Randy Pobst
Randy Pobst New Reader
1/23/25 12:54 p.m.

I’ve just returned from the SCCA Runoffs at Road America, and I am horrified. I saw three enormous incidents, all for the same exact reason, one witnessed with my own eye, another by my very capable coaching client Patrick Utt, and two of which sent drivers to the hospital and gorgeous, expensive GT2-class race cars to the scrap heap.

And …

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Floating Doc (Forum Supporter)
Floating Doc (Forum Supporter) GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
1/23/25 1:19 p.m.

Randy, I'm so grateful to have you writing for GRM. The track safety articles are particularly valuable. 

theruleslawyer
theruleslawyer HalfDork
1/23/25 1:22 p.m.

Yikes, and there is PLENTY of time to check your mirrors there. I kinda of wonder about the other side too- positioning yourself to be seen. What is the best way to make sure the other driver knows you're there?

Tom1200
Tom1200 PowerDork
1/23/25 3:01 p.m.

To the point of hold your line.

Such is the reality of vintage racing that I'm in a car that is anywhere from 7-25 seconds a lap slower than the lead cars in the run group and I do several things, 

1. Like Randy said I leave faster cars a lane while also being predictable. 

2. I calculate what lap the faster cars are going to come by. In doing so I know lead cars will be coming past on lap 4, 6 and 8 or whatever the math says. I'm running my own race and the leaders are a distraction; I want them by quickly.

3. Check my mirrors often. Typically I check just before the long brake zones and just after a corner or corner sequence. It's not uncommon to have a much faster car spin, pit or whatever and suddenly appear unexpectedly.

To the point of the oblivious driver

If you are driving a car and you can't process things outside of your car, novices notwithstanding, you shouldn't be in that car. 

I've know several drivers who could get a car up to speed but had zero capacity left for process traffic or other issues. Often we think it's red mist when the reality is they cannot drive at the limit AND deal with traffic or flags etc. I find this happens with both back markers and drivers just of top 10 etc.

Again if one can't do two things at once then pick a lower performance class.

I've been on both ends of the equation and I will say an erratic lapped car is sketchy as it gets. The door closes so fast in the overtaking car.

 

bearmtnmartin (Forum Supporter)
bearmtnmartin (Forum Supporter) GRM+ Memberand UberDork
1/23/25 3:22 p.m.

Situational awareness is instantly obvious in Circle Track. You get 20 or more cars sharing a quarter mile oval and the passing is continuous and unpredictable. Some drivers have multiple wrecks in a season and others go year after year unscathed. I would like to think I'm in the second group. Check my mirrors constantly, try and get an idea where the lead cars are if I'm going to be lapped and always look ahead to the next turn and not to the guy right in front of me

mhulbrock
mhulbrock New Reader
1/24/25 9:28 a.m.

Thanks for your post, Randy. I understand the leading car seemed to take the "wrong" line in your example, but is it not the responsibility of the trailer car to make the pass? Especially in a much faster car. The title photo clearly shows the faster car directly in the blind spot of the leading car. 

Yes, leaving a lane of room is polite, but that does not always happen. 

SKJSS (formerly Klayfish)
SKJSS (formerly Klayfish) UltimaDork
1/24/25 10:24 a.m.
mhulbrock said:

The title photo clearly shows the faster car directly in the blind spot of the leading car. 

Yes, leaving a lane of room is polite, but that does not always happen. 

You should never have a blind spot when on track.  Yes, there's a place in your mirrors that you literally may not be able to see beside you.  However, the whole point of having 360 awareness is that a good driver would have seen the fastest car approaching before it got to the literal blind spot in the mirror and been ready to be overtaken.

When I'm instructing, and endurance racing, that's what we call it...360 awareness.  Be aware of what's all around you at all times.  Yes, sometimes a faster car will disappear from view of my mirrors momentarily, but I already know they are there and give them room.

DjGreggieP
DjGreggieP Dork
1/24/25 10:34 a.m.
mhulbrock said:

Thanks for your post, Randy. I understand the leading car seemed to take the "wrong" line in your example, but is it not the responsibility of the trailer car to make the pass? Especially in a much faster car. The title photo clearly shows the faster car directly in the blind spot of the leading car. 

