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Jaynen
Jaynen SuperDork
1/8/18 2:34 p.m.

The copart miata has rusty rotors and old as hell pads on it, so I am replacing all of that anyway so I decided to go ahead and do the brake lines and fluid for track duty at the same time.

I have done rotors and pads on other cars quite a few times and I have bled brakes on motorcycles and maybe a car or two a long time ago but when replacing all the lines I assume the system will need to be completely refilled/evacuated?

Is there a smart way to do this or any tips? Especially to make it doable solo?

Stefan
Stefan GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
1/8/18 3:08 p.m.

Build a pressure bleeder and do one corner at a time.

Rusty rotors aren't the end of the world, but old flex lines, seals and rusty brake lines aren't good.

http://www.ibmwr.org/ktech/pressure-bleeder/bleeder.shtml

AngryCorvair
AngryCorvair GRM+ Memberand UltimaDork
1/8/18 3:10 p.m.

Replacing pads, rotors, tubes and hoses:  No reason to evacuate system.  Gravity bleed should be sufficient.

Jaynen
Jaynen SuperDork
1/8/18 8:09 p.m.

So just catch what comes out per wheel when the lines are replaced and then gravity bleed it which is having the thing on the hose above the wheel/master cylinder right? But that will that let me flush it so I get the high temp fluid in there?

Keith Tanner
Keith Tanner GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
1/8/18 9:00 p.m.

Attach the line starting at the hard line, and leave the bleed screw open at the caliper until you're done. That will introduce the least amount of air into the system. The fluid running through the system will displace the air.

A gravity bleed is a pressure bleed using atmospheric pressure. Just open up the bleed screw and let it drool. It's really easy to do by yourself, you can do all four corners at once and you don't introduce microbubbles into the system which can happen with a pressure bleeder. It just takes a little longer.

If you want to flush, let it drool longer. Best way to get a head start is to suck the master cylinder reservoir dry with a turkey baster and replace it with fresh fluid before you start. No point in wasting your time sucking all that old crap fluid through the system.

Jaynen
Jaynen SuperDork
1/9/18 7:04 a.m.

Just to be clear, you attach that at the brake caliper bleed screw and keep the reservoir with the good new fluid above the caliper AND the master cylinder or just the caliper? Oh and the cap needs to be off the master cylinder during this process and I should evacuate the old fluid from the master cylinder first

gearheadmb
gearheadmb Dork
1/9/18 7:17 a.m.

In reply to Jaynen :

No, a gravity bleed is simply open the resevoir cap, open the bleeders, and let the fluid run through. The fluid running downhill from the master cylinder will push the air out of the lines at the bleeders. It can be a slow process, and for a long time it will seem like nothing is happening while the air slowly escapes. But eventually (it may take 5 minutes, it may take an hour or two) you will start getting a steady drip from the bleeders. When you see the steady drip from a bleeder, close just that bleeder. That circuit (wheel) should be free of air now. Repeat wheel by wheel until all four bleeders are closed. One important thing to note is DO NOT LET THE MASTER CYLINDER GO EMPTY DURING THIS PROCESS. The level will of course be going down, if either side of the resevoir goes empty it will suck air into the lines, which means youre starting over.

Keith Tanner
Keith Tanner GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
1/9/18 7:57 a.m.

If you install the lines as I described, the drool should start within 30 seconds. A gravity bleed is the simplest possible way to bleed brakes, the only tool and equipment you need is a small wrench for the bleeder valve and maybe a piece of hose - although I usually just let it pee on the caliper and wipe it down when I’m done. 

Regardless of how you do it, change the fluid in the MC reservoir before you start. It’s just a lot easier and quicker than sucking it all out the long way. 

Jaynen
Jaynen SuperDork
1/9/18 1:00 p.m.

the hardline is the end away from the caliper correct (the metal lines they route through the car)

If I need to do the sway should I do it at the same time? Or do sways need to be done with the car on the ground? In which case I should get some ramps

Keith Tanner
Keith Tanner GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
1/9/18 1:17 p.m.

Right, hard line is the metal line attached to the body.

Sways can be done with the car in the air. If the car's an NA, it's best to tighten up the end links when the car has weight on the wheels. NBs don't care.

Jaynen
Jaynen SuperDork
1/9/18 1:18 p.m.

NB so good there

Streetwiseguy
Streetwiseguy UltimaDork
1/9/18 1:28 p.m.

I think the most important part of the whole deal is to allow as little air as possible into the system. Keep the master cylinder from going dry, bleed each wheel as you install the parts, and it is cake.

Jaynen
Jaynen SuperDork
1/13/18 10:44 a.m.

Can I do one brake and bleed it at a time with the lines and stuff or do I need to bleed everything at once when its done?

Streetwiseguy
Streetwiseguy UltimaDork
1/13/18 11:38 a.m.

One at a time is just fine.  Probably best, really.

Just make sure the master doesn't go dry.

Jaynen
Jaynen SuperDork
1/13/18 11:42 a.m.

What about the fact the rear of the car is jacked up, will that make it so gravity bleed has trouble? Unless I get the front in the air too? (I am working on the rear right now)

Keith Tanner
Keith Tanner GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
1/13/18 12:21 p.m.

Not unless you're jacked up so far that the master is below the caliper. That would require significant effort. 

Jaynen
Jaynen SuperDork
1/13/18 1:09 p.m.

Hah, no just enough to get it onto stands

ebonyandivory
ebonyandivory UberDork
1/13/18 6:45 p.m.

I’d like to see colored (like adding a dye) brake fluid so there’s no doubt you have all new fluid at each caliper.

Jaynen
Jaynen SuperDork
1/13/18 9:26 p.m.

yeah I wondered about that, but doubt food coloring or something would be ok/work?

I am glad I looked up some directions I  had no idea about needing to back the piston out of the rear caliper via a hex bolt

Streetwiseguy
Streetwiseguy UltimaDork
1/13/18 9:44 p.m.

If it hasn't been changed in five years, you will be able to tell when the fresh stuff makes it to the bleeder.

buzzboy
buzzboy Reader
1/13/18 9:45 p.m.

We always talk about doing brakes starting farthest from the master. Remember that on the miata the driver side rear is the farthest from the master.

Keith Tanner
Keith Tanner GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
1/13/18 9:59 p.m.
Jaynen said:

yeah I wondered about that, but doubt food coloring or something would be ok/work?

I am glad I looked up some directions I  had no idea about needing to back the piston out of the rear caliper via a hex bolt

Some guy wrote a book about this stuff wink

Jaynen
Jaynen SuperDork
1/14/18 8:02 a.m.
Keith Tanner said:
Jaynen said:

yeah I wondered about that, but doubt food coloring or something would be ok/work?

I am glad I looked up some directions I  had no idea about needing to back the piston out of the rear caliper via a hex bolt

Some guy wrote a book about this stuff wink

I feel ashamed to admit your book is literally sitting two feet from me and I did not think to look in it

Jaynen
Jaynen SuperDork
1/18/18 4:52 p.m.

Alright almost done, working on front brakes. The springs setup is quite a bit different than the rear. Do I need to do something manual to push the piston in far enough to put it back together?

I removed the bracket and the slider pins and was having issues getting things back together, do I need to remount the bracket over the new rotor then mount the pads, then finally the caliper part with the piston?

Keith Tanner
Keith Tanner GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
1/18/18 4:56 p.m.

For the fronts, just push the piston in. I'll often use the old brake pad as a lever but a big pair of channel-loc pliers does the trick.

You have the reassembly order correct. Rotor, bracket, pads, springs, caliper.

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