interested in just how much tube/plate/wire/gas ends up going into the car to get from nothing to fully caged and legal.

IIRC Ozgur said it was about 80 total feet of tube (both sizes). We've used a sheet of 18 gauge steel (IIRC) for tacos. Looks like my 10lb spool of .035 wire is gone now, and I just refilled my tank (60) today. Still have to add the back braces (cut but not installed), but all the material-intesive stuff is done at this point.

In reply to irish44j:

Thanks, that's actually less than I thought for tubing, but I guess Ozgur has done a few of these and there's not much trial and error happening.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯ wrote: In reply to irish44j: Thanks, that's actually less than I thought for tubing, but I guess Ozgur has done a few of these and there's not much trial and error happening.

Well, a bit of trial and error, but mostly on my part lol....

well, cage build is coming along. Ozgur worked until 7pm yesterday with me and we got most of the main components in (plinth boxes, main cage structure, harness bars, roof bars, etc). I still have a few tacos to make and add on, and I need to install the rear stays later this week. All in all went fairly smoothly, though my welding remains quite un-pretty. Getting great penetration and heat signatures on the tubes, but damn I really need to work on making them look good lol. That said, looking at some of my first welds on the cage and my most recent, it's night and day (and Ozgur did a lot of them too, and he's much better than I am).

In any case, since we used plinth boxes and were able to drop the cage down to do the top welds, the cage is VERY tight to the structure of the car. Like within 1mm at the a-pillar tops, and right along the door cards (with just enough room for my hand-crank windows to rotate if I shorten the knob). Also because the car is a sedan we had to "massage" the bottom of the b-pillar for clearance on the door bars and sill bars. In the end, turned out pretty good and I've been able to tie in some new seatbelt lower brackets directly into both the b-pillar and the lower door bar.

Why seatbelts, you ask? Because, I want to drive the car on the street and we all know that 6-point harnesses are not legal...the car is noticeable enough so don't want to give the police any reason to ticket me....So, seatbelts are retained.....though I hope the retractors don't break because removing them would be next to impossible, lol.

Anyhow, a bunch of random pics. More to come as I progress.

Ozgur showing Andy how to help out

Ozgur doing some overhead welding

Yesterday

Door fitament....tight, just how I wanted it.

Rear plinth box. Welding that close to the gas tank (and fuel pump on the other side) was a bit scary...

Front plinth box. Before you say anything, yes I have to strip that rear edge and tie it into the sill. Totally spaced on that one..

A-pillar bar fitament

Tacos! Need to add one more on this side and then do the other side [imgl]http://i78.photobucket.com/albums/j85/irish44j/BMW%20318i%20Rally%202016/IMG_20160118_132242563.jpg

Seatbelt mount and tie-tin

As it looked earlier today

Roof bars. clearance in the front for the roof scoop

And a couple ugly weld pics so you can make fun of me

So that's about it for now....

So after several days of sore knees, a few welding spatter burns (mostly on my ankles..grr), and sitting and lying in every known position - particularly in the trunk - well.....the car has a completed cage!

A few points of note: First, we built this cage to be TIGHT to the car. The door bars touch the b-pillars (and are welded to them), and the A-pillar bars almost touch as well. Gives more room and better sightlines from inside the car. To do this we dropped it off of plinth/sill boxes to weld the tops and then lifted it back onto them.

We also used a bent windshield bar to snug up better to the roof and allow straight roof bars for better headroom. A test-fit in my seat and my helmet doesn't hit anything no matter how hard I try - not the roof bars and not the side hoops. So that's good, because I just dropped a good chunk of money on a nice new helmet...

What else....well, if you look closely at the pics you can see my welds are not the prettiest things in the world, but they are strong with good heat patterns and that's what matters. This is a rally car, not a cars-and-coffee showmobile.

Otherwise, it was just a matter of fitting, more fitting, welding, more welding, etc. For paint, since it's 30 degrees now with a blizzard coming tomorrow I just did a quick brush-on job to keep it from rusting. Can't spray in the garage and sure as hell not going outside to do it. I'll make it look nicer in the spring when the weather is nicer.

So, here are a few pics. Now to clean up the disaster area in the garage and start putting the rest of the car back together (including figuring out how to get the dash back in). That reminds me, you'll notice there is no dash bar. That is "for now" since it's not required for rally. I plan to add one in the spring, but don't have enough tubing, a bender handy, or sufficient time to deal with it right now.

Now time for Snowmageddon. The WRX and Sequoia are both sitting on their snow tires and ready to go do some snow-hooning with 18-24" on the way :)

Really... dash bar not required? That weird.

paperpaper wrote: Really... dash bar not required? That weird.

