5-speed Crown Vic, pretty sweet video.

P71 wrote: And if you say 25-30 MPG on 87 octane is poor for a full-size, 5-passenger car is poor one more time I'm going to hit you with it!

it is... it's a fact.

P71 wrote: That would be like hating all GM's because the major magazines all say you should... oh wait, you do that.

No.. I don't like GM's because of the extremely poor quality and horrible fit/finish of the initerior. Last gm I rented had leather seats the quality of Sham Wow and a dashboard that felt like a dining hall tray.

ignorant wrote:

P71 wrote: That would be like hating all GM's because the major magazines all say you should... oh wait, you do that.

No.. I don't like GM's because of the extremely poor quality and horrible fit/finish of the initerior. Last gm I rented had leather seats the quality of Sham Wow and a dashboard that felt like a dining hall tray.

Hahha. I'll grant you that.

Go ahead and tell your precious import companies that 30MPG is bad then. You must have failed simple arithmetic as a child...

And if you think all current model GM's have horrible interiors because of a rental you really do define your screen name. Ever even bothered to sit in a new Malibu? Ten bucks says if I slapped a Toyota emblem on the steering wheel you'd sing praises to the high heavens about it's interior quality until doves fluttered from the sky and peace was brought to all the land.

Get a clue and take of the blinders!

P71 wrote: Ever even bothered to sit in a new Malibu? Ten bucks says if I slapped a Toyota emblem on the steering wheel you'd sing praises to the high heavens about it's interior quality until doves fluttered from the sky and peace was brought to all the land.

I happened to get a brand new Malibu LTZ as a rental recently. I was really surprised (pleasantly) by the car.

Now back to the P71 arguing...

One more question...

Is the Marauder anything more than a gussied up P71? I like the look of them better than the CV.

P71 wrote: Go ahead and tell your precious import companies that 30MPG is bad then. You must have failed simple arithmetic as a child...

OK.. Precious import companies that have me so spell bound.. 30mpg is bad. do better M'kay..

Oh yes! Marauder got a 305HP DOHC 4.6L Think 01-02 Cobra motor shoved into a CV with a GM nose blacked out Grand National/Vader style. Rare and honking good! They're slow stock, but a basic tune is worth over a half second ET. I dunno why Ford is so conservative with their ECM's?

So what does whatever hunk o import you drive actually get on the freeway and what did you pay for it? Obviously pure math doesn't work on you so maybe I'll have to attach something you understand (drive) to it...

dyintorace wrote: One more question... Is the Marauder anything more than a gussied up P71? I like the look of them better than the CV.

well, the main difference is the 32 valve version of the 4.6.

ignorant wrote:

P71 wrote: That would be like hating all GM's because the major magazines all say you should... oh wait, you do that.

No.. I don't like GM's because of the extremely poor quality and horrible fit/finish of the initerior. Last gm I rented had leather seats the quality of Sham Wow and a dashboard that felt like a dining hall tray.

Why are you feeling up the dashboard? I usually just look at mine.

I see that now...trusty wikipedia.

Apologies for lack of research prior to posting.

P71 wrote: So what does whatever hunk o import you drive actually get on the freeway and what did you pay for it? Obviously pure math doesn't work on you so maybe I'll have to attach something you understand (drive) to it...

96 civic hatch. 46mpg best on the highway.. 42 most other times. 95k miles. bought with 70k miles 2 years ago for $2k with no rust. everything works.

bamalama wrote:

ignorant wrote:

P71 wrote: That would be like hating all GM's because the major magazines all say you should... oh wait, you do that.

No.. I don't like GM's because of the extremely poor quality and horrible fit/finish of the initerior. Last gm I rented had leather seats the quality of Sham Wow and a dashboard that felt like a dining hall tray.

Why are you feeling up the dashboard? I usually just look at mine.

feeling dashboards is a secret pleasure of mine.

Gas is $2/gallon for 87 here. At 10,000 miles in a year you would burn ~222 gallons (45MPG) for a cost of $444. I would burn 333 gallons for a cost of $666. You save $222 (or 33%) in a year. I'll gladly pay an extra $222 to have the hauling, towing, and seating capacity over you plus the actual ability to use my car in a competitive environment (track day, autocross, drag racing) and actually not be the slowest guy there. Of course I could just point out that my insurance is $300/year cheaper (for me at my age/record) for the P71 over a 96 Civic (yes I called).

