AngryCorvair said:
Chris, with your E38s I'd say you (check all that apply):
If I were that lucky, I'd have won the lottery by now. No, I spend a bit extra up front for good ones then live with them cheaply after that. Most people I know try to get the CHEAPEST ones they can find, then spend thousands to get them up to snuff all the while complaining about them breaking. THOSE are the people you hear the most from, too. I did the same with Range Rovers before the E38s (And I had a dead nuts reliable '01 P38 that I towed a travel trailer with all over the east coast)
- didn't drive a ton of miles
daily drivers with 10-12k miles per year put on them.
- bought well-maintained cars
This is the key.
- didn't keep them long enough to replace common parts
3-5 years is long enough to belie the "gonna spend $1500-3000 per YEAR" claims. And I owned them from 100k miles to 180k miles. Yes, I'm prepared to do all the work myself, but the point is, I haven't HAD to. And I had no problem taking off and driving to Florida, upstate NY, Maine, and TN on a whim (all separate trips) with no issues. That 330ci has been on the Dragon twice...
z31maniac said:
Let's be real here, the ZHP isn't close to 7/8ths of an E46 M3. Alcantara, a 6spd and 10 more HP, don't come close to making it nearly the same car.
And better suspension than even the Sport package cars. There's decidedly more to it than a couple trim bits and some Alcantera. The whole point of the ZHP package was that the M3 didn't come in a 4 door version in the E46, so BMW made a fairly strong equivalent. Then optioned the coupes and convertibles with it, too. With good pads and tires, the ZHP will keep up with the M3 on the track in all but the top end on a longer straight. And cost less to repair when something DOES go wrong.
02Pilot said:
Chris_V said:
02Pilot said:
Then the question is how much speed you want. Rule of thumb: modern BMWs need anywhere between $1500-3000 spent on maintenance per year (assuming labor costs in that figure, less if you do the work yourself obviously).
How come I don't have to spend that much on my BMWs? I mean, not even CLOSE. My '01 740i Sport got $300 in repairs over a 3 year span with me and needed a few oil changes in there, too. My '05 330ci ZHP has needed a couple oil changes and $150 in repairs in the year and a half I've had it (one fuel pump right after we got it).
Check the prices at a dealer or specialist indy for Inspection I & II. If the suspension in your E46 hasn't been completely gone through it's past due unless you're way under average mileage - try pricing that out at a shop just for kicks. Tires? Brakes? Hell, oil changes are over $150 at the dealer IIRC.
Why would ANY of us enthusiasts do an oil change at the DEALER? BMWs are about the easiest cars I've EVER done an oil change on. (the OEM Mann oil filter is $6!) This is the kind of thing I hate: scare off potential enthusiast buyers by telling them it's inevitably GOING to cost THOUSANDS per YEAR to maintain, by using dealer gouging prices to do so. Yes, there are potential gotchas that can cost hundreds of dollars at a shot. But those can be minimized with a PPI and buying a well maintained example. And as was mentioned, buying OEM parts at places like oembimmerparts.com can save hundreds more. OMG, you might get a crack in an expansion tank that causes the low coolant light to come on. $50 and 15 minutes with a flat blade screwdriver and you're on your way.
Like I said, I buy well maintained examples and drive them. This car has been on the Dragon twice and that's an 8 hour+ drive just to GET there.
I did get new tires on it after this last trip, as the ones that were on it when we got it were wearing out in front from all the hard driving it gets, but that was $400 for the set (Sumitomo HTR AS P02 ultra high performance AS tires) and I have faith that they will last more than a year on there, so amortized over their life, I'd say no more than $100 a year in costs for that. I want to upgrade to Akebono Euro ceramic pads as I'm getting tired of the wheels getting black in a week... That's another $100 and a few minutes of time swapping them, but again, they should last years, too. I'm not going to be at $1500-3000 per year in this car, either. There are no mounting point tears for the suspension and the suspension is in great shape.
