Cheap cars for charity

I'm working with a local non profit agency that provides resources and training to fight poverty.

The guy running it is about as far from a car guy as you can get. Yesterday he asked me what I thought of expanding the services offered from the traditional job training, living assistance, etc to providing cheap reliable transportation to people trying to get out of poverty.

In the last year he has come in contact with multiple people who's major hurdle to getting out of a bad situation was reliable transportation. These were all people that had jobs, were willing to work, but either had no car or there's was so unreliable it was costing them jobs. (we have NO public transportation in my town).

A typical case is one I helped with yesterday. A young man is a skilled carpenter, does great work, has a wife and a kid. He bought a $200 jeep cherokee that had been rear ended pretty bad. the back lights were smashed. he was getting to work in it, trying to save up money to get it fixed, stickered and legal. Well, driving to work he got a ticket. Now he has to decide to feed his wife and kid, pay the ticket, or fix the car. Two weeks later he gets another ticket. sooner or later instead of getting a ticket, they'll arrest him, he can't make bail, loses his job and things spiral down hill quickly.

We found a $800 corolla to give him, and the cycle is broken.

I have two young mechanics that we will pay to do the work on the side, and they will check the cars over before we buy them.

I need help developping a list of vehicles that we can buy, maybe do minor repairs on, and have running reliably (or as reliably as we can) for $800-$1000.

On those cars, what are problem areas to look at, or very important maintenance we should do?

Corollas, civics, saturns, j-bodies, panther cars all come to mind as stuff I'd think would run forever in that category. I'm sure others will chime in with more specifics.

At that price point, you really do not choose the cars, they choose you. That is, sure, you want Toyotas but Old Ciera will be more common in your price range. They are crappy but they will run a long time...crapilly.

You will find Saturn Vues in your price range with 4 cyl and auto transmissions in need of trans work. Even though they may look nice, avoid them. These transmissions are CVT's. They were sort of a GM experiment and the experiment failed miserably. They have a reputation of failing at 60k miles. There is no improvement to the design and no clear path to repair. It is possible to put a 4 speed auto in but the swap is labor intensive and cumbersome what with needs for new BCM and TCM. You will need most all of a compete donor car.

I would recommend all small Saturn S-series cars that you can find. You could stick to that model and build one fresh car out of two wrecked cars.
Do you have a space to keep "parts cars"?

I am a simple guy. I like to keep things as easy as possible. I'd pick two vehicles to hand out. a truck, and a car. ford ranger, saturn s series car. both can be had for next to nothing, and many of the parts are interchangeable. this will make your local mechanics job easy and will cost less to get parts out of the scrap yard.

Getting people out of poverty is more about educating them than it is about helping them find a job. for this reason, I would be teaching your clients proper vehicle care and maintenance before you give them a car. If they know how to maintain a vehicle, it will last longer.

Bobby and I are on the same thought plain.
If your mechanics could get good at replacing manifold intake gaskets on GM 3.1L engines, you should be able to buy many for cheap.

In your search I think I would ask this question:
What cars have common, debilitating failures that can be fixed with mostly labor and not expensive parts resulting in non-running cars that can be bought at or near scrap prices?

Such as, what cars are non-interference design timing belts?

Troof on the Olds Ciera and its ilk. I've had to try REALLY hard to kill those. And it still ended up being a car accident that did it.

The main focus if this charity is education, both job training and how to stop making bad decisions that keep you in poverty. These cars would mostly be for people who have already completed job and life skills training. Either myself or the mechanic will be teaching a car care class before they can drive off

JohnRW1621 wrote: Bobby and I are on the same thought plain. If your mechanics could get good at replacing manifold intake gaskets on GM 3.1L engines, you should be able to buy many for cheap. In your search I think I would ask this question: What cars have common, debilitating failures that car be fixed with mostly labor and not expensive parts resulting in non-running cars that can be bought at or near scrap prices? Such as, what cars are non-interference design timing belts?

This is exactly what I'm looking for

What cars had the gm 3.1 with gasket issues?

Is that the replacement for the 3.8 that's in all the malibus and such now?

