Engine swap adapters?

Ok, I've done a few engine swaps in my day, but it was either a later engine into an earlier car so the engine and trans bolted together, or it was swapping and engine AND trans into something else. As of yet, I haven't bolted an engine from one make to the trans from another one. But, now I'm thinking about it. So, here's where I'm unclear.
How the heck do you go about making an adapter between the engine and bellhousing? I mean, if the bolt holes are close, how do you have two holes that overlap, how do you manage that?
If you do make an adapter (I'm picturing an aluminum ring basically, with both bolt patterns drilled) how do you manage the fact that the engine and trans are, what, .5" further apart than normal. I mean, wouldn't the input shaft be too far from the pilot bearing? Would the torque convertor or clutch be too far away?
Maybe these are dumb questions, but I'm in the dark here.

Usually you use a transmission with a separable bellhousing, then make a custom bellhousing.

The ring with two bolt patterns idea works fine, you just have to make up the distance of the other components somehow. Current Vortech/LSx engines come with at least two depth flywheel/torque converter mounts that might help in that swap.

You run a pilot spacer for a converter and probably can be used similarly for a manual input shaft.

As to similar bolt holes, I would slot the bellhousing to match the block bolt hole. If you were to break through, TIG the hole shut.

Find bellhousings (shorter) and input shafts (longer) of different lengths so you can add in an adapter and not have to deal with pilot bearing spacers.

Or just look up existing adapters from manufactures. (Novak Adapters, Acme Adapters, Advanced Adapters, Quicktime Bellhousings, Taylor Race Engineering)

Then there are the SAE adapters that are used in industrial applications. I believe there are common adapters for Ford, Chevy, Mopar, and other common industrial engines to the same SAE #. I think a similar thing happens inboard engines in boats...

funny you should say that.........

To make a LOOOONG story short... I wanted 6 speeds in my rwd Corolla....

The best option for the transmission I chose.... was to have an adapter/ transmission box section made...

because the transmission was designed with an incorporated bellhousing.

Before and after....

The final unit, adapter, and proper bell fitted ready for installation

Interesting Ross. So, you had an adapter made that goes between the bellhousing and the gearbox. Interesting.
I'm considering putting my Mercedes diesel into a Jeep Wrangler. So, I need an adapter between the engine and trans. There is a kit for the older Merc engine. It might just be easier to buy another engine....

easier =/= funner

The adapter ring between the engine and trans would work fine. Just make an adapter that's the same thickness for between the flywheel and the crankshaft, since you're probably going to have to use the flywheel that matches the trans anyway. Be sure to check if the trans input shaft needs a pilot, and if so be sure to machine a spot in the adapter for the pilot bushing/bearing.

Diesel wrangler = awesome

What about the starter?

driver109x wrote: What about the starter?

That all depends on the vehicle. If you're lucky, the starter mounts to the transmission and you won't have to worry about it. He didn't mention what year Wrangler, but most Chrysler products mount the starter to the transmission, so it shouldn't be a problem.

On 1UZFE Toyota V8's you can use the bellhousing for the automatic, cut it to the proper dimension then weld an aluminum plate to that for the transmission to bolt to. You could probably do other engines that way as well.

I wish we were closer...as I would be interested in getting into the engine adapter business...especially putting little diesels where they belong-but-were-not-put. Still, I could potentially be involved, somehow.

Clem

DrBoost wrote: Interesting Ross. So, you had an adapter made that goes between the bellhousing and the gearbox. Interesting.

I didn't get one made, they already exist for a project I've considered in the past:

This is a picture of the one I was thinking about. The ford bellhousing it uses is shorter than the jeep input shaft by the thickness of that plate in the picture.

http://www.novak-adapt.com/catalog/kit_pc2.htm

What transmission is the diesel currently attached to? What transmission do you have in the Wrangler?

I think the transmission is a 702.*** but I'm not 100% sure. It's the auto in a W124 benz. The trans it will be bolted to is the AX-15. And yes, the starter bolts to the bell housing on the Jeep. A little clearance work on the block and it fits.

Clem, shoot me a PM.....

I bought an adapter to mount a suby flat 4 up to a VW transaxle a few years back for a friend. it came from Kennedy Engineering, they had a good reputation but they are spendy. they had many other options available so they might have such a beast available, but like I said spendy.

Kennedy makes great stuff, and I didnt think they were overpriced at all.

icaneat50eggs wrote: Kennedy makes great stuff, and I didnt think they were overpriced at all.

I agree! They are famed for their VAG stuff but their roster is pretty impressive. Probably the best-known name in the biz these days.

I agree that they make great stuff, didn't mean to imply they were too expensive just you pay for quality. I think the one I bought ran around $500. I traded it for a running twin carb 1641 air cooled engine. I definately got my money's worth. I think he was in a position where his wife had said no more money will be spent on this project so we did a trade.

I don't know about you, but $500 seems excessive to me.

carguy123 wrote: I don't know about you, but $500 seems excessive to me.

I guess we're in the same financial boat then. The company that makes a kit for the older MB engine wants less than 400 for the eng. to trans. adapter plus the flywheel adapter.
I'd like to make the time to make an adapter, it would be an awesome swap.

I guess we're in the same financial boat then.

The leaky sinking one?

Was there a manual trans available for the Benz? Wranglers are short, but a divorced t-case might be cheapest/easiest option.

I had a batch of adapters made a few year ago to go from the Opel CIH bell-housing to a Chevy T5, much like the one Ross posted a pic of, and with a group buy of 10 and me doing all the design work each unit was still over $225. Kennedy sees like a screaming deal to me.

Now, for a single adapter the other option out there (that is more common than you might think) is to cut the front off the benz auto and weld it to the back of another bell-housing. This takes some careful set-up, but with a lot of measuring and a good jig it's often easier and certainly cheaper. One friend of mine has successfully done it at least 3 times.