Fiat acquisition of Chrysler (in my driveway)

  If using the Neon parts will require flares, do a search for Dallara fiat.

Junkyard wheels. 13x6 12 lbs.  also excited about no cast shape in between the current (wrong) PCD  they are 4x4” and Fiat is 4x98 so I got to figure something out. Had some solid father son wrenching when my 12year old asked me if he could help work on the car. We made good progress on the custom radiator hoses. 

I hope we will get to build him his first car. So far his ideas are pretty out there, but not terrible. Almost impulse bought a car for him but I really need to wrap up some of the current projects before adding any more. 

This thread is cool. In to follow along. 

Have you found the 2 fiat part sources, vicks fiat and bayless racing?  Vicks has some upgrade radiators, which you might want, the OEM one was marginal with the fiat motor.

In reply to GoLucky :

My apologies about the CVs/axles.  It does appear that perhaps the 4-speed parts would work better, I'm not sure why they might be considered marginal considering how close they are to the Neon's diameter.  Oh well.  Sorry again.

In reply to Stefan :

No need to apologize amigo! I Ain’t feeling any stress. Open to any and all suggestions and ideas. Not sure how the axles fare from any personal experience or anything just parroting what the Midwest Bayless techs said. Metal composition? Heat treatment? Italian voodo?

In reply to TED_fiestaHP :

I have bought some odds and ends: hood latch cable, thumbscrew etc from Midwest Bayless    Nothing yet from Vick’s but their alloy rad looks real good and the coil overs are pretty appealing too 

   Your welded axles, might actually work, a truck driveshaft is just a tube with a U joint part welded to each end.

        I never considered something like that, so I had the custom ones made, wasn't really that expensive.  When I adapted the odd gear box to the fiesta.

      Fiat wheels are a odd  bolt pattern, so it might be worth the effort to somehow end up with something more common.  The front brake rotor is small and the wheel bearings are small/weak.  So converting to using Neon parts might be a good upgrade depending on how complex that would get.   You would then also use the Neon struts, unless they are to tall?

There's gotta be a way to convert the 4x98 bolts to 4x100 on these- 2mm is just so damn small...

Also, +1 on the build. It's my own preference, but I love builds where they focus on bigger engines instead of turbocharging the pre-existing ones; it just seems like less work and teething issues all around.

Wobble bolts/nuts.  Specifically made to deal with such situations.

GIRTHQUAKE said:

There's gotta be a way to convert the 4x98 bolts to 4x100 on these- 2mm is just so damn small...

 

Also, +1 on the build. It's my own preference, but I love builds where they focus on bigger engines instead of turbocharging the pre-existing ones; it just seems like less work and teething issues all around.

Thanks, I am having fun with this. I drove to the parts store right after I got the Fiat motor able to do that kind of thing and they did not have a single part for it in stock. Nada. The the neon 2.0 on the other hand is NAPA bread and butter. It’s funny to think of the 2.0 as a “bigger motor” but compared to a 1.3 it definitely is.  I would have tried a 2.4 cause Ain’t no replacement for displacement. The 2.4 is about an inch or so longer though and the 2.0 is pretty crazy right as is. 

In reply to TED_fiestaHP :

I though about trying to use all the neon parts and even considered getting a 4 lug one but in the end I decided to just try and swap in the driveline and keep suspension etc Fiat. I’m not sure if it is easier or tougher?

In reply to Stefan :

Weeble wobble may be in my near future 

I did some work on the radiator and heater hoses. The parts store let me walk around in the back and pick out some hoses that looked like they contained bends that I could use. Turns out I got a bypass hose from a Merkur xr4ti that they strangely had in stock and an upper rad hose from a Chevy 1500 that is a sure bet to be in stock. 

My lower radiator hose is now a slightly cut down Neon upper hose. Lucky. 

The upper hose has a pretty long straight section and I couldn’t find any that would just drop in. So I bought a cheapo tool to make a shade tree extension from some .035 1.25” 4130 tube I had laying around from bike frame projects. Chop. Grind.  Tape on the ends to help make them pretty square on the bench grinder. Deburr because of finger health. then squeeze-move-squeeze a million times and I have a upper radiator hose to test fit.

I can’t take credit for this tool. I saw someone on YouTube make it at some point and my brain filed it away under “cool idea to try someday.”  Seems much harder than a bead roller but it is less than $15 and under 5 minutes to make. I also really should get a hose cutter and leave the steak knife in the junkyard tool kit. 

I needed some centering rings to fit my junkyard alloys’ 59.5mm bore and reduce it to the 58.1mm of the Fiat hubs. Nothing off the shelf was listed and the custom order places specified a 4mm minimum difference. So I bought a scrap section of 2.5” 60601 and took a trip to my co-workers shop where he makes his frames. This is one of his three lathes in action. 

A short time later we had these 

I may end up trying wobble bolts but I’m not sure that they will work. The current holes are pretty large (18ish mm) and haven’t got a taper. The only 60deg taper cutter I have is only 3/4” so... not sure yet. Considering redrilling but not committed either way yet. 

I got some other things done as well. Buttoned up the heater and radiator hoses with some shiny new NAPA clamps

I also added a nut-sert to hold a bracket to keep the heater return hose off the oil pan. It was made from a rear bike rack seat-stay arm; so yet another cycle product makes its way into my car project. 

that means that except for an expansion tank my cooling plumbing is done. I’m not settled on a location for the expansion tank but it may end up going in the trunk.

Moving to another system I needed to adapt the cable clutch of the Neon to hydraulic system of the Fiat.

