351 V10 Mustang....

Anyone remember this car?

Here's an article about it http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/coupes/112_0308_ford_mustang_boss_350_v_10/viewall.html

It's a V10 20V Mustang. Not a 6.8l V10, but a custom block, head, crank, etc... It's also pretty old, done 15 years ago. The MT review is from 2004.

This car was under my nose for the past 10 years. My department made it- and for some reason I wasn't even aware of it, as I had moved to a different part of the building, and probably was distracted doing PZEV stuff. Anyway, it was being stored in my current building, in an controlled air space. Where test cars are stored for emissions testing- so humidity and temperature control. I thought it was a correlation car, as it was an old style Mustang, and under a cover.

It's going to leave someplace- as the space is needed. Not sure where- could get crushed, could get put into some motorsports archive.

I saw the car for the first time, without a top, today. Sounds great, too- thought it would sound like a Viper, being a V10, but it's a different firing order, so at idle it sounds like a V8. Not sure what it's like out on the road- but I know it's quick. Not Andrew Nelson quick, as it's only a mid 11's car.

430 hp out of 5.8l.

Perspective for me- two years before this engine was made, the '99 Aston Martin V12 went into production with 420hp from 6.0l. So this is pretty healthy. Not sure if it's capable of meeting emissions, but I bet it could make some contemporary number.

Here's a video- at 37 seconds, there are videos of this car being driven. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ub6DlVHWxPM Which does still sound V8 like. It's a V10. And unlike what the video says- the engine is still in the car.

I lusted for this car, the 2000 Cobra R, and an '01 Bullitt nearly as much as any girl when I was in high school.

Glad to see its still kicking around.

alfadriver wrote: as it's only a mid 11's car.

Knurled wrote:

alfadriver wrote: as it's only a mid 11's car.

For this car, I would not be surprised that the 10 pistons cost more than $2000.

And for that price, Andy Nelson has made cars that are a second faster. More than once. That blows my mind.

Money schmoney, the fact that 11 second quarters can get an "only" description is mind boggling in and of itself.

Last year, we were tuning a car and when we were done and just verifying drivability and such, I amused myself by mentally back-calculating horsepower from injector size and duty cycle.

"About 650-700hp", I said. He dips into the boost and says something to the effect of how mental the car was. "Well, look at it this way - you can buy this much power, right now, from a Ford dealership. No methanol injection, same turn key and forget it drivability as a Corolla, and a hundred thousand mile warranty..."

Truly we live in incredible times.

Sounds great, too- thought it would sound like a Viper, being a V10, but it's a different firing order, so at idle it sounds like a V8.

IIRC, the big reason the Viper sounds the way it does is that it has no crossover pipe, so you're really hearing two inline-5s.

In reply to codrus:

I would have thought that the more frequent combustion events would be easier to notice. But it's not.

I'll have to see what the plan on the car is- seems quite certain that it's not staying where it was for the past decade.

Have you offered to store it in your garage?

I wish. Before there's any chance of that, the car will get crushed. Maybe the engine will get saved, as it's a one of one engine. But it's not really that important of one, so I don't know.

alfadriver wrote: I wish. Before there's any chance of that, the car will get crushed. Maybe the engine will get saved, as it's a one of one engine. But it's not really that important of one, so I don't know.

You have a great job, but apparently a frustrating one as well.

I remember it well. Don Masch was involved in that program, as well, he was with a team that took that car out to Milan once on an FME night. I don't remember what it ran, but it certainly drew a crowd wherever it went. IIRC, this is the same group that put a 3.0L Duratec V6 into an NB Miata a few years before that.

I think I'd still work in the auto industry if I could have had a "cool" job like that.

jstein77 wrote:

alfadriver wrote: I wish. Before there's any chance of that, the car will get crushed. Maybe the engine will get saved, as it's a one of one engine. But it's not really that important of one, so I don't know.

You have a great job, but apparently a frustrating one as well.

I've gotten used to it. Back in '96, I was part of a team that put the first V12 into an Aston Martin, and after some development in the UK, that car came here for work. Took it home a few times even. In terms of AML history, it was pretty significant, as it was part of the revival of the Marquee. Alas, it was crushed in 1999. As were a few prototypes, some of which we were happy to part with, as they were certainly haunted.

