Attn teachers: Jeep Liberty

My wife and I found a pretty decent looking 02 Liberty at a local car lot that is affordable, and ticks off all the boxes of what we're looking for. Its black, with what look like steelies painted black (even the spare, kudos for that) all it needs is some tinted windows and its murdered out, yo!

Automatic, 4wd, sport package, has AT tires, really clean just one scratch and a small dent. Has the 3.7 in it, I was hoping for a diesel though. I've driven one once before about 3 years ago and was pleased with it, the overall feel and it had some spunk for what it is. Four wheel drive is a plus too, since I think it's pointed to buy a jeep without that.

Anybody have any 3.7 horror stories? Anything to be aware of, to look for? We live in the mid-south so rust isn't a big issue, except for cars whos all models strive to return to earth. The only thing that worries me is the miles, which are higher than I like to spent so much on at 144K, but beggars cannot be choosers.

Always wanted a 4wd.

It's a real Jeep.

No, but seriously I love a decent liberty. My friend in college and I used to TSD rally one pretty regularly, and it put up with the demands of the Press On Regardless, the Son of Sno*Drift and the likes quite well. (In case you don't know, Detroit Region TSD events are a bit more taxing than most. At one event we had to deal with 18" of snowfall in an 11 hour timespan over gravel and broken cement roads in the back woods of northern Michigan.)

They are relatively comfortable and they are fairly capable.

YMMV

A decent web forum is at jeepkj.com - not as good as the GRM forum, and some of the folks aren't very mechanical, but there's a bunch of info on problems they've had, and you can mine some good info out of it.

Biggest concern for any KJ is the lower ball joints - serious safety issue, several recalls, make sure yours has had the recall replacement done; if not, the hot setup seems to be Moog aftermarket units.

Front end clunks are often squirmy rubber swaybar bushings - urethane is available pretty cheap.

If you want a lift (useful on later KJs), a good one is from Old Man Emu (OME) - good gas shocks and springs, good ride, expect about 2.5 inches of lift. Any more and your upper ball joints will interfere with things with bad results. Front coil units are doable at home, but budget some time - you have to disconnect the lower control arms at the inner side to get the struts out; not just a big McPherson, it's more involved - but if I can do it, anyone on the GRM forum can. Just have an extra 6-pack on hand. Rear springs & shocks are super easy.

IIRC, the '02s can be divided into two ride heights, the "pre-lowered" early models are higher than the later ones - running change after Autoweek rolled one in a slalom test. Not a problem if you realize that a high-clearance 4X4 is not a Lotus.

Mine is an '06, 85,000 miles so far, it's a 6-speed so my overall economy as right at 20 MPG. No engine issues yet, only problem was a leaking power steering pump. I like mine, plan to keep it at least 150,000 miles. MPG falls off quickly over 70 mph, so I'm patient on interstates. Most folks with automatics get 3 - 4 lower MPG.

Command-track (conventional 4WD) or Selec-Trac (can be either part time or full time)? Mine's plain old simple (reliable) command trac (required with manual gearbox), but I think the selec-trac would be cool if you live in an area with patchy ice.

I was looking into them briefly. A co-worker of mine has one and likes it, it gets driven up and down a very steep gravel mountain road every day commuting. If any sort of snow and ice is present he puts chains on the rear tires and it does fine.

He says he has not felt anything relating to that front ball joint issue that Jim mentioned. He now has over 130k on his and the only thing that left him stranded was when the water pump went out around 120k.....which is to be expected on any car I suppose.

Him and his wife briefly owned a Commander with the same 3.7 engine, he said that truck was a piece of E36 M3 and a few short months later it was replaced with a trailblazer with the I6 motor.

My wife had one and really liked it, but the gas mileage is pretty low with the automatic. Like 18 on the freeway and 13 around town. I think it's because they are very heavy and probably needed a small V8.

Other than that, it was trouble free and very nice to drive.