The Wiki of GM 3.1L

Wiki of GM 3800, Series 2 a much better engine.

icaneat50eggs wrote: A typical case is one I helped with yesterday. A young man is a skilled carpenter, does great work, has a wife and a kid. He bought a $200 jeep cherokee that had been rear ended pretty bad. the back lights were smashed. he was getting to work in it, trying to save up money to get it fixed, stickered and legal. Well, driving to work he got a ticket. Now he has to decide to feed his wife and kid, pay the ticket, or fix the car. Two weeks later he gets another ticket.

He could... should I... ah screw it, not even going to bother floundering this thread. My quoted post says it all.

That was just an example. I've sat down and done budgets with lots of people in similar situations. If you think getting out of poverty is easy and obvious your wrong.

Sorry to go off on a tangent, but have you considered part of the education program putting those people to work on the car they're recieving? My wife does very similar work (she's a mental health case manager, so it's managing their care as well as the reasons they're crazy) and one thing they really try to do is to give the people a hand up, not a hand out, as it were. Sort of the whole FDR new deal approach, or something. Seems to me that when people are broke, there's a lot of underlying issues, and a little bit of confidence that they CAN keep a car going, etc- might go a long way.

That's exactly what they do. Everyone will receive at least basic trainin in car care. Its done on a case by case basis. A single mom that's working a job and putting herself through nursing school at night we aren't going to ask to help do a timing belt. However if they have no skills then we will probably ask them to help and watch while the work is being done. All of these details have to be ironed out and presented to the board

Neat. I was just curious. I am a big fan of programs that are designed to get people to work for themselves.

icaneat50eggs wrote: That was just an example. I've sat down and done budgets with lots of people in similar situations. If you think getting out of poverty is easy and obvious your wrong.

+1, stuff happens. And some bad decisions stay with people for a lifetime. I'm not saying people should not be held responsible for their actions, but you can't expect people who don't know any better to do any better. And if people aren't educated as to how to break the cycle of poverty, then it just never ends.

First off, it sounds like that charity is doing some great work! I helped out someone last year in a similar situation. I take basic transportation for granted, but the man I met was doing two paper routes and his only car was undriveable (flat tire, cracked radiator, no money or ability to fix it). I helped him repair the car, and it allowed him to keep his job. I have to say, that was some of the most rewarding work on cars I've ever done.

He had a 2.2L/5spd Saturn Vue, and I was impressed with it. They're probably a little out of the price range you're looking for, but I think the S-series Saturn would be a great car to get in that price range. I agree with the advice of the poster who said to stick to one or two basic models, that way you'll quickly know their strengths and weaknesses, and can build up a parts supply.

Good luck with the charity, and let us know how it goes. I'd love to start up a similar charity someday!

RWD Volvos with broken timing belts. Non-interference means cheap/easy fix and the cars are tanks.

Using the same logic, Miata is still THE ANSWER.

In reply to Junkyard_Dog:I'm reading in complete and utter disbelief that this thread went on for more than, well, two posts before the Miata came up.

No new advice on which casrs to look fgor, thats covered pretty well above, but may I suggest seeing if you can work a carpooling aspect into the program? Could provide a good multiplier effect when combined with the life skills and the car program. Obviously, not everyone would be able to successfully share a ride to work, but each one that does can make a significant difference.

J bodies, late nineties corolla/prism, maybe neons, 4 cyl rangers.

Teach the people the importance of checking fluid levels and tire pressure. Teach more involved maintenance on an as needed basis, surely some clients could be taught to change motor oil and disk brake pads, but they would be a minority.

Also, have you considered a car sharing, or hourly rental program for those who don't need a car every day?

I would just worry about maintenance and upkeep on those cars. We'll take your example with the Jeep guy. He had a $200 car, sounded like it needed tail lights to be legal, junkyard taillights probably cost $30 at a U-Pull type place, maybe less, if the body was damaged enough that the factory units wouldn't fit, a set of trailer lights at HF he could have jury rigged are like $12 on sale, or even a roll of that red clear tape for $5. So for $5 minimum he could have been legal. You'll definitely have to change the way these people think if they don't think that spending $5 up front will save them hundreds in the long run, if you wan this program to stay alive.

Just remember, there's no such thing as a free car, at least not one you can drive legally, and without a budget these people will be right back in the same boat again.

Check out this Tampa non-profit as they are doing exactly what you are talking about.

Wheels for Success

I heard the founder speak and she has done a nice job. I'm sure she would be open to provide insight on some of the issues they have dealt with.