Appliance content - what do you guys think about Automatic transmission fluid flushes?

Wife took the 2011 Kia Sorrento in for service today, service writer pitched her the 60K mile service, $600+ total including a transmission "flush" for the low price of $294. I've heard about too many horror stories regarding those flushes so I told her to politely decline (I may have left out the polite part). Anyway, what's the GRM opinion on these? I'm up to doing the old fashioned filter and fluid top off myself, and would rather go through that than the flush deal. Any thoughts from the resident techs?

Filter and fluid replacement, no flush.

My opinion.

Definitely follow the schedule on fluid replacement though.

Definitely a mixed bag here. My mechanic is dead-set against trans fluid changes on anything with over 75K miles. I've heard similar opinions from others. Others think that's full of poo... The VW DSG transmission has as a 40K maintenance interval.

In theory... if done early and regularly, it probaly isn't a bad idea. I don't know if I'd pay $290 for it, but some transmissions can be picky about the fluid used and that fluid can be a bitch to get as well as pricey.

In the E4OD world, been told to avoid flushes like the plague. I imagine it's a similar argument with other autos.

If you have a problem, try a flush, otherwise..............

tuna55 wrote: Filter and fluid replacement, no flush. My opinion. Definitely follow the schedule on fluid replacement though.

THIS. I turned a cheap, awesome Exploder into a worthless pile of scrap by doing the recommended "flush."

What are they offering for that low, low price?

I find it interesting how some dealers will go against the factory recommendations for services and additives to increase cost, like a flush vs just fluid change. If the owner took it upon themselves to do those things they could potentially end up with a big headache trying to get warrant coverage if additives or flush could even be remotely linked to a failure.

My local Kia dealer just did the trans fluid change and engine oil and filter change for less than $130 at 56k miles on our 2010 Sedona. No pressure for any other "special" services as it approached the 60k mark.

I'd have to check the slip, but I think the trans fluid change was $90. The service writer said there's no replaceable filter in it.

the 60K is a red flag, I'll bet that's quite early.

Also, Dad (transmission mechanic) says that the "if it's old and hasn't been changed, leave it" folks are excellent customers for rebuilds.

Personally I do the drain and fill every 30k or so. most of my cars have had a drain plug in the trans pan. Change the filter if its serviceable at 120k clean the magnets on the bottom of the pan at that time as well. Always keeping the fluid clean has served me very well. Not such a fan of powered flushes,though the fluid exchange setups seem to work well using the vehicle's trans pump to move fluid. Certainly do not do it at a quick lube place. I've had very good luck with BG synthetic trans fluid. Comes in a 4 gallon (I think) box with a bladder, for relativly reasonable 150$ or so. Not bad for that much full synth. Its enough to do several maintenance flushes, or bring one car from neglected to clean via drain and fills. It's compatible with MOST transmissions out there. If its a car that's unfamiliar to me I do multiple drain and fills over a 1,000 miles or so to replace most or all fluid eventually.

I'm not a big fan of actual "flushes", because I never trust what they use or put back, and I bet it's excellent way to loosen gunk and broadcast it into the innards. But I have started changing the fluid (using OE stuff only) and filter at least every 60,000 miles or 5 years.

The way the service writer described it to me over the phone they were basically just pushing out the old fluid "flushing" the transaxle and filling with new. I found the Kia tech info online site and, from the schematic I found for my engine/trans combo the filter is inside the transmission case. So no USER replaceable filter in it. I'm right at 58K so I can wait a bit, I think i'm going to call a couple of other Kia dealers and a local transmission shop to get their prices.

In reply to tuna55:

For the Sedona the interval is 60k for the severe schedule. Not sure for other models.

jstand wrote: In reply to tuna55: For the Sedona the interval is 60k for the severe schedule. Not sure for other models.

Well OK then.

I halved the service interval on the Caravan for transmissions-are-really-expensive insurance. So I guess it's probably a good idea to do now, but just drain and fill. Do it three times if you want, but I wouldn't flush.

Transmission flush and fuel system service belong together.

Stick to the recommended service in the manual.

Anything over and above is simply a treasure hunt for the dealership.

It's an appliance. Do what is required to maintain the warranty. Once the warranty is up, replace the appliance.

I do my own flush with an extra gallon or so of transmission fluid.

Disconnect the line to the cooler, aim it into a large catch pan. Start vehicle and let it pump fluid into the catch pan. As it slows down the pumping, I add fluid. Do this until the nasty gunk coming out looks nice. Turn it off, reconnect the line, fill it up. Done.