Yes, leaving a lane of room is polite, but that does not always happen. 

I believe the issue was that the slower driver had gone to the right leaving the left open, then came back across the left and into the faster car. In the screenshot yes the faster car is in the blind spot, but the faster car has also been behind / beside the slower car long enough that a mirror check would have spotted the faster car, which is the awareness Randy is talking about. 

Tom1200
Tom1200 PowerDork
1/24/25 10:47 a.m.

In reply to SKJSS (formerly Klayfish) :

I have one of those wink mirrors on my car along with the side mirrors; there are no blind spots. 

I like the wink mirror; it took some getting used to but it works great.

DrMikeCSI
DrMikeCSI Reader
1/24/25 12:32 p.m.

The slower car may have been aware of the faster following car, but ultimately made the wrong move. Like Randy said "be predictable" 

Peabody
Peabody MegaDork
1/24/25 12:46 p.m.

This is the reason I stopped racing bikes about ten years ago.

I think, in general, situational awareness is at an all time low, and I wouldn't expect it to be any different on track. I also think the fact that it happened three times between much slower and much faster cars, that there was a problem with situational awareness all around.

If I come up on someone much slower than me, I automatically assume they're not racing at my level, can't be trusted, and I don't attempt a pass like that. 

 

Tom1200
Tom1200 PowerDork
1/24/25 12:55 p.m.

In reply to Peabody :

It does take two to tango sometimes. While not the case in Randy's examples I have seen leaders dive bomb back markers.

I know of one former national champ who does this; I'm not on track with them often but when I am I give them a very wide berth.

Driven5
Driven5 PowerDork
1/24/25 5:45 p.m.

Randy Pobst said:

Or worse, they may have been told that dangerous, common driver-school half-truth: “Hold your line.”

 

And if I may expound on my rant about “Hold your line”: It means do not attempt to pull out of the way of faster traffic, but rather, be predictable. 

There’s also a critical corollary that I have never heard in driver schools: Hold your line does not mean pull INTO THE WAY of much faster cars! When you’ve looked back and you know a much quicker car is coming hard, just stay a little wide around the turn and leave them a lane of racing room. We are all in this together. 

Thank you! Honestly, this deserves it's own articles, discussions, and videos.

It's a phrase that gets carelessly bantered about as if it's the most intuitive and obvious thing in the world, but is effectively meaningless without clearer definition and context... And widespread concurrence.

Of the countless times I encountered such statements in preparation for my first W2W race, ZERO of them prepared me for what it actually means in practice. It was an eye opening first race.

Randy Pobst
Randy Pobst New Reader
1/27/25 11:34 p.m.

In reply to Floating Doc (Forum Supporter) :

Thx, it's a honor to work some long, long time friends with a favorite magazine and readers!  I've known Tim, Margie, (Tom and Katie since before their beginning) David and JG since the very beginning, and the magazine, Auto-X in the 80's, helped launch my humble career.  Like with the Toyota FX-16 Pro Solo project car in 1987 -yes, we won our class championship and got a little Firestone Firehawk road racing deal for me and Linda through the connection in another FX-16 and then MR2 Supercharged.

Randy Pobst
Randy Pobst New Reader
1/27/25 11:37 p.m.

In reply to theruleslawyer :

Three times.  Horrifying.  At The Runoffs, f'goodness sake.  Best way is to pick a side and be in their mirror, early as one can, and then watch them like a hawk.  But 136 mph. like the pic, there's no major swerving avoidance possible.

Randy Pobst
Randy Pobst New Reader
1/27/25 11:39 p.m.

In reply to DjGreggieP :

And I mean aggressively moved across, to a wholly unnecessary apex.  LEAVE A LANE, Slow Driver!

Randy Pobst
Randy Pobst New Reader
1/27/25 11:52 p.m.

In reply to DjGreggieP :

Thank you!  Every time a driver crosses the road, driver must know if it is clear.  Is there something there, or coming fast?

akylekoz
akylekoz UberDork
1/28/25 6:52 a.m.

