Dual Purpose Race car...

I have been trying to sell my track toy for a while with no real luck. I am about to the point where I am just going to keep it and finish the cage so that it will be IT legal.

Anyways on to the question at hand. I have been following Irish44j's build thread on his e30 and I got to thinking, what would it take to take my semi ITA prepped B13 SE-R rally cross racing. I would like to still use the car for the occasional track day or autocross as well. I would also like to keep it ITA legal in case I can free up the time / money in the future to get back on track.

The car has a weld in Kirk racing cage, a corbeau seat, harness, and a window net. As far a mods it has a 2.5 exhaust, header, and an intake. The car currently has double adjustable Koni's and Ground control coilovers at all four corners, It has a ST sway bar in the rear and ground control camber plates up front.

Off the top of my head I am thinking of getting a seperate set of springs and struts and swapping them in for Rallycross. Obviously the spring rate / ride height requirements of rally and club racing are two completely different animals and would require different setups. Also I would prefer not to damage my double adjustable Koni's by subjecting them to the abuse I would expect to encounter while rallycrossing. I am thinking for budget reasone etc of using stock SE-R springs and a set of KYB AGX's. Is this a bad idea / are there better budget options?

I was also thinking of coming up with a under engine tray / armor arangement that I could easily remove or reinstall depending on the type of racing. Along the same train of thought some mudflaps would probably not hurt either.

I was going to buy some snow tires to mount on the stock 14 inch SE-R wheels. I think that is the best option for the money at this point.

Am I missing anything other then having to realign the car when I swap suspension pieces. Is this a bad idea / any negatives to a dual use car?

Sounds like you have everything covered. You would be in the M2 (modified 2 wheel drive) class for Rally-X. Mud flaps are a good idea, not sure if you need the under engine tray. Rally-X terrain is not anywhere nearly as rugged as some of the stage rally stuff.

Ahhhh, the jack of all trde car... I treat my XR the same way. Due to budget constraints, the only things I change are the tires and damper settings. Ideally, I'd like a set of custom coilovers just for ride height adjustment, but I'd loathe any setup that would require muh more than that. Of coarse, I'm not looking to be super competitive either, which I think would require a bunch of setup changes for each event.

The only problem with this idea is that it's a lot of work. It's actually very affordable if you're up to it.

I like those wheels, where did you find them?

Not going to help with your question but..I LOVE your se-r. My first project was an NX2000...the b13 sr20 twins are such awesome cars. I would love another one!

GameboyRMH wrote: The only problem with this idea is that it's a lot of work. It's actually very affordable if you're up to it.

Also, rally-x is HARD on cars, no two ways about it. I'd much rather have a track car, and then a $500 (or less) beater rally-x car.

The fastest guys typically tend to be in vehicles they don't care about at rally-x (typically).

HiTempguy wrote:

GameboyRMH wrote: The only problem with this idea is that it's a lot of work. It's actually very affordable if you're up to it.

Also, rally-x is HARD on cars, no two ways about it. I'd much rather have a track car, and then a $500 (or less) beater rally-x car. The fastest guys typically tend to be in vehicles they don't care about at rally-x (typically).

^^^ defintely right.

I had a $500 Outback that I used, it was plated and I drove it there. The rally club that I ran with had a dedicated rally-X course. It is pretty sandy and ruts up real bad. When you have 40 cars trying to get in 6 runs it is going to get rough. I had a skidplate and lots of clearance.

Most of the quick guys didn't even have street-legal vehicles. They stripped as much out of them as possible and either trailered them or hauled them with tow-bars. I tore off the entire exhaust system on my Outback one afternoon from the y-pipe back. Made the 3 hr drive home interesting!

I have since sold the car and picked up a 02 WRX. Since I am DDing the WRX, I am pretty sure that I will not be rally-X the WRX. If you do make sure that your spare suspension includes tophats for the struts. You can tear them up pretty good.

NGTD wrote:

HiTempguy wrote:

GameboyRMH wrote: The only problem with this idea is that it's a lot of work. It's actually very affordable if you're up to it.