This lets me get an almost 100% fluid change, as opposed to the roughly 50% fluid change you get through dropping the pan. It's a lot less messy.

In reply to foxtrapper:

We did that with Robyn's Volvo 850 wagon. A few weeks later she was buying a new transmission.

Checking the service manual, the drain and fill procedure is pretty simple.

Replacement

ATF of 6 speed automatic transaxle doesn’t be replaced. But, if the vehicle is severe use or business use, replace ATF every 60,000 miles for severe usage.

Severe usage is defined as

•
Driving in rough road (Bumpy, Gravel, Snowy, Unpaved road, etc)

•
Driving in mountain road, ascent/descent

•
Repetition of short distance driving

•
More than 50% operation in heavy city traffic during hot weather above 32°C(89.6°F) .

•
Police, Taxi, Commercial type operation or trailer towing, etc

1. Remove the drain plug (A) and reinstall the drain plug after draining ATF totally.

Drain plug tightening torque:

34.3 ~ 44.1 N.m (3.5 ~ 4.5 kgf.m, 25.3 ~32.6 lb-ft)

The gasket of the drain plug use new one.

1. Fill the oil about 5 liters.

2. Check the oil level. (Refer to Oil level check procedure.)

Maybe I can save myself a few bucks..

foxtrapper wrote: I do my own flush with an extra gallon or so of transmission fluid. Disconnect the line to the cooler, aim it into a large catch pan. Start vehicle and let it pump fluid into the catch pan. As it slows down the pumping, I add fluid. Do this until the nasty gunk coming out looks nice. Turn it off, reconnect the line, fill it up. Done. This lets me get an almost 100% fluid change, as opposed to the roughly 50% fluid change you get through dropping the pan. It's a lot less messy.

This is how the BG "flush" machines work. The flush isn't done with a high pressure external pump, it's done with completely by the internal parts of automatic transmission. Nothing would get dislodged or "ungunked" that wouldn't normally happen while the vehicle is in use because the internal pressure is never above normal.

Using the term fluid "flush" is the problem, fluid "exchange" is a more accurate description. And yes, I have worked in several dealerships that have used a BG machine (or something similar) and I have never seen a problem. I've also personally used it on a few high mileage vehicles of my own with no service histories and have never had an issue.

In reply to jimbob_racing:

The service writer didn't specify what machine they were using. The high pressure machines are the ones that really scare me, and looking at the service manual procedure they really don't need to use a machine at all unless the idea is to do a 100% fluid exchange. The service manual specifies a 5 liter refill which is about 70% of the fluid capacity. In any event $294 is a lot of money for that kind of service IMHO. I'll take a look under the hood to see if it's something I feel comfortable doing, if not i'll check with the other Kia dealer in the area and a couple of the independent shops to see how much their services cost. Thanks for the info.

06HHR wrote: Thanks for the info.

No problem. Look here to find a shop with a BG transmission machine. http://www.bgfindashop.com/locator/index.php

I would do a flush like the owners manual instructs for newer vehicles. On older vehicles, I would probably just do a fluid change.

First transmission shop I called gave me a quote $100 cheaper for the fluid exchange than the dealer price. A quick cruise through the internets says the closest aftermarket trans fluids to the SP-IV factory spec are Valvoline max life and the BG synthetic. I think i'll be giving that transmission shop some business, the words fluid exchange make me feel a lot better than flush.

Friend and old time mechanic taught me this method of exchanging fluid. you disconect the cooler line and only pump out one quart then pour in one quart. Keep repeating untill he had exchanged five or six quarts. You don't want to pull out more than that at a time and you never want to run the pan dry as it is essentially like running your motor with out oil in the pan. Stop and think about it. You would never change the oil in your car by disconnecting a oil cooler line and letting it idle untill it was out of oil. Same goes for an auto trans.

I have used this technique of exchanging trans fluid many times with out any issues.

yay this again. depends on the flush machine. find a place that has one that uses the pressure match foremat wich just matches the out pressure it sees from the front pump of your transmission and your golden. most of these horror stories are using the forced fluid style flush and its been known to rip filters and push debris through them.

Drain and fill is a waste of time unless your doing it multiple times since your not draining the converter. With the proper fluid im all for a flush and have yet to have one of these horror stories in 6 years of doing them on all sorts of makes and models.

Since it was the kia dealer im guessing they have both a compatible flush machine and the proper fluids. my s10 was flushed when I purchased it and has been trouble free for 3 years, my wagon also got flushed along with a new filter and no issues.