I thought it was weird too. I fully intend to put one in anyhow though. Just can't get it done in time for the winter rally so will do it in the spring.

more more more more more!!!!

That looks great. Its nice to spend the extra time and get the cage in there tight, well worth the effort!

We had one minor hiccup in that apparently RA requires that the roof bars be within 100mm of the corner junction of the windshield bar and the side hoops. And as it turns out, we did them at about 130mm. Apparently one of the regional instructors here in the NE is a stickler for that rule, so I just finished cutting the roof "V" out and will put new bars in to meet the letter of the rule, as silly as it seems to be. Not a big deal, more annoyed than anything...

Been talking to someone who is on the RA/NRS rules board and he had a few other minor suggestions (not required elements), like a couple extra gussets here and there just to strengthen things - most of which I will do.

It's about to snow 30" in the next 48 hours here, so I suspect I'll have lots of time to put the dash back in and do all the wiring over the weekend (when not shoveling). I don't have enough DOM tubing here to build the new bars so will do those after I get another length of tubing.

java230 wrote: That looks great. Its nice to spend the extra time and get the cage in there tight, well worth the effort!

Yeah, Ozgur (who designed it) was very clear about it being an "enthusiast" cage (harder to build, but tighter and stronger) vice most shop-built cages, which are designed to be easier and quicker to install, but are often not as tight to the car, or as strong (floor mounts vs. plinth boxes there).

You are listening to Gene. That's a good thing. He is very helpful to people in and out of his region.

Cage looks good!

Looking good Josh! Ozgur is the man, cage looks top notch. Any plans to run SandBlast this year?

CLynn85 wrote: Looking good Josh! Ozgur is the man, cage looks top notch. Any plans to run SandBlast this year?

Probably not...doing Wellsboro Winter rallysprint (SCCA this year, not RA) as a shakedown (and because hey, how much trouble can I get in at a snow rally with a RWD car going 30mph lol).

I considered Sandblast, but 1) Getting a NASA license requires getting a physical and the "doctor's note" which I probably won't have time to do (and to be honest, I'm afraid of what he'll say haha) and 2) we're running Chumpcar at VIR in March, and I'm buying the season membership for rallycross again this year too - so those together are going to wipe out my racing budget for a bit. I'm saving up for STPR in the summer.

Basically, going to start the rally thing slow mostly due to budget. It already cost me more to get this car spec'd for rally than it had cost me do do almost everything I did to it in the last 4 years, so this year WMWR, STPR, and maybe one in the autumn if budget allows (plus rallycross and/or any interesting rallysprints that come up within reasonable distance).

More or less, I'm not gonna be that guy who hauls all over the country to rally. I'm gonna pick 1 or 2 that I really want to do each year in the eastern US and just enjoy it, and keep doign rallycross and road racing. My mortgage, wife, and 2 kids don't really permit more than that, lol. I may also do some crewing for Jesse (Yuvali) or Ozgur or Nonack if I'm not driving....TBD.

NGTD wrote: You are listening to Gene. That's a good thing. He is very helpful to people in and out of his region. Cage looks good!

Yep, he seems helpful (and available to answer questions). Which is good since the various rally organizations don't otherwise seem to be very....organized. I've probably sent a dozen emails to various people within NRS and RA asking clarifying questions about this or that, and I've received a grand total of zero replies

So we're at about 30" and it's still snowing here. The WRX even on wintersports had zero chance of going anywhere (couldn't even get up my street), so I had to take the big boy for some "rescue cruising." Did pull out a stuck Altima and help out a few other people. The Sequoia on good Revo2's (winter rated) is damn near unstoppable and I did some untracked/lightly tracked hill/woodland roads where I stopped and measured 23" depth and the thing had no problem with it :)

I'm tinkering on the rally car with wiring and stuff, not really worth posting about, so here's some snow pics instead.

WRX

the suburbia-beast

Pretty gnarly back in there..

So meanwhile, in between shoveling and winter exploring I've been doing some little and not-little things on the car. Only three weekends after this to get the car done and logbooked, so time is of the essence.

First off.....we made a rules mistake with the cage, as Rally America (though NOT NASA Rally, who is going to logbook this car) requires that the front of the roof "V" end within 100mm of where the windshield header bar meets the side bars. Ugh....we were slightly over that and while I personally don't think it's a big deal, apparently there is one scrutineer in this region known for busting out the tape measure and busting peopel for it. So might as well be legal.

So, got out the cutting wheel and grinder and cut out the two roof bars. Will cut some longer new ones to go to the appropriate spot. No big deal

While talking with one of the RA national rules committee members, he also suggested (not required) a few other minor reinforcements (gussets/tacos), which I'm knocking out. This is one of them (the third taco at the bottom on the sill bar). I had planned to enclose that anyhow.

