http://www.focusfanatics.com/forum/showthread.php?t=537186
SERIOUSLY spend the money. it'll save you time, money and possibly your life. or someone elses.
http://www.focusfanatics.com/forum/showthread.php?t=537186
SERIOUSLY spend the money. it'll save you time, money and possibly your life. or someone elses.
I agree about not buying cheap suspension parts.
However, I think it should also be noted:
You should not install a ball joint with a breaker bar. You should use a torque wrench.
Good parts fail too.
Ball joints generally don't fail at high speed. They are under the most stress when turning standing still or moving slowly, and therefore they usually break at slow speeds.
Was the pinch bolt new, or did you re-use an old one?
Is that an actual proper pinch bolt, or a standard bolt? (Pinch bolts are tapered. Joint will fail with a standard bolt)
That pinch bolt does not look torqued. There is a gap between the 2 sides of the knuckle (I think it should be torqued to 37 lb/ft).
Did you check the knuckle for wear when you installed?
This should have given warning signs- vibration, noise, etc.
Drive safely!
Are you sure that pinch bolt is not broken?
It might be 2 halves of a bolt, still in the holes.
You may have stressed it close to the snapping point with a breaker bar.
Why on earth would you tighten a balljoint with a breaker bar?
Actually, why would you tighten ANYTHING with a breaker bar?
SVreX wrote: Are you sure that pinch bolt is not broken? It might be 2 halves of a bolt, still in the holes. You may have stressed it close to the snapping point with a breaker bar.
Kinda thinking the same...I don't see how the neck of that shaft (snicker) could end up outside (I'm killing myself over here)...the pocket.
To OP;
In all seriousness, and trying to be helpful, is that bolt going horizontally at the bottom of the spindle still whole? Look up it if it is. If it bulges out into the circle, and was not broken, or worn, the only explanation I can see is the ball joint was not fully seated, and the retaining bolt was installed above the relief in the ball joint. Again, I'm trying to be helpful, not split hairs.
That ball joint didn't fail, it was installed wrong, which is quite the feat. The cinder block jackstand and wrong pinch bolt (note how you can see threads in the gap, not shank) backs that up.
Don't those knuckles generally have threads in them for the pinch bolt, rather than using a nut? Maybe the guy used not only the wrong type of bolt, but one smaller in diameter(small enough not to interfere with the ball joint stud), hence the nut.
EDIT: I mean, don't get me wrong dude, I've made a wheel almost fell off berkeleyup of my own before, but don't blame the part here.
In reply to wheelsmithy:
The bolt you are referring to is the same one I am calling a pinch bolt.
We are describing the same thing.
In reply to nboyles85737:
I'm trying to help here, but that ball joint did not fail.
It is still in entirely 1 piece, just as it came out of the box.
SVreX wrote: In reply to wheelsmithy: The bolt you are referring to is the same one I am calling a pinch bolt. We are describing the same thing.
Yeah, unclear typing on my part. There should have been a "to OP" in there. Apologies.
Fixed.
I saw this last night and thought immediately, installation problem. Part looks OK.
nboyles85737 wrote: http://www.focusfanatics.com/forum/showthread.php?t=537186 SERIOUSLY spend the money. it'll save you time, money and possibly your life. or someone elses.
Looks like focus fanatics (the link in the original thread) are saying the same thing we are.
nboyles85737: I'm glad you are OK, but I think you made an install mistake.
I hope we have ALL learned something (I have).
hey all, im not here frequently.
the part that failed was the retention bolt. it was too small compared to OEM. i think there is a pic in the thread, the cheapo one that didnt hold the joint in place is in the middle, mood which is slightly larger on the right and OEM on left being the largest.)
the bolt is still in one piece as if it was still holding onto it.
ill admit when i screw up on the car (forgotten strut bearings, broken bolts, broke a coolant re-director thing, forgotten to tighten lug nuts and rendering a wheel useless) but this wasnt me.
cheers.
parts store is reimbursing me. got 60 back already, waiting on the rest.
ill quote another member on FF
"Never use the aftermarket bolt that come in Focus ball joint kits!
I throw this pic up from time to time, the aftermarket bolt is on top and OEM on the bottom.