This car is cool, as a whole. The car itself, well.... The engine is where the interest is.

After a while, you learn that it's better to get rid of the horrible and problematic prototypes, and let the customers argue over SN status.

Geez-now that I'm thinking about it- I wonder what happened to the Indigo, and before that, the GT90? The former was a really well built car, the latter was all show and not much else.

Tom_Spangler wrote: I remember it well. Don Masch was involved in that program, as well, he was with a team that took that car out to Milan once on an FME night. I don't remember what it ran, but it certainly drew a crowd wherever it went. IIRC, this is the same group that put a 3.0L Duratec V6 into an NB Miata a few years before that. I think I'd still work in the auto industry if I could have had a "cool" job like that.

Yes, same group. But I seemed to remember the Miata a lot more. The time frame was really close- 2000-2002.

The Miata made me think that I wanted to put an Alfa V6 into a Spider for a challenge car- it was very sweet to drive. Had it turned into a Lincoln or Mercury, I would have gotten one.

jstein77 wrote: You have a great job, but apparently a frustrating one as well.

As an aside, I work at a place that has a huge machine shop, everything you could think of, sheet metal working equipment, CNC machines everywhere... and we engineers aren't allowed to use any of it. I understand why, but everytime I walk by there it still gives me a :(

The Idigo and GT90 still exist in storage.

So, given that with enough time and $$'s anything is possible. What would it take an insane, wealthy car nut to reproduce this. People cut up LSx heads, weld them together and put them on Ford 6cl blocks. People build Cleveland based V12's by chopping up blocks, heads and having cranks made. People make 4 and 8 cylinder flat engines from oil cooled Porsche's, so anything is possible.

What's the parts list for daydreaming to slip into a hot rod Mk VII or Mk VIII?

In reply to Adrian_Thompson:

An LS would be a better car- so much better than the old MKVIII chassis. Which was total garbage. But seeing that a 4.6l 4v would barely fit in one, I bet this would be really tight.

BTW, there were two Indigos- one that drove, and one that didn't. The one with a windshield did not move under it's own power, the other one did- quite well, I might add. Had a very memorable birthday on the handling course with it.

As for recreating it- these days with 3D printers, it seems as if 3D printing a core would be a lot easier than welding stuff together. Especially since you could cut and paste one middle cyl into the block and head of a V8 to do it. And if I did my math right- this is a 4.6 4V with two more cyl.

alfadriver wrote: In reply to Adrian_Thompson: An LS would be a better car- so much better than the old MKVIII chassis. Which was total garbage.

The MK VIII chassis was basically a Fox Mustang derivative, wasn't it?

jstein77 wrote:

alfadriver wrote: In reply to Adrian_Thompson: An LS would be a better car- so much better than the old MKVIII chassis. Which was total garbage.

The MK VIII chassis was basically a Fox Mustang derivative, wasn't it?

The VII was, the VIII was more unique between it and the T-bird of the time. Both went from being a Fox to something on it's own- which should have been better (IRS, better brakes, etc). The big difference is that the VIII had aluminum subframes where as the T-bird/Cougar had steel.

As were a few prototypes, some of which we were happy to part with, as they were certainly haunted.

so...want to elaborate on that?

It still blows my mind that automakers crush these prototypes rather than find a way to sell them or otherwise dispose of them to enthusiasts. I understand the "why" but I still can't accept it as a reasonable outcome.

ultraclyde wrote:

As were a few prototypes, some of which we were happy to part with, as they were certainly haunted.

so...want to elaborate on that?

It had so many gremlins in it that some wanted to use the car for crash testing. Mostly electrical.

I'm curious as to what happened to the Ford Five Hundred GT-R.

to Alfa and Adrian, you guys really should try to figure out a backdoor way to get that car into private (ie your) hands. put it away for the next 20 years, then run it across the stage at Barrett Jackson to help fund your retirement.

alfadriver wrote: It had so many gremlins in it that some wanted to use the car for crash testing. Mostly electrical.

Do you guys ever do fire testing? Or trebuchet into a fire testing?

Knurled wrote:

alfadriver wrote: It had so many gremlins in it that some wanted to use the car for crash testing. Mostly electrical.

Do you guys ever do fire testing? Or trebuchet into a fire testing?

Not intentionally. But it happens.

It's why I don't park test cars in my garage.