Streetwiseguy said:Kvyatt will get a bunch of doglips for his first lap Maclaren stuff, but I'm not sure I'd put that all on him.
Yea, watch Carlos take a look at the inside of Lando- if he had not done that, I doubt Danny would have hit anyone. NOT to say that Sainz was responsible- but that Kvyatt is not that much at blame.
Did Sainz hit Lando before both got torpedoed?
Ferrari continues their questionable strategy calls while Mercedes nails theirs.
In reply to T.J. :
It looked to me that Sainz turned a little into Kvyat who then hit Norris.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Xw2MqyJwKc
So it's not that clear, but you can see that it was just people in places.
Qualifying question - why did Mercedes send Lewis out for a second run in Q2? Practice? It burned a set of tires and he wasn’t going to get bumped, so what was the point? I’m missing some big strategic thinking or maybe the whole team got the red mist and wanted to win Q2.
In reply to Keith Tanner :
All the top drivers did that- and I expected them to do a run in lap and do nothing else. What was really confusing about Hamilton was that he bruned a set of medium tires when the rest did softs. Seeing the race, they all saw that the soft tires were never going to be used in the race.... (excepting Gasley one point for fastest lap.
In reply to alfadriver :
I agree that this one mostly seems like a typical lap 1 incident with too many cars in the same place at the same time. All three of them ended up suffering from it, so at least it wasn't one of those deals where somebody caused it and got off without damage.
In reply to Keith Tanner :
Before Lewis' second run in Q2 how far behind was he? Maybe he needed another lap to get things figured out for Q3? Did he do both Q2 runs on the medium tires?
I think most of the fast guys in Q2 used a set of softs as a practice run for Q3. If some freak of the tracks nature had the lower classed cars knocking them out, they could finish the lap and get to Q3, but practice was the primary reason, I'm sure.
Lewis found speed on every lap. Why he went on mediums is hard to say, unless he knew there was more speed than he had found before, and wanted to be able to finish his lap in case- He was fourth or so after the first run in Q2, so maybe they felt there was a real risk of getting bumped, and he wanted to start the race on mediums.
Other than Le Clerc getting screwed over by his own team, that was kind of a snoozer.
Vettel's dumb mustache went straight to his head and slowed him down.
LeClerc is is not as good as he think he is, but he's only 21 and will only get faster. At least he keeps a cool head for a young gun.
Ferrari need to make up their minds. That was embarrassing to watch.
How many drivers would be on the podium if they had Hamilton's car ?
Mercedes has the money to do it right , and try again and again to get a little better....
But is it the car , the driver or the team ?
In reply to californiamilleghia :
All three.
As for Lewis, how many guys can find almost a second over the course of the weekend to catch their team mate?
I needed a good nap today. Thanks F1!
alfadriver said:All the top drivers did that- and I expected them to do a run in lap and do nothing else.
The top drivers had set their Q2 times on the medium tires (yellow, IIRC), because that's what they wanted to start the race on. On their second run they went out on the soft tires (red?), in case the track got faster. When it became apparent that it hadn't, they all slowed down and deliberately set a slower time than they had on the mediums, to avoid having to start on the softs.
Sitting in the pits on a medium tire time has cost people in the past -- this is just insurance.
Streetwiseguy said:In reply to californiamilleghia :
All three.
As for Lewis, how many guys can find almost a second over the course of the weekend to catch their team mate?
Yes I think Lewis has proven his season long race strategy works. Cathing M Schumacher is a likely result. MB build a good car the last few seasons just like redbull before and Ferrari before RB.
It is a normal analysis to try and divide the performance to the parts that makes the whole. Otherwise how does the team figure out where to apply resources.
But I do think Ferrari and MB are equal and team plus car plus driver have to get it right every race weekend in order to win.
Hamilton may fail miserably in a Ferrari as the team or car doesn't fit him. Same could be said for Vettel or Max in a MB.
Don't cast aside Hamilton's win, as compared to his career of teammates he is always very close or simply ahead.
The race was interesting. I was surprised that MB was solidly in front. Ferrari just didn't have the setup or something to get ahead. Redbull are still alone in the middle of nowhere.
Great that Ricciardo finished a race. I hope that he can at least mix it up with the Redbull guys soon.
Sainz just can't get a break!
Stroll is my biggest question mark this season. I assumed he would be closer to Perez. But I guess the transition to racing point is taking a while.
Gasly now 6th in the championship. But still way off his teammate's times.
Kimi solid performances.
codrus said:alfadriver said:All the top drivers did that- and I expected them to do a run in lap and do nothing else.
The top drivers had set their Q2 times on the medium tires (yellow, IIRC), because that's what they wanted to start the race on. On their second run they went out on the soft tires (red?), in case the track got faster. When it became apparent that it hadn't, they all slowed down and deliberately set a slower time than they had on the mediums, to avoid having to start on the softs.