-Rob

Can't give you much on the technical side of it, as I never worked on them, but I had an '04 Liberty as a company car for a few years. I put about 40,000 miles on it. Never had any mechanical problems with it. Mine was an auto with Selec-Trac.

Positives: Decent ride comfort/daily driver comfort considering it's off road ability. It's a mountain goat. Never did serious off roading (it was a company car after all), just light stuff. I did drive it through several blizzards. I had snow tires too. As long as you drive smart, it's unstoppable. Interior/cargo room is decent, not great.

Negatives: Gas hog, big time. Compared to my '01 Cherokee it replaced, it felt really slow. The 3.7 had more hp than the 4.0, but I think less tq and it had to rev harder to make power. Didn't have quite the same "rugged" feel as the Cherokee (you can decide if that's a good or bad thing).

Overall, it wasn't bad, but I didn't like it as much as my Cherokee. If you don't expect too much from it, you'll probably like it.

At 144K the main thing I would be on the look out for is the trans you could get two different units one is the 42 (minivan trans ) not good for a long life, the 45 trans on the other hand is overall a good trans and seems to have very few issues .

The ball joints should be checked as they did have a few that broke but at this mileage they may have been replaced .

Other than the trans the rest of the power train is not bad.

Paul B

I think they have some of the most uncomfortable seats that I have ever put my butt into in ANY vehicle!

If you have long legs, they have very little depth to the seat so your legs are unsupported. Mine were sore in less than 20 minutes.

I had an '02 for 8 yrs. and 75K miles. Never had any problems. Towed a 4K lb trailer all over the NE summer and winter. The gas mileage is not great but it compares with others of the same class. As with any vehicle, load is critical to mileage, Mine ran anywhere fro 12 to over 19. I even got 22 a couple of times. Mine was before the lowered models, no big deal.

they are very top heavy, I now know 3 people that have tipped them over on minor obstacles, 2 of those on curbs at under 5 mph.

My wife has an '05 3.7l with a 6 speed. It kicks ass. We've only encountered a couple of problems with about 65K so far.

The first oil change turned in to a trip to our local mechanic to remove the remains of the oil filter after I mangled it, got frustrated and went after it with a cold chisel. It must have been installed with an impact wrench and red loctite. The mechanic ended up brazing a couple of pieces of rod to a socket to engage the holes in the base of the filter from the inside, which was an easy job to get after my chisel work.

The second problem is the stock Goodyear Wrangler ST that are OE on these things. They are utter crap. They are not good in the dry. They are not good in the wet. They are terrible. The General Grabber AT²s we mounted were a huge improvement in all categories.

I really like the Liberty to drive, but like others said 18 mpg is what turns me off.

My dad had one and loved it. Only complaint he had was the gearing on the manual transmission. Too much of a gap in gear ratio from 1st to 2nd. I'm guessing that isn't an issue with an auto.

• 1,000 on the Wrangler STs - there's a reason they are ranked as possibly the worst tire ever on the Tire Rack website. I knew this when I bought my Libby, and replaced them with real tires immediately and garage saled the STs. Thinnest sidewalls I've ever seen. Also agree on the General Grabber AT2s - I'm not using them, but I've read a lot of very positive comments from people who are.

About 25 % of my total driving is off-pavement, and so far I really like the Libby. If I want to go into really rugged terrain, I have a '91 Toyota 4WD pickup for that, but the Libby works well in the snow, mud, and moderate 4-wheeling. Mine has traction control/ABS, and although it's kind of noisy when it works, it is a pretty good substitute for a limited slip. No problems going through a foot of snow (after I put on dedicated studded snow tires, and after I lifted it so it wouldn't get high-centered and so the factory skid plates wouldn't hit rocks on our Jeep trails here in southwestern Colorado).