My first thoughts were to use the push-slave and make a bellcrank to pull a rod or cable. After a few abortive attempts I bought a pull-slave and modified the clutch arm to work with the heim end.

It was difficult to get a drill bit to even start in the hardened steel of the clutch arm so I fired up the TIG and un-heat treated a little circle on both sides so that it could be drilled. Much easier! After that I made a bracket and welded it to the frame. I feel good about it mounting there since my leaf spring shackle polyurethane motor and torque mounts don’t really allow significant movement of the driveline.

and the frame end

next part of the clutch system will be to find/build a hose to run from the hard line to the pull slave. 

I worked some on the fuel system. Spoiler alert: it doesn’t go smoothly.  The tank is pretty easy to remove. 

My plan was to mount the in tank pump from my Neon donor in the Fiat tank.  At the bottom of the pump there is a white plastic protrusion that got broken off during transit whilst in a box on my bike rack. Excessive rad-itude I guess. I didn’t think this was a biggie since I had to adapt to a hose inlet anyway. 

my hose inlet adapter is a 30.9mm el-cheapo seatpost from the parts bin at work with the saddle rail head cut off.

I marked out center (ish) and drilled the plug to accept a npt tap. Holding sharpie in approximate center and spinning the tube makes a circle to get centered enough for things that are not rockets.

The drilling was done in not rocket fashion with a hand drill and I discovered that the seatpost head plug was quite thick so I cut it down some on the porta-band table. When I started tapping the hole in the plug it became apparent that I had cut off the portion of the plug that was actually bonded into the post because the remaining piece was spun by the tap. 

A/C welding moment later.

Then shortened and press fit on the pump. Some Quick Steel fillet action for redneck bonus points.

And a 3x8” Holley hydramat to be held in place with magnets to provide fuel in the absence of tank baffles or a surge tank. By folding and wiggling just right I was able to get this in through the tiny sender opening.

and then... I stopped taking pictures because there was fuel all over my hands. But basically what happened is that the pump didn’t. It made pumping sounds but wouldn’t move any fuel. Also during the dozens of sender in, sender out exercises I may have broken my fuel level sender. Time to reassess. 

The good part is that this is a hobby project and I can stop and walk away any time I want. Hopefully I can get a win next time.  

So you're a new fuel pump away from success? Nice work! More wide shot pics of the engine bay with engine in please!

In reply to Mezzanine :

Yes basically. Thanks for being positive.  I’ve had several setbacks in other projects recently and it makes the Fiat more appealing to work on. I may go a different route since my replacement pump is not another neon one. 

awesome build! Keep it up - you seem to be making great progress. Your car will be a hoot when it is complete I think!

I have a motorcycle engined x1/9 I'm building for the challenge, albeit at a snails pace.

GoLucky said:

Like a Friggin'Glove!

Looks great. I love the use of bicyc;e parts, too.

In reply to Robbie :

I like yours as well and am pretty jealous of all those affordable fiberglass panels! 

   You can buy a pump with a hose attachment on each end, but if your mounting it in the tank, normally you would mount it near the bottom with just a suction filter on one end.

       If mounting it  in the tank, you could attach it to the fuel tube and just put a suction filter on the inlet end.

           Could also mount external, ideally should be mounted as low as possible.   The X1/9 tank for fuel injection had fuel connection at the bottom, but I think you could connect to the fuel tube at the top, and then run a line down to the pump mounted low.

Looks like the engine fits really well aside from being pretty snug at the forward firewall against the intake. That sheet metal is single layer there and would be easy to trim and clearance. In the center of the forward firewall where it bumps out for the fuel tank it looks tight too...there's a little space between the fuel tank and the bump in the corner so you could trim if needed.

I'd encourage you to switch over to a external pump too...but it would require switching to a later fuel injected tank. They're pretty cheap: in the $100 neighborhood if I remember right. Third post down shows how I mounted my pump in my X: My X1/9 build thread

I'm probably going to redo the mount in mine just to try and isolate it better; it's terribly noisy.

12ish  by 6” something gauge steel from my ladies supply (thanks Baby) and a big thanks to whoever left this multipack of gasket material stored in the Fiat. Much more useful than most of the other garbage that it came with. 

Cut the carb gasket material with scissors and the steel with the sparky loud wheel.

Measured and laid out 

Punched drilled and used as a pattern for another similar piece of steel that I actually bought from the Home Depot because it was a Sunday and I had project needs and it is probably amazing steel based on the price. 

This goes.. Right about there. This is the forward face of the tank. I’m sure going to enjoy having a giant hole in my tank that I can reach into instead of a multi step fishing process like V1.0

Some temporary rivets to hold my drill guide in place. 

Drilled. Cut a frame out of that high dollar steel. Used the frame for a cutting guide and chopped into the tank. 

NOTE: I did not essplode myself. Please make sure that if you try something similar you do not as well. In addition to having been (years ago) certified for aircraft fuel cell entry I have cut, welded etc on fuel system parts numerous times and know how to do it safely. 

Captive nuts for the frame that will go on the inside of the tank. MIG welded these, because even after grinding off the zinc it didn’t feel clean enough for TIG. I would have done stainless but these are from Ace hardware and were cheap. The assortment of random m5 bolts are from the bin at the bike shop. That piece of tube is from the cut down pickup tube and keeps the threads protected during the welding. 

I stopped for the night with the parts for my hopefully awesome fuel tank access hatch.  Next will be a rummage through the bolts drawer for 28 button head m5 bolts that all use the same wrench. I may use brake rotor bolts which are t25 head since the length looks good.