87 vw cabrio starting issue

Hi. new to the site and hoping someone would be able to give me some ideas on a starting issue i have with my 87 vw cabrio.it has trouble starting.sometimes i will sit and have to crank it for 5-10min and other times it will just start.once it starts it idols really low as if it wants to shut off(sometimes it does and i have to start all over).but it seems like once it "warms up" it will run fine.i hope someone has an answer.thanks

VW folks? This is still CIS, isn't it?

Is the cold-start injector in the end of the intake manifold getting power during cold cranking?

Cranking that long makes me think something is amiss with the fuel delivery. Can you check fuel line pressure? How's the fuel filter?

In reply to ransom:

my dad found a test in a vw book and did it.he said that it seems to be working properly

In reply to 914Driver:

i didnt check the fuel line pressure(to be honest not 100% sure how to) but the fuel filter is brand new

Accumulator rusted and shot? leaking cold start injector?

What year? If it's an '89 or older, I'd be willing to bet it's the warm up regulator. It's bolted to the front of the block and has two fuel lines and an electrical plug on it. Looks like this:

CIS HATES air leaks. Make sure you have absolutely no intake and vacuum leaks. Also check that the idle and full throttle microswitches are working and set properly.

Probably more than one problem going on. The low idle points to a warm up regulator issue but the intermittent no start is probably a loose ground. Start at the battery terminals and work your way outward cleaning all connections.

CIS is also very particular about vacuum leaks around the injector seals, intake boots and assorted vacuum lines.

I would start with the free things like vacuum leaks and dirty/loose connections before buying any parts.

Check the air boot on top of the air box assembly for splits and or cracks. It looks something like this http://www.fastvws.com/acatalog/intake-boot_a2sensorside.jpg

Also check the air boot between the throttle body and the intake pipe. This one looks like this... http://www.fastvws.com/acatalog/intakeboot_throtlte_a2.jpg

Here Noddaz, saves all that clicking.

In reply to 914Driver:

I didn't take time to figure the picture post out.. lol

But back to the original post, my 86 GTi had very similar problems. Turned out to be the boot between the throttle body and the air tube was cracked. (the second picture...) Of course this is just a long distance guess, but it does give you somewhere to start. Remember.. Look at the easy and cheap things first before deciding on the hard and expensive things...

Once it's running and up to temp, spray a little ether or starting fluid around these parts. If air is getting sucked in, the engine will rev up.

Dan

If it were a vacuum leak, it would still run like crap after it's warmed up.

my dad and i did find some vacuum lines that were disconnected and we reconnected them(to where we believe they go).my dad does very well with domestic cars, but knows nothing about vw haha we also found some spots where it looks like a line would go to but found no other lines.we sealed them up.did help a tad but not much.

also if i park it on a slight hill facing upward it has trouble starting.takes alot longer to start.why is this?

and sorry for my ignorance but what does CIS mean?

velma123 wrote: and sorry for my ignorance but what does CIS mean?

"Continuous Injection System". It's what Bosch called the fuel injection on that car. I found a link to a .pdf that might help y'all out..

http://www.passat32b.hu/olvasnivalo/kezikonyvek/szervizhez/uzemanyagbefecskendezo%20rendszer%20bosch%20ECI%20Injection_ECI.pdf

EDIT: Dangit, it 404ed. Here, I made a tinyurl for it.

http://tinyurl.com/3uaex6s

Constant Injection System. Think of it as a mechanical precursour to modern EFI, the Europeans loved it and were using it in just about everything.

Like others have said:

Find your grounds, all of them, clean them throughly, and spray a terminal protectant over them. They will cause the weirdest issues. My first step when buying a CIS/CIS-E is raplacing any and all main ground cables with thicker modern cables.

If you find a vacuum line that looks old, replace it. 25 year old rubber can appear deceivingly good. And CIS is very sensitive to vacuum leaks.

These are just good PM ideas that will keep you from chasing your tail if the issue persists.

In reply to friedgreencorrado:

thanks i think this should help

In reply to Cone_Junky:

in order to check the idle and throttle microswitches....how would you do that?