I got slammed in just the same manner.  Passing a slower car at the end of a short straight, assumed he saw me or head me coming.  At the last moment he just came over into The Line.  He should have either been on the racing line to begin with or hold his line. 

It was my job to pass him not his to get out of the way.  I was 2/3 of the way past him when he came over, my side pipe would have been right in his ear.   

In Lemons racing multiple drivers share the same car, the range of skill level is painfully obvious.  My fault for assuming that I knew who was driving the other car.

Andy Hollis
Andy Hollis
1/28/25 8:12 a.m.

Great piece, Randy.  It's one of the reasons I decided early on not to do W2W on a regular basis.  Too much of the outcome depends on the capabilities/aspirations of other folks -- on many levels.

One of the things Time Trials has taught me is situational awareness on track.  I am constantly checking to see if the guy behind is catching me as my tires come in, or working to avoid impeding others on a cool down lap;  Often looking several corners behind to plan an easy pass for the follower (see also F1).

I refer to  those cues Randy discusses as the "body language" of the other car.  You see it on the street -- "that guy is gearing up to cut right in front of me in my lane", and also on the track -- "he doesn't see me and is about to turn on me"

The challenge in fixing this is competency.  If a driver is spending 100% of their mental capacity operating the vehicle at the limit, nothing is left over for situational awareness.  That driver is so focused that they won't see other traffic, nor even flag stations (which is why flaggers have to give signals so sharply -- to get your attention).  It's the same stuff we teach n00bs in DE, but some experienced drivers fall back into those old bad habits in the heat of competition. Red Mist Syndrome.

mcloud
mcloud New Reader
2/1/25 2:57 p.m.

The critical area is approaching turn-in, say after a long straight.  Vintage book says if car inside you has his nose ahead of yours before tun-in point, the corner is 'his'.  A near split-second decision you must make;  commit to the racing line entering the turn, or leave the lane open, and avoid the 'dive bomb of doom'.  You must judge the speed of the approaching  car, and make your move soon enough to inform that driver.  If in doubt, swing wide and give him the race line.  

vwcorvette (Forum Supporter)
vwcorvette (Forum Supporter) GRM+ Memberand PowerDork
2/1/25 4:06 p.m.
Andy Hollis said:

Great piece, Randy.  It's one of the reasons I decided early on not to do W2W on a regular basis.  Too much of the outcome depends on the capabilities/aspirations of other folks -- on many levels.

One of the things Time Trials has taught me is situational awareness on track.  I am constantly checking to see if the guy behind is catching me as my tires come in, or working to avoid impeding others on a cool down lap;  Often looking several corners behind to plan an easy pass for the follower (see also F1).

I refer to  those cues Randy discusses as the "body language" of the other car.  You see it on the street -- "that guy is gearing up to cut right in front of me in my lane", and also on the track -- "he doesn't see me and is about to turn on me"

The challenge in fixing this is competency.  If a driver is spending 100% of their mental capacity operating the vehicle at the limit, nothing is left over for situational awareness.  That driver is so focused that they won't see other traffic, nor even flag stations (which is why flaggers have to give signals so sharply -- to get your attention).  It's the same stuff we teach n00bs in DE, but some experienced drivers fall back into those old bad habits in the heat of competition. Red Mist Syndrome.

Andy, have you taken my Driver Education class? LOL I teach kids to "read" the cars around them. Look for tendencies. How do you know a car is changing lanes before the driver signals (if they even do that)? Where is the car positioned in its lane? Where is the other driver looking? Where are their hands? You can learn a lot and save yourself a lot of heartache. 

racerfink
racerfink PowerDork
2/1/25 4:51 p.m.

I've found there are two cars to REALLY watch out for on track.  

Those that are 30 seconds off the pace (or more), and using absolutely every single inch of the racetrack.  I found these drivers are maxed out with the task of driving, and have no awareness of other cars around them.

The other is the driver who drives exactly down the middle of the track, no matter if on a straight or curve.  Usually they are very aware of another car near them, but do WAY too much to give room to that other car, sometimes getting in the way of a really fast car passing both of them.

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