Ex Renault-Nissan CEO Carlos Ghosn jumps bail, is smuggled to Lebanon on a private jet

While I definitely do not condone injustice. I do have to say that their justice system does prompt good behavior from the majority of its citizens. Most people in America do not have a spotless record with the police. I know that because I've had several family members that were police officers, and they always comment how everybody is dirty at some point in their life. It's one of the many reasons I've gotten out of so many Speeding tickets. My uncle always said he never wrote tickets to somebody that had a spotless record because he knew they were a good person

In reply to _ :

Along that line of thought, one of the articles I was reading about the broader Japanese criminal justice system mentioned that there are few/no pushes for reform because the average citizen operates on the presumption that they will never break any laws or be caught up in the system, so they do not perceive it as relevant to their lives and assume anyone on trial is guilty and deserves it anyway.

I get the thought but that's definitely a two-way street. Imagine being wrongly accused! Might as well just commit suicide in that scenario.

In reply to RossD :

I was thinking Summo Wrestler...but yeah, same gist.

Pete

So does all this mean that Nissan will get to build new better cars that we all want?  I would love to see a remake of the 260Z.  Ya retro is getting long in the tooth but a modern interpretation of a 260z would be cool.  And no the 350/360Z is not even close.  IT is a good car just that it is its own car not really a nod to the original z cars.

I assume there will be an Interpol warrant out for him  if he travels to Europe , USA etc.

I just cannot seeing him only staying in the Middle East....

dculberson said:

AngryCorvair said:

Or maybe they do enough up-front work to avoid charging innocents.

You really have that much faith in people?

Nope.  Was making funny.

BoxheadTim said:

Private jet probably couldn't make it to Brazil without a refuel stop in countries that may have extradited Ghosn?

I would assume they fly westbound ...

1988RedT2 said:

Hmmm.  Wealthy corporate CEO eludes justice.  Nothing new here.

Normally I would be upset about this but he had the decency to give us an entertaining story, and for that Mr Ghosn is the best of any recent white collar criminal.  
 

Like others have said I've read a few stories on the Japanese court system and none of them were particularly flattering.  If I had the means $14 mil in bail is probably a small price to pay to escape.  As for landing in Lebanon I know a few Lebanese people and it seems like an ok place to stay, especially if you're a folk hero with a few bucks. 

L5wolvesf said:

Aside from extradition possibilities, is Lebanon really the place to go to now a daze?

If I was facing the Japanese justice system, Lebanon seems like a much better place to be.

Comments have already been made regarding near-100% conviction rate as well as the tendency for the prosecution to not go forth with a case unless they have airtight evidence. 

OTOH, I have also heard stories about judges who believed the defendant was innocent but returned a guilty verdict because they didn't want to contradict the other judges.  Or people who won an appeal but were kept in prison because, well, you're already there, why release you just because they changed their mind?

dean1484 said:

So does all this mean that Nissan will get to build new better cars that we all want?  I would love to see a remake of the 260Z.  Ya retro is getting long in the tooth but a modern interpretation of a 260z would be cool.  And no the 350/360Z is not even close.  IT is a good car just that it is its own car not really a nod to the original z cars.

 

 

 

No.  Just no. 

The 260 had bumper shocks, and while better than most 1974 offerings, were still not as pretty as the original 1970-72 cars (73s had extended brackets, not as bad as 74s though).

260s (and 73 240s) had crappy Hitachi carbs, not the nifty SUs.

Sorry, I'm a Z-Car geek.  

But I agree in principle!

In reply to dean1484 :

I heard they're just going to keep making the 370Z for another decade or so until it's also considered a classic

Imagine living in a world where you were SO PETRIFIED of committing even a minor civil infraction that you never even bent the law?

Never lit a firecracker? Drove 36 in a 35 or jay-walked? Or spit your gum out?

Ill take American justice thanks.

^Agreed.

In reply to ebonyandivory :

I don't really have the time to research this... but I have witnessed people crossing a street not in a crosswalk, driving above the speed limit, running a yellow.  Japanese aren't petrified about braking the law in the way you're talking about.

I've only done a limited amount of reading about the Japanese incarceration, and I won't defend that.  But, I will point out that their incarceration rate is ~50/100,000, compared to the US' 700/100,000.

I would appreciate it if y'all would back off on the hyperbole.

In reply to sleepyhead the buffalo :

But, but, but.. foreigners!

I still feel like there was some level of put up job; like one of Nissans execs who had an axe to grind with Ghosn had a friend in high places. Regardless jumping bail is still jumping bail. 

Sadly there are no heroes in this saga.

ebonyandivory said:

Ill take American justice thanks.

I get the comparison . . . to a point. Then . . . 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wrongful_execution 

We will see how much the Japanese courts want him back , 

will Japan stop aid and trade to Lebanon ? Doubtful !

Will he be at the Detroit Auto show  in 2020  ? Doubtful ,  

I think he will make a deal , pay a large fine and stay out of Japan forever

Tom1200 said:

I still feel like there was some level of put up job; like one of Nissans execs who had an axe to grind with Ghosn had a friend in high places.

Oh, yeah, for sure. Almost every senior Nissan management official has been implicated in this, uh, "accounting scandal" at this point but only Ghosn and Greg Kelly have been formally charged, and Kelly was released almost immediately.

The long and short of the conspiracy claims seem to revolve around the idea of Nissan not wanting to lose its autonomy and be absorbed whole into Renault after some very forward actions from the French automaker. I can't seem to find it right now but at one point claims were made that Nissan is basically burning the house down out of spite right now and isn't too worried about its tanking stock value or freefalling sales numbers.

So we can't send this guy after him?

In reply to Sine_Qua_Non :

Well he killed himself so..... probably not. 

californiamilleghia said:

We will see how much the Japanese courts want him back , 

will Japan stop aid and trade to Lebanon ? Doubtful !

Will he be at the Detroit Auto show  in 2020  ? Doubtful ,  

I think he will make a deal , pay a large fine and stay out of Japan forever

I don't think the Japanese courts want him back. Nor do Renault, Nissan, or Mitsubishi apparently. They're already talking about turning the alliance into an incubator for new JV companies and restructuring day to day operations so that it's basically the complete opposite of how Ghosn ran things.

Whatever they do, they need to get their acts together quick. All three companies have car lineups that make them look like they stopped doing R&D in 2015. I wouldn't want to buy a single one of their new cars. And this is coming from someone who loves Nissans.

Carbon said:

In reply to Sine_Qua_Non :

Well he killed himself so..... probably not. 

He's apparently doing quite well, for a dead man...

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/dog-the-bounty-hunter-dead/

boulder_dweeb said:

With the right ghosn writer....it's gonna be a hell of a book!

Fixed that for ya. 

ebonyandivory said:

Imagine living in a world where you were SO PETRIFIED of committing even a minor civil infraction that you never even bent the law?

Never lit a firecracker? Drove 36 in a 35 or jay-walked? Or spit your gum out?

Ill take American justice thanks.

The other side of that is that unless there is an airtight case against you, you can get away with a lot.  The same cultural attitude of saving face, also means that prosecutors really, really don't want to risk being wrong.

Hell,while they have traffic cameras everywhere, if they catch you doing something but the plate number doesn't match the vehicle description, they throw the evidence out.  So people who fark around will just swap license plates with their buddies.  Good luck trying that in the US.  Don't forget that this is the country that inspired drifting as a passtime because of highly irresponsible scofflaws.

OTOH, this is also why the yakuza are tolerated so much... they tend to take care of the little problems that the official legal system can't/won't.