BaT auction, reserve or no reserve?

I took 120-130 photos after work yesterday, 2 videos (walk-around and behind the wheel while revving the engine).  Every angle, interior, exterior, engine, details, decals, every blemish and imperfection.  Planning to list today or tomorrow, or at least submit everything.

Wondering if I'm better off using a reserve or no reserve?  I'm not looking to make crazy $$, but I also don't want to screw myself if bidding peters out at $7K.  I'd like to get $20K, see if it goes higher (which based on the current market for 944's it might).  But maybe set a reserve at $15K as a safety?

Unless it is a super hot car I'd put a reserve if it was mine. I'd just check 944 history to see how many bidders are on each auction.

With BaT I'm not sure I'd worry too much. There are so many dealers and brokers on that site that very very few things get through unseen, let alone ANYTHING Porsche.

You want a reserve. BaT will be more willing to accept the listing without one (or a lower than you'd like one) though. Or maybe they've gotten to the point where they're high volume enough that they don't care anymore.

Depends on if you want it sold or not.  If you need the space or the cash, go No Reserve.  Reserve is for dealers and guys who can sit on something for a while.  

The auction will get the current market price, for better or for worse.  

You want a reserve!  Some cars bring ALL the money on BaT, but there are plenty that don't.  My Corrado sold for ~20% less than what I thought the lowest number would be, based on what other Corrado's had recently sold for there.  My friends 993C4S also under performed on BaT, and it was a low mileage, well cared for, unique color car.

There's no rhyme or reason, BaT isn't a slam dunk for huge money, all the time.  As pointed out, depending on the reserve, BaT might decline to accept the car at all,  but if you have a reasonable reserve, they will.

Bear in mind, BaT has a dedicated team that will push you to set a very low reserve #

I'm not even sure that I even have mixed feelings for BAT at this point.

I spent so much time and effort preparing auctions for my Volvo V70R (low mileage, unmodified) and my Mustang pedal car (possibly the best remaining unrestored 50 year old example in the world), and they rejected them after multiple revisions, both with and without reserves, in spite of the fact that they had listed nothing similar in previous years.

And yet, they will accept a set of mid 80s Fuchs wheels, which are so common that I've personally sold eight sets of them on eBay.

Their administration is so berkeleyed up that I don't even look at the sight anymore.

They have always given me good advice. No reserve auctions have different dynamics than ones with a reserve. They suggested we list "Project Ron" without reserve, and the result of that auction was very satisfactory. The one time they pushed back on a reserve I wanted, they were right.

I was stressed as hell when they would only list my V8 Firefly with no reserve.  In the end, it didn't go as high as I had hoped, but (to their credit) it was a very unique vehicle and while it was the highest viewed auction at the time, it was really only for a select small audience.

I'd expect the Porsche to do what Porsches do, and you're at the mercy of the market at the time.  It will probably be fine, but expect some more gray hair. I don't do "non-calculated risks" well.

In reply to SkinnyG (Forum Supporter) :

The one BaT auction that has disappointed me was the XXXocet (supercharged LS Exocet built with cost no object). It went for far less than it should have - but like your Firefly, it was an oddball that didn't push the buttons of a lot of people.

Just be sure that you have amazing photos. Amazing photos seems to me what sells cars on that site. You have to sell the beauty of the car as well as show comprehensive details on every little piece of the car. Don't just snap some pics on your phone and call it a day. Just my opinion.

I have experienced two sales on BAT, one that didn't meet reserve, one that just barely did, and I was thankful to have them. But these cars were outside the general likes of that site and were never going to be worth much anyway, so I expect your Porsche to do much better.

93gsxturbo said:

Depends on if you want it sold or not.  If you need the space or the cash, go No Reserve.  Reserve is for dealers and guys who can sit on something for a while.  

The auction will get the current market price, for better or for worse.  

This might be the most reasonable reply.  I'm thinking either no reserve or very low like $12k.  I'm not looking for big $, cash isn't a factor but I really want the space back.  Two car garage and small driveway, with 5 cars and moving E36 M3 around for this last night makes me even more motivated to sell.

AMiataCalledSteve said:

Just be sure that you have amazing photos. Amazing photos seems to me what sells cars on that site. You have to sell the beauty of the car as well as show comprehensive details on every little piece of the car. Don't just snap some pics on your phone and call it a day. Just my opinion.

I have experienced two sales on BAT, one that didn't meet reserve, one that just barely did, and I was thankful to have them. But these cars were outside the general likes of that site and were never going to be worth much anyway, so I expect your Porsche to do much better.

Amazing photos will help sell anything, not just on BaT. It's the biggest piece of advice I give to anyone who's looking to sell a car. 

BaT does have a photography service if you're not able to do well yourself, it's pretty reasonably priced.

Jerry said:

93gsxturbo said:

Depends on if you want it sold or not.  If you need the space or the cash, go No Reserve.  Reserve is for dealers and guys who can sit on something for a while.  

The auction will get the current market price, for better or for worse.  

This might be the most reasonable reply.  I'm thinking either no reserve or very low like $12k.  I'm not looking for big $, cash isn't a factor but I really want the space back.  Two car garage and small driveway, with 5 cars and moving E36 M3 around for this last night makes me even more motivated to sell.

Thank you.  Its hard to let go of a car you have attachment to...and your car is NICE... but sometimes you just want the cash and the space for something else.  The nice part with No Reserve is that when the auction is over, 99% of the time, you are paid and on to the next thing, and sometimes that is worth more than the final sell price.