Sadly most people dont notice this, see how the stock bolt flares out wider on the non-threaded section, that's what keeps the ball joint in place. It butts up against the groove on the ball joint to lock it in, a normal bolt will not secure it no matter how much you tighten it."
and a pic of ball joint bolts i had: OEM(Bot), cheapo masterpro(mid), moog(top) http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/15/02/22/d2942719503bd540f6997dc21e2c86a4.jpg
So, if you pulled a caliper out of the box and found it was a different size than the one you need, would you install it?
How about a piston?
Anything??
I understand that the pinch bolt supplied was incorrect, and I am glad they are reimbursing you.
But it's not a factor of it being "cheap E36 M3", and there was no failure. The part did not break.
It's your responsibility to perform the work in a careful and safe manner. If the part was wrong, it should never have been installed.
But now you've added to the rhetoric. You have broadcast to the world that it's the fault of the part, and its cost.
Note that the Moog part was supplied with an incorrect bolt as well.
The responsible thing to do here is to say, "E36 M3, I berkeleyed up. Please learn from my mistake and pay close attention when assembling components like this".
You made a mistake. That's ok. But fear mongering and blame don't help fix the problem.
Hey guys--- good conversation, but not really suited for the "Shop Talk" forum. We're going to move this one over to the GRM forum.
Moved to the GRM forum. Carry on.
It's partly his mistake for not noticing that the bolt is wrong, but also partly the manufacturer's mistake for supplying the wrong bolt. They don't get a free pass for selling people a have-an-accident kit labeled as a ball joint kit and putting the responsibility on the customer to notice the difference.
And sadly it's not just cheap parts that have this problem, I've bought expensive performance parts that straight-up don't fit on things that they should (T3 trigger wheel, 4AGE redtop...it was supposed to fit!)
I had a problem with that on my focus too. Real problem turned out to be the knuckle was 'wallered-out' from the ball joint being loose for too long. But yes, I did go through numerous iterations of wrong and broken pinch bolts before I figured out it was the knuckle.
Never had a major failure though, just banging and bad noises that made me not really drive the car until fixed.
In reply to GameboyRMH:
I've bought expensive aluminum parts that appeared to have been welded together by a blind guy with a cattle brand. 
In reply to nboyles85737:
You might want to pay close attention to your differential in the coming days once you get it fixed. The stock ones in the mtx75 don't like much stress put on them.
What's the point of selling parts that won't work? Yeah he didn't notice the difference, but at that point all they are doing is wasting your time.
In reply to moparman76_69:
That's the risk you run with cheap parts.....don't get me started with VATOZONE tensioners for the serpentine belt of a focus zetec.....
Yeah, but the OP already said the Moog part had the same (wrong) bolt.
It's not a cheap part problem. It is probably an incorrect spec from the manufacturer (Ford) being released to the after market.
I am in no way giving a pass to the parts manufacturer.
However, think of it this way... If you hired a professional shop to do the work, they installed the same (wrong) part, and you had an accident because of it, I GUARANTEE you wouldn't want to hear any whining about the parts supplier. You would expect the mechanic to stand by his work. Period.
And if there were any lawsuits, you would be suing the MECHANIC, not the parts supplier.
It is the responsibility of the mechanic to not install incorrect parts, regardless of what dumbass mistake the parts manufacturer makes.
Svr rex, dude you're right. I didn't notice the bolt. However if I'm making parts for a car and seeing them I better be damn sure they fit properly.
Swank Force One wrote: Why on earth would you tighten a balljoint with a breaker bar? Actually, why would you tighten ANYTHING with a breaker bar?
Some cars have fasteners that are torqued to a specific number of degrees once they are tightened to a specific torque value. I've seen this mostly on head bolts/nuts and occasionally on strut mounting bolts.
Still, its pretty rare and only done when specified by the manufacturer.
Let me just add, the Moog bolt was bigger than the "el-cheapo" bolt, but still not as big as the factory bolt. And Moog is generally good stuff.
That ball joint nose only has the "dip" aside which the bolt passes to hold it to the spindle/knuckle whateveritshouldbecalled.
I too noted the use of proper torque specs, thinking that was the issue and that the bolt failed. Upon looking at it, clearly NOT the case - just somebody smoking dope at the mfg when they spec'd that bolt for the replacement joint (pun?).
I guess the upshot from some of these posts is to take a micrometer to everything you replace (not bad advice necessarily, but honestly, how many of us do that?).
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