Also got my dead pedal back in and did some wiring harness routing and protection, since I'm not using the "channel" in the side sill.

Then put the roof panel back on since I'm done accessing stuff from above at this point. This time not using rivets, but instead stainless hex bolts with locknuts on the bottom. Serious pain in the ass to put all these in, especially since I don't like this roof panel and plan to replace it this summer...

Random: my first-aid kid mounted

Ok, time to put the dash back in since all the lower bars and stuff are done. To do this I had to cut about 4" off each end (basically the outer half of the vent), which is more cumbersome than it looks, and also cuts away most of the metal side supports, which are kind of important...

Now I'm working on ways to graft the outsides of the vents back on (more for looks and to enclose the dash better than anything else)....First I welded a tab onto the A-pillar cage bar as an outer support for the dash, which really makes it solid. Then got creative with large zipties. It's not pretty, but it will do for the time being. Will do something a bit more "quality" once it warms up. Right now function > form.

And....on to wiring everything back up. Laid down some packing blankets because i'm tired of banging my knees and ass on the seat mounts, etc. Put an electric heater in there (garage is 35 degrees), and got it all wired up. After testing everything, it all works fine :)

So, that's where we stand right now. More to go after I shovel more snow tomorrow. On a side note, my trailer is currently 150 feet from the street in my side yard, behind a fence. With over 2 feet of snow between it and the street. Hope it warms up here in the next few weeks, because i'll need to get it out in less than a month :)

They allow the rear stays to terminate on a crossbar like that?

I would have thought it should go to the car and a spreader plate.

Looks like a fun car! You will have tons of fun with it, I'm sure!

wvumtnbkr wrote: They allow the rear stays to terminate on a crossbar like that? I would have thought it should go to the car and a spreader plate. Looks like a fun car! You will have tons of fun with it, I'm sure!

Yes, as long as they are directly at the end of the tube adjacent to where it attaches to the reinforcing plate on the shock tower. .....though we are also going to add a gusset to a plate on the trunk floor for additional support anyhow (not required)

Think about it this way - the rear shock towers are just made of sheet metal anyhow, so regardless of whether the rear stays go directly to the towers, or to a bar attached to the towers, the weakest link is the tower itself, not the DOM tube crossbar. If anything, the crossbar distributes any load between both shock towers rather than just one (at least to some extent).

In any case, it's all academic. Nothing back in that part of the car is particularly strong really, unless we somehow tied into the unibody rails below the trunk floor...The wheel wells where a lot of people mount cages to on e30s is far weaker than the setup we have in this car....

So for the day still no plow on my street. Later found out that he got stuck 2 blocks away and couldn't get through the 2 feet of snow on our street.

In fact, nobody except me could get through it...my tracks (Sequoia) the only ones in or out all day until my neighbor managed to follow them out in his Suburban..

But, it was bright and sunny so with the driveway cleared aired out the garage for a bit. That stack of fresh snow tires for the e30 there.....annoying me with all the snow on the roads

http://i78.photobucket.com/albums/j85/irish44j/IMG_20160124_132717830.jpg" alt="" />

Had a bit of steel sheet scraps left so got out the saw and dimple die and made some A-pillar gussets. Would have done full-length ones, but not enough material on-hand and don't have time to wait since the glass will likely go back in next week. Not as cool looking, but should do the trick.

And then I hear a beeping up the hill....plows! Well, really a dude in a tracked front-loader, open-air in the 20 degrees.

Brought him a hot chocolate, and then watched him clear the street like a boss in under an hour. I've been around heavy equipment quite a bit but neve saw anyone handle anything like this guy did....not a flake of snow on any cleared sidewalk, cleared every mailbox so the mail truck can pull right up. Clearly a pro (from a concrete company, so figures), especially with the ice sheet under the snow making it tricky. And now I can get the WRX out as well, finally :)

Last thing he did before he left the street was get every bit of snow out of the front of my driveway

Working on a few minor projects to kill time. For our "A/V" system we're going to run my phone (for speedo and odometer/GPS, mostly when regularly driving the car), and Jim's iPad with a rally app for timing and odometer when on course. For this we got a couple of highly-suggested Ram Mounts, which seem to be the most secure-holding things out there within reason.

I mounted the phone mount up today. I wanted it in a place where I can see it easily without taking my eyes off the road, and also a place where I can easily touch the screen without taking my hands too far off the wheel.

So, here it is. Riveted with three rivets to the lower trim panel under the cluster, and the fourth hole with a long bolt through the metal backing to behind the dash for extra security. It's very secure, actually. And I think the placement is pretty much perfect - though it can be adjusted 360 degrees up, down, or to the side.

So, one more little thing done...