Also, rally-x is HARD on cars, no two ways about it. I'd much rather have a track car, and then a $500 (or less) beater rally-x car. The fastest guys typically tend to be in vehicles they don't care about at rally-x (typically).

^^^ defintely right.

Definitely sort of right. As with everything, it depends.

I rallycrossed my B13 sentra in essentially stock form for several events (10 or so?). It had 250k miles on it and a shady history at best. The only structural failure it ever encountered was a cracked motor mount (the rubber, not the casting).

Rallycross is only as hard on your car as you make it. Yes, if you want to win at all costs you may have to push harder than your vehicle can handle.

Course conditions also vary wildly from region to region and site to site, even month to month at the same site. Some sites really are 'car breakers.' Others are smoother than the roads you drive on to get to them.

edit: just fyi, modifications to my sentra were as follows- snow tires on steelies, cat back exhaust, and I think it had a cone filter. I did not have a skid plate or any of the stock plastic undertrays.

cghstang wrote: I rallycrossed my B13 sentra in essentially stock form for several events (10 or so?). It had 250k miles on it and a shady history at best. The only structural failure it ever encountered was a cracked motor mount (the rubber, not the casting).

You mistake what I mean by hard on cars. The kind of vehicles you can drive (and be fast with) at a rally-x do not typically translate to being in the kind of shape to squeek out every last second on a road course. A rally-x car can be sloppy, have a poor alignment, and probably some questionably bent suspension components and still be fast. Any of those things would be a disaster on a road course. I've been there, done that, and have the trophies to prove it.

And another bit, DIRT. Dirt gets EVERYWHERE, especially if the conditions turn muddy.

My overall point is, it takes enough time to prep a car just to do one form of motorsport. Trying to prep a car to do multiple gets into the "this is taking waaaay too much time" realm. As always, I am assuming he wants to be COMPETITIVE in his applicable classes. If he just wants to have fun, well then go for it.

No disagreement from me on any of those points.

The argument as the whether rallycross is hard on a car or not is pointless. It depends on the venue. I did one in the infield of a horse track many years ago that was VERY smooth, smoother than our current SOLO venue, but I've also seen cars get ruint doing rallyX.

I have stock struts and springs on my B13 SE-R and my bump stops get more exercise than Hans und Frans, I'd imagine something with more suspension travel would work better. A2 Golfs and Jettas seem popular.

In reply to ShadowSix: Jamestown, OH? Like east of Xenia, Jamestown?

We're having a RallyCross with WOR SCCA this weekend at Roos Farm in Waynesville if you're interested.

Sorry for the threadjack.

cghstang wrote: In reply to ShadowSix: Jamestown, OH? Like east of Xenia, Jamestown? We're having a RallyCross with WOR SCCA this weekend at Roos Farm in Waynesville if you're interested. Sorry for the threadjack.

Yep, unfortunately I have nothing I wish to rallyX at the moment. I will be bringing my SE-R out to Kil-Kare this summer though.

How is the course out at Roos Farm btw? I haven't been out there in probably ten years!

In reply to ShadowSix:

It wasn't Roos Farm ten years ago . This is a 'new' site as of 2010. It is also one of those sites that is highly variable. Check out some videos for a good assessment: http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL9095ED0F8FD9D8F5

You must not be aware that we have a rental car: http://www.worscca.org/rallycross/rental.php

Huh, somebody had a farm... down in Lebanon maybe?

Is the rental still an old compact pickup truck? Like a Ranger or an S10? I forgot about that!

The current rental:

I'll probably be driving it on Saturday.

Those are all valid points. I would probably be better off in the long run keeping the SE-R as a road course / autocross car and using something else as a rally beater. I would have to buy a different suspension set up etc... and could instead use the money to buy something else.

Cleaning the car after a Rally cross was something that never crossed my mind. I imagine the car would get pretty ridiculous.

The wheels on the car are a set of DP Enduro's. I have had them since 1998. They have been used every 4 x100 car I have had since. I have a set of Rota 15x7's as well as a set of 15x7 RF-1's for the car as well.