Sitting in the pits on a medium tire time has cost people in the past -- this is just insurance.
I don't see it that way- there was no way that enough cars would have beaten that time. They went out for a different reason than covering the field. Just odd.
Which does bring up a different point- one hopes that the 2021 measures will help lessen the gap between the top 3 teams and everyone else- as they should be challenged to get to Q3. It's kind of a sad statement that the top 3 teams can all pick the desired starting tire because they are fast enough as opposed to compromising on the tire just to make it to Q3.
In reply to Advan046 :
Given that Stroll is a North American, it's natural to want to see him do well. But I see nothing in his driving that says he should be there over someone else. I'm sure many hoped that when he got out of Williams, he would be set free- but that has turned into the view of daddy buying your seat.
Unless FI/RP's core design takes some getting used to. But even on that- Gasley and Ricciardo has picked up on their new cars better.
maschinenbau said:Vettel's dumb mustache went straight to his head and slowed him down.
LeClerc is is not as good as he think he is, but he's only 21 and will only get faster. At least he keeps a cool head for a young gun.
Ferrari need to make up their minds. That was embarrassing to watch.
I think Leclerc is better than Ferrari treated him yesterday. I would be pretty pissed after how he was treated by the team management- make a great start, keep a strong pace- then be told to let the "team leader" pass- then keep right up with him. And for that, the team put him into a horrible strategy, which lost him 4th for sure. Given the team- they should have at least had Leclerc cover RB to protect Vettel, but they did the total opposite. Terrible race management.
In reply to alfadriver :
In the post race interview it was talked over how what undid Leclerc was having the better start. If he was behind and pressuring Vettel after lap one then to try and keep pressuring MB they would have asked Vettel to let LeClerc by. The team was just trying to see if Vettel could close down on Bottas. The classy move would have been to then put LeClerc on the better strategy to pay him back for giving up the spot. But doing the double down on Vettel by giving him the better pit strategy was the slap in the face.
Many teams have done the swap and the teamates swap back near the end. Ferrari just don't think that way.
In reply to alfadriver :
Stroll has shown promise. I compare him to Button. Button seemed like he should have been a dominating super fast guy but only showed that in spurts. I think of Stroll that way. A guy to get solid points but maybe never break win total awards. Just thought he would be a little closer to Perez. BTW I rate Perez highly, he just never got in on a top team.
Advan046 said:In reply to alfadriver :
In the post race interview it was talked over how what undid Leclerc was having the better start. If he was behind and pressuring Vettel after lap one then to try and keep pressuring MB they would have asked Vettel to let LeClerc by. The team was just trying to see if Vettel could close down on Bottas. The classy move would have been to then put LeClerc on the better strategy to pay him back for giving up the spot. But doing the double down on Vettel by giving him the better pit strategy was the slap in the face.
Many teams have done the swap and the teamates swap back near the end. Ferrari just don't think that way.
If they kept LeClerc on the same tire strategy as Vettel, he would have done a lot better. They changed him to a horrible strategy that made no sense at all. It's one thing to have Vettel pass him, it's just that much more to mess up the tire/pit strategy so badly that he was a distant 5th. Very dumb.
If the teams had realized the softs would be useless in the race, there was little risk in sending Hamilton out there to even up the numbers and burn up a set of softs. I can see that.
About "is it Hamilton or just the car?", it's pretty clearly both. Sure, he's got a top level car. But when Hamilton was a rookie, he was teammates with two time world champion THE BEST DRIVER EVER FERNANDOOO ALONSOOOOOOOO! and kicked his ass all over the track. So he's not just an average driver.
I agree that Leclerc is better than Ferrari let him be yesterday. He may be only 21 but he's a pretty mature 21. He's going to be fun to watch for sure.
In reply to Advan046 :
I don't think Stroll will be up to speed until next year, because this is really Perez's car. Perez is a master of making tires last and making the 1 stopper work. I think part of Stroll's problem is experience on managing tires, some of the Gp2/F2 guys seem to have a advantage in learning tire management.
Antonio Giovinazzi looks like a rolling chicane, I don't doubt Kimi's talent, I just wonder if that spin last Gio has fractured his confidence.
In reply to alfadriver :
When I was watching the race, I thought Ferrari's strategy with LeClerc was to keep him out past when his tires were shot as long as he could keep Bottas bottled up behind him in the hopes that Vettel could close the gap and maybe challenge for P2 instead of being stuck in P3. They threw away P3 and P4 in an effort to get P2 and P5, but ended up with P3 and P5, the worst of both worlds. I didn't watch any of the post-race stuff, so not sure what Ferrari has said to explain their move. If it would've worked, it may have been seen as a great strategy, but since it didn't, it is seen as a really dumb strategy. Not sure what the odds were of making it work.
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