Chris_V said:
z31maniac said:
Let's be real here, the ZHP isn't close to 7/8ths of an E46 M3. Alcantara, a 6spd and 10 more HP, don't come close to making it nearly the same car.
And better suspension than even the Sport package cars. There's decidedly more to it than a couple trim bits and some Alcantera. The whole point of the ZHP package was that the M3 didn't come in a 4 door version in the E46, so BMW made a fairly strong equivalent. Then optioned the coupes and convertibles with it, too. With good pads and tires, the ZHP will keep up with the M3 on the track in all but the top end on a longer straight. And cost less to repair when something DOES go wrong.
I'm not really sure that 4 doors and 40% less power with an 8.67% stiffer suspension is the "equivalent" of an M3. Sure it might be a better DD, but I can't agree that it's nearly a match for the M3.
Do you also think a 318is a baby E30 M3?
Chris_V said:
02Pilot said:
Chris_V said:
02Pilot said:
Then the question is how much speed you want. Rule of thumb: modern BMWs need anywhere between $1500-3000 spent on maintenance per year (assuming labor costs in that figure, less if you do the work yourself obviously).
How come I don't have to spend that much on my BMWs? I mean, not even CLOSE. My '01 740i Sport got $300 in repairs over a 3 year span with me and needed a few oil changes in there, too. My '05 330ci ZHP has needed a couple oil changes and $150 in repairs in the year and a half I've had it (one fuel pump right after we got it).
Check the prices at a dealer or specialist indy for Inspection I & II. If the suspension in your E46 hasn't been completely gone through it's past due unless you're way under average mileage - try pricing that out at a shop just for kicks. Tires? Brakes? Hell, oil changes are over $150 at the dealer IIRC.
Why would ANY of us enthusiasts do an oil change at the DEALER? BMWs are about the easiest cars I've EVER done an oil change on. (the OEM Mann oil filter is $6!) This is the kind of thing I hate: scare off potential enthusiast buyers by telling them it's inevitably GOING to cost THOUSANDS per YEAR to maintain, by using dealer gouging prices to do so. Yes, there are potential gotchas that can cost hundreds of dollars at a shot. But those can be minimized with a PPI and buying a well maintained example. And as was mentioned, buying OEM parts at places like oembimmerparts.com can save hundreds more. OMG, you might get a crack in an expansion tank that causes the low coolant light to come on. $50 and 15 minutes with a flat blade screwdriver and you're on your way.
It's all well and good to assume the best, but I prefer to prepare based on worst-case possibilities. I've read plenty of discussions on this board about people taking cars in to a shop to have one thing or another done because the circumstances made it difficult or impossible to DIY. I've done it myself once or twice. It happens, and it's the sort of thing I think people should be aware of.
Oh, and that expansion tank? Sure, you might get a low coolant light and a quick, cheap fix. Or, on your M54B30, you might get an explosive failure, a rapid temperature spike, and an engine block with the threads ripped out of some of the head bolt holes. I'd rather be ready for the latter and know what could happen, especially knowing that it's not something I'm equipped or skilled enough to repair (meaning I'd be paying someone to do it), even while hoping it doesn't.
Some of it is just random. There are five bmws in my family we bought brand new. Three just keep tooling along on regular maintenance, one eats $2500 a year, and one has bitten me for like $10k in the last 12 months (thank God for USAA's extended warranty program).
I was able to drive my brother's 128i this past weekend. I liked it....... a lot.
It's not the fastest choice, but most likely the least troublesome newer BMW you'll find. No turbo, no SMG, no electronically adjustable suspension, steering, or other nonsense. Just a rev-happy BMW six, a nice chassis and a smooth gearbox delivering power to the rear wheels. It's newer than the E46 cars (he replaced his ZHP with the 128i) but less complex than their other offerings.
Like all good BMWs, it's a joy on the street, and competent on track with a few mods.