The other thing to consider is we all feel that *our* examples of our favorite car is the best and should be priced at the top of the scale.   The market may feel differently.  A reserve may just be pissing into the wind if its above market valuation.  In this case a 944 is a pretty nice desirable car, and if the selling price was a *deal*, someone would have snapped it up already, assuming it has been listed in all the right places.  Before going down the BaT rabbit hole, maybe just drop your private party selling price to what the bare minimum is you are willing to settle for and get it gone with less hastle.

In reply to 93gsxturbo :

So far I've only listed it here, and our local SCCA Facebook groups.  I was hoping to avoid the general population and all the dude-bros that brings.  But maybe it's worth listing it locally on MP at $20K and see if I get lucky.  (If it were my typical Toyota/Mazda/Subbie regular car in the $4-8K range I might be more ok with MP, but then again maybe that's the opposite thinking?)

I also found that there could be a significantly long period of time between when you submit your auction and when they get around to telling you that they're not interested in it. And they don't want you to list it anywhere else while you're waiting for them to make up their mind. 

A 944 Turbo is a desirable car, but at this point, a good one is going to sell to a Porsche enthusiast.
 

Pick a price that you're happy with and sell it on Pelican. 

You might want to try Cars and Bids. Doug Demuro is a true blue car guy and I like the vibe of the site. I purchased my '08 Boxster S there so I have some experience on the other end of the sale. Worked perfectly IMHO...

Just from that one picture, is that a bunch of swirl marks in the paint or just weird reflections? 

Might be worth it to spend the few hundred bucks to have a pro do a cut/polish/wax. 

If you go auction make sure it does not end on a weekend. People are hot and bidding during the week while at work. People get busy on weekends and lose interest in the auction. Doug Demuro himself said this piece of advice.

My experience with BaT came with the following "learnings"

- What your car sells for is subject in great part to random chance - specifically, the random group of viewers that see your car that week. Maybe you get lucky and two rich people get in a bidding war, driving it way up. The next week however, those people may be absent, so your car barely reaches 1/3 of it could have. Spin the bottle.

- It sells for market value - period - which may or may not match your expectations, but You aren't buying the car. It's only worth what someone will pay.

- If you bought during an upswing, and are selling after the peak, you have to be brutally honest with yourself about what its actual worth is in the week that it's being bid on.

- Agree with the views on having a reserve, or not. If the space and cash is important, no need for a reserve. Sell it and move on. If you really think that you know better than everyone on Earth what it's worth and are in no rush, set a reserve. Back when I sold Midlana on BaT (twice... long story...), they pushed for a low reserve. Seen from a business standpoint, their tactic makes sense: They rather make a smaller commission on a sale that actually goes through, rather than nothing due to it not meeting the reserve - they're only thinking of themselves. If you're fine with their suggestion, great. If not, they may let you post it with your reserve, but don't count on it. 

- One funny thing about auctions: Assuming a really big audience, the winner is the only person on Earth who thinks the car is worth that price. By definition, no one else thinks it worth that. Sort of a bittersweet thought when you win something. Of course, it could have been a sleepy week and all the big bidders are away, so technically it's possible to get a deal. Technically...

I decided to give local Marketplace a try just in case.  Shared the listing to two 944 groups I joined.  Maybe something will pan out.  If not, BaT and C&B are the last option.

BaT did not for work me.

I chose no reserve, then:

They insisted mileage was unknown because I disclosed a broken odometer gear that when it occurred: I parked the car, ordered the parts, then fixed before driving it again.  O.K., I get it, broken odometer gear- but there is a way to pull mileage out of the ECU which I did and it was well withing the range of tire diameter wear or many other real life milage variance.  I've seen many auctions with 'known' mileage that was obviously very very sketchy.  Smart people call it out in the comments-  but still.

BaT typeoed the car trim level on the auction name and killed the first couple days of views before I figured out what was going on, which if accrual is actually a thing, and my accountant and IRS both says it is- cut the number of interested buyers a whole bunch.  If a buyer was correctly searching the most valuable trim level and model, which I was selling, they would not have found it.

Un effing believably, BaT, at the time, did not have push notifications for Volvo 850s.  So you had to search manually when you remembered to if you wanted a Volvo 850.  If I had noticed this particular idiocy I would never had listed the car there.

The BaT 'brand expert' knew nothing about Volvo 850s and wrote a stupid description.

What saved me was the winning bidder PM'd me before they won and wrote I was getting so screwed that If I wanted to keep the car I could if I paid their auction fee. I had no idea this was possible until this gentleperson PM'd me.  I felt squeamish and wondered would it mean that I was a bad person and maybe even go to jail if I accepted this offer?,.... until I remembered that I lived in this world and not the one they said I would be living in when I was in high school.

On the other hand if you were the second place bidder and thought the auction was corrupt- there was no recourse,  "we are just an app" was the level of customer support on the winners side.  The second that action was over not even long since dead crickets.

I will not list there again reserve or no reserve.  Obviously for some bling cars it's nuts-o great.

I've noticed a lot of "alumni" cars showing up on BaT these days, including a large number that were bought in the "crazy, gogo" days of a year or two ago, makes it look pretty shady when the same cars keep showing up every 6 months or a year. Reminds me too much of Mecum.....

I've not seen one car that I was interested in sell for cheap, except the one I was trying to buy and they screwed up my CC info and didn't take my bid. Of course, no way of knowing how high the winner would have gone if I had been able  to bid so.......

Best of luck, but I've had the easiest time selling "enthusiast" cars on that brand's forums......I do have friends who have successfully sold cars on BaT too.