P71 wrote: Gas is $2/gallon for 87 here. At 10,000 miles in a year you would burn ~222 gallons (45MPG) for a cost of $444. I would burn 333 gallons for a cost of $666. You save $222 (or 33%) in a year. I'll gladly pay an extra $222 to have the hauling, towing, and seating capacity over you plus the actual ability to use my car in a competitive environment (track day, autocross, drag racing) and actually not be the slowest guy there. Of course I could just point out that my insurance is $300/year cheaper (for me at my age/record) for the P71 over a 96 Civic (yes I called).

dosen't seem that clear.

to get a TCO for the car.. look at in town mileage as well.

I get 38mpg to and from work. what do you get 15-17mpg in town. Throw in $4 gas.. and I win easy.

263 gallons for me @ $1052

lets say you get 20 mpg around town.

thats 500 gallons for you. @ $2000

hmm. Thats $1k a year.. or I could buy another civic every 2 years with the savings.

or that really really sweet dodge powerwagon project i want.

It's really hard to out cheap me. Some people on here do easily, but its really hard.

edit.. ok.. a lot of people on here out cheap me.. but GRM folks aren't exactly a good cross section.

relax you two.

belteshazzar wrote: relax you two.

indeed.

Heck, we could be spending our money on shoes or purses or something else "foolish".

Someone pissed on my leg.

F-Body circle track springs work on the 79-02 Crown Vics. Energy Suspension makes poly bushings for the civilian models (for the police models you need two kits because all the bushing are the same size on the police model) The poly bushing for the control arms are only good on 92 and up models. My entire front suspension has been converted to 98-02 (for the much better brakes and adjust-ability of alignment.)

The P71 does have more than just stiffer springs and better shocks and sway bars. I'm not sure how much is different, but it has been verified 100% PI models 79-97(maybe all the way to 02) have thicker metal in the control arms (25% thicker). So there are parts of the car that are upgraded purely for durability. These also add more weight to the car. But in all reality, a P71 (with the same final gear, because not all P71s have 2.73, some have 3.01, 3.55s) is going to be about the same speed in a strait line, and much more nimble that a civilian model.

I just had to make sure you folks weren't hot rodding the same car I drove. No offense was meant. The crown vic is a nice big safe car with tons of space and apparently has a decent aftermarket.

I wasn't hot rodding anything when the intake blew, I cannot help that they used a piece of plastic for such a vital part. If you cannot hit the gas with a 4.6l going 85mph, the same engine as the mustang, and not blow something up you have an issue. I talked to a mustanger dude and he said it was probably a mixture issue, it probably preignighted or something. This wasn't my car so I cannot comment about maintenance, but my grandpa drove the thing like a mad man so I felt it was my duty to step up.

BTW when I brought it to the ford dealer to get it fixed they had a woman mechanic tell me that the car was overheated and warped the head even though the car never overheated. They tested the coolant for exhaust gas, which is great until you think there was a busted water jacket in the intake and they never replaced the coolant before giving their dire prognoses. They wanted to pull the heads for 3800$ on a car that is worth 2000$ in good running condition minus exploded intake. Oh well!

ignorant wrote:

P71 wrote: So what does whatever hunk o import you drive actually get on the freeway and what did you pay for it? Obviously pure math doesn't work on you so maybe I'll have to attach something you understand (drive) to it...

96 civic hatch. 46mpg best on the highway.. 42 most other times. 95k miles. bought with 70k miles 2 years ago for $2k with no rust. everything works.

Ok, comparing a Crown Vic to a Civic??? Yea, how about stretching it to compare to the Honda Pilot, since it gets less than 25mpg, or better yet, the V6 accord which gets less than 30mpg.

Honda doesn't even make a car that is close to as capable as the P71 in terms of size.

I guess I'll just have to compare your Civic to the 18mpg Toyota Tundra.... What a piece of gass guzzing crap that is....

capable of what? removing cash from my wallet at a faster pace?

and thats my point.. It's a car it gets me to work and stock for stock is not significantly faster than my civic. Infact the numbers are a wash 15.8 stock 1/4mile numbers.

civic has 5 seat belts.. fits 8 pieces of 3x5 hardi backer INSIDE it 1/2" thick plus wet saw.. plus me.

i'll shut up now.

1/4 mile is not everything, and neither is stock. GRM wouldn't exist if everybody left their cars stock! Any race track the P71 would lap your Civic! Come on man, you are comparing a pure commuter bubble to a car that is capable of so much more and calling yourself a victory over MPG? Your car may have 5 seat belts but $20 says that if even if you could stuff five 6'+ adults in it, they wouldn't survive an 8-hour road trip without a huge chiropractic bill. What about towing? I can stuff your Civic on a trailer and tow it cross-country with no issues and still pull 20MPG's. Come on man! You are comparing apples to grapefruit!