My real-world gas mileage with the newer Getrag 6-speed: Typically 20 in the summer including 25 % off-pavement using 2WD, 18 winter using 4WD 30 % of the time. There aren't any real cities within 100 miles of me, so that's mostly 50 - 60 mph secondary roads mixed with 2nd and 3rd gear dirt leading to my house. Interstate at 70 mph is about 21 - 22, and if I'm on secondary roads running long distances at 60 - 65 I get 22 - 24. Best ever tank was 25 with a slight tailwind.

Actual weight is around 4200 lbs.

Water pumps and misfires. If you get a misfire that a new plug and swapped injector don't fix, you need the heads need a valve job.

Oh and the usual Chrysler junk, ps pumps, bearings, & rearends.

digdug18 wrote: they are very top heavy, I now know 3 people that have tipped them over on minor obstacles, 2 of those on curbs at under 5 mph.

Was it a 4' high curb??? I can't see any production car rolling over from climing a curb at basically human jogging speed...

NGTD wrote: I think they have some of the most uncomfortable seats that I have ever put my butt into in ANY vehicle! If you have long legs, they have very little depth to the seat so your legs are unsupported. Mine were sore in less than 20 minutes.

I have to agree on that one, and I'm short 5'6". It felt like the seats had a crown to them.

I have a 2wd 02 Grand Cherokee with the 4.0, and I see or beat these mileage numbers. If I'm careful, I can get up to about 23mpg on the interstate. My town is on a grid system, so most of my drives are 25 MPH with stops every block, and I still get about 17MPG. Last time I saw 13MPG, I was towing something. Considering the price of the WJ, I'd probably buy that again, though I think the early Liberty is a little cooler looking.

As long as you don't mind being the red-headed step-child of the Jeep community
Oh, and the Libby is the only vehicle that approaches the Miata and Del Sol in the chick-car department.

FWIW, when Petersen's 4WD tested out the Liberty on the Rubicon, it fared better than the same year Grand Cherokee (yet somehow the GC is seen as more of a 'real Jeep').

EDIT: The 1st-gen Liberty, not that abortion of a rebadged Dodge Nitro.

The "chick car factor" isn't a big deal since this IS for my wife to use as a DD, so I reckon that is actually a plus.

KY state law requires the dealer to supply you with the PO's contact information, so I just may give it a shout and see what services may have been done.

Thanks for the input, guys.

We have a 2007 Sport model (2WD) with about 55k miles on it.

The seats are about the worst I've ever encountered. I've sat on concrete stairs that were more comfortable. That is not an exaggeration. Long trips will make you ache. I'm looking at the local junkyards to try and find something else that will fit.

If you've got kids or are going to have some soon, the LATCH system in the Liberty seems to be among the least annoying to deal with. Rear facing car seats fit well enough if you're average height. I was chewing on the steering wheel in my wife's former car with a car seat behind me.

We get ~25MPG true highway and around 20MPG in real world mixed conditions.

Mine came with a tow package, it has the beefy transmission and I think it has a transmission cooler. I've towed both a Neon and a BMW 325 over 250 miles on a trailer behind it, no issues.

ReverendDexter wrote: FWIW, when Petersen's 4WD tested out the Liberty on the Rubicon, it fared better than the same year Grand Cherokee (yet somehow the GC is seen as more of a 'real Jeep'). EDIT: The 1st-gen Liberty, not that abortion of a rebadged Dodge Nitro.

link?

DILYSI Dave wrote:

ReverendDexter wrote: FWIW, when Petersen's 4WD tested out the Liberty on the Rubicon, it fared better than the same year Grand Cherokee (yet somehow the GC is seen as more of a 'real Jeep'). EDIT: The 1st-gen Liberty, not that abortion of a rebadged Dodge Nitro.

link?

Tree version, but I'll do a quick search and see if they put the article online.

EDIT: I'm not finding it, this was back in '01 when the Liberty first came out, so it doesn't really surprise me. It just stuck in my head because they mentioned the Liberty came out relatively unscathed, whereas the GC had dented every body panel but the roof. It helped reinforce my bias against the GC, lol.