Autocross Underdogs

So, yeah.
Current DD/AX weapon: 95 Miata, set up for STR
(Thank you Limited Slip)
It being my DD makes me hesitant to swap in an open diff, which would put me down to STS.
(Plus I have the awesome 9 inch wheels and tires for STR)
Competitive on the super tight courses my local club runs due to our lack of space.
Not so much at the larger courses I run with the metric clubs up in BC.

Picked up an 86 MR2 the other day for a song.
Rough body, salvage title, needs a suspension makeover anyway, of course I'm thinking about AX.

My big question is, would I be equally outclassed running E-stock in the MR2 as I am in STR with an old miata?

And no, I'm not considering the Challenge, 3000 miles is a little far.

DP is you competitive playground last time I checked.

How about chopping off the trunk, removing the hood and front fenders/tube frame support for the radiator and shedding all other possible weight? I know it's been done before, and the car was quite fast.

Sounds like my miata. And getting hammered in STR wasn't much fun so to go faster I slapped race rubber on and called it CSP. Still uncompetitive but raw times are much more fun.

Are you trying to find a car to win, or a car that you love dearly and want to have fun with?

If it's the former, I'd go to scca.org, and look at previous year results, and of the top cars in the class you like, pick the top car that you like the best.

If it's the latter- have fun beating cars and drivers who should be faster than you.

So if you really like that MR2, what can you do to the car right up to the rules, and will it still be a car that you love?

93 MR2 is the one to have for E-stock, last I checked. I had an 86 I ran in CSP, just because I had it. That was way back in 2006, when I bought a reasonable-mileage, no-rust, nearly perfect MR2 from the original owner for $1000. Those deals were getting rare then, and long gone now.

Mk1 MR2 is way down on torque, way up in mass, and tire-constrained to be a contender in any class without radical modification. Could be fun if you're competing against yourself.

MR2 in ES is one of the suspected competitors around here. A couple of people trying it. The biggest problem is getting one that's not junk or returning it from junk to it's actual potential.

Depends on what level of competition you're looking at. Locally, anything can happen. But at the SRS BSNS level, I don't think the AW11 has a chance against the SW20, MR-S, and NB.

MRS is an amazing ES car, I don't see an AW11 or SW20 being able to compete.

evildky wrote: MRS is an amazing ES car, I don't see an AW11 or SW20 being able to compete.

This.

SnowMongoose wrote: It being my DD makes me hesitant to swap in an open diff, which would put me down to STS.

Why?

I daily drive a '95 Miata, which is set up for STS and has an open diff. (I only have 550lb/in front springs and stock engine management vs a national level setup)

A set of snow tires on BMW E30 bottlecap wheels go on when it starts getting cold and I have never had a problem.

Not like you want to drive competitive ST tires in the winter anyways, even with an LSD

I had a '01 Integra LS that ran in STS … against all the over dogs … then I tried it in DSP … even worse … retired it to DD and now have a CRX in STS … much more fun to at least be competitive … knowing it's not the cars fault

Try taking a 1991 Ford Taurus to an autox.......and finish mid pack(out of 16 people) in Street Modified Street Tire.

Once again, I go onto a thread and don't have a clue what everyone's talking about. Oh, well.

I seldom hear about or see people run the first gen MR2 in auto-x, so it could be the outclassed generation MR2. You can still be competitive in your region if you're fast enough.

evildky wrote: MRS is an amazing ES car, I don't see an AW11 or SW20 being able to compete.

Chris Bailey would disagree with you about the SW20. He has a wicked fast one in ES.

G_Body_Man wrote: Once again, I go onto a thread and don't have a clue what everyone's talking about. Oh, well.

Stick around you might learn something.

moparman76_69 wrote:

G_Body_Man wrote: Once again, I go onto a thread and don't have a clue what everyone's talking about. Oh, well.

Stick around you might learn something.

Lemme just get my popcorn.

In reply to drdisque:

10 years ago, the SW20 was absolutely the weapon of choice in ES. But for whatever reason, the NA Miatas have dominated the last decade, and bringing the MR-S and NB into the class hasn't helped the SW20's cause.

Gearing could be part of the problem...my SW20 tops out in second at 53 mph, and with shorter-than-stock race rubber, it's actually going slower than that. I know Miatas are frequently all over the rev limiter, but I don't think they're quite as bad.

Apexcarver wrote: Why?

I already have the 15x9's and associated tires for STR, plus enjoy the perks of a limited slip on a street car that spends much of the year on all-seasons in the wet.
The fact that I barely fit into the miata (would need to bolt an aluminum seat to the floor to pass the broomstick test, for example) means that, while I like how the car handles, I'm by no means beholden to it.
Miata is what I have but for me, Miata is for sure not the answer.

So, setting the MR2 up for ES would be as if not more pointless than the Miata in STR, check. And the Miata is already set up.
Not to say that autocross isn't always fun, but having no chance of winning heavily dilutes the enjoyment ceiling for me, so yeah.
FWIW, I've no intention of doing anything beyond local events for the foreseeable future.
Hell, I've only got somewhere around 7 autocrosses under my belt, I'm still new to this.
So, being nationally competetive? No way.
I'm mostly concerning myself with not bringing a knife to a gunfight, I'm OK with having a less-than-ideal gun.

moparman76_69 wrote:

G_Body_Man wrote: Once again, I go onto a thread and don't have a clue what everyone's talking about. Oh, well.

Stick around you might learn something.

How can he tell who has the biggest hat over the internet?

Lancer007 wrote:

moparman76_69 wrote:

G_Body_Man wrote: Once again, I go onto a thread and don't have a clue what everyone's talking about. Oh, well.

Stick around you might learn something.

How can he tell who has the biggest hat over the internet?

What does that have to do with anything?

That young many certainly has a large hat.

So...
which is less outclassed?
STR NA miata or ES AW11?

if I can move away from the Miata being my autocross car, selling it will become much less difficult for me.
(The answer is impractical and not a good physical fit for me)

Anything keeping you from buying a set of $100 Craigslist Meeotter wheels and jumping the NA back to ES? Its still slightly outclassed by the NB/MR2S, but probably not nearly as bad as in STR.

Disclaimer: I usually wear a baseball cap at events, so discount my advice accordingly.

In reply to Kazoospec: Because if the car is in even mild STR trim it's had a lot more mods than simply swapping wheels. Springs/diff/intake/exhaust/etc are likely changed out.

Understandable on the fitment thing if thats what is keeping you from really wanting to keep the Miata around.

I will say that I do not really tend to notice the lack of LSD on my open diff Miata unless I am really pressing it. Hell, at auto-x it really only needs to be driven around on very tight corners or at rain events. (then again, my ESP Mustang loves to kill diffs and I have experience driving around THAT)

That also being said, the trophies for STS were about the same times as the trophies for STR at nationals last year. They are rough classes with some pointy-end driver/car combinations.

Nationals results STS top 3 122.5, 122.9, and 124.5

STR top 3 121.8, 122.4, 122.4

Last trophy for each, STS 125.6 STR 123.6

Looking at the results, STS is a bit softer, but more of a class with a few REALLY well developed cars that would have easily trophied in STR as well.

I know some of the feeling as in my STS Miata (which was on an eyeball suspension setup) got 37th in PAX out of 190ish entries at DCR's last event, but lost my class by 1.5 seconds.