Funny looking new math...

ultraclyde wrote:

fidelity101 wrote:

RossD wrote: That's a brand new Ford Taurus SHO price.

or a fully loaded 2014 mazda6 and several grand left to go on a few vacations

QFT. Our Mazda6 has every option they offer and was out the door under 31 before trade in. wow.

Yes a definite "wow".... this makes me feel even better about my wife's new VW CC purchase, where the MSRP was $37,195 and our OTD price including taxes and tags was $32,500. I can't imagine paying over 40k for a Kia or Hyundai. We did not drive the Cadenza but did drive the Sonata Limited but it did not compare well against the Mazda 6 and CC that we drove. The CC had that solid german feel that was missing in the Sonata.Admittedly the Sonata and the CC don't generally compete, but with the end of 2013 price reductions from VW, the CC was down in a similar price range (upper end of the Sonata and lower range of the Azera).

FYI, I would never pay a dealer "market adjustment" cost, we walked away from several dealerships until we found one that would give us all the factory rebates and not charge us the $825 destination charge

Datsun1500 wrote: Most of the time it's the dealers that cater to the bad credit buyers. This way they can show a down payment on the credit application

Bingo. And they'll do it as long as they can. With Chrysler still in the no-credit / bad-credit game, and GM headed back there again, it may be harder for them to keep doing this and keep a straight face, though.

Bobzilla wrote: I like the Cadenza, but I am disappointed it's not RWD. I'd rather have the Azera to be honest (same car).

Well, that and it's very unfortunately named. Making it sound like a boring piece of furniture doesn't do a lot for market appeal.

This dealer owns the local 'Yota dealer, too. I need rally driving practice anyway.

Javelin wrote: And KIA isn't the problem here, it's Dick Hannah. Every berkeleying one of his dealerships are like this.

Does that make them - wait for it - a bag of Dicks ?

BTW, I love the quick depreciation on the Hy/Kia cars. It makes buying a one or 2 year old car very affordable. Still get E36 M3-tons of warranty, a great car for half the price. My Forte SX was a $22k car new. I got it for $10k out the door with trade and it had a whopping 18,011 miles on it when I drove it home.

ultraclyde wrote:

fidelity101 wrote:

RossD wrote: That's a brand new Ford Taurus SHO price.

or a fully loaded 2014 mazda6 and several grand left to go on a few vacations

QFT. Our Mazda6 has every option they offer and was out the door under 31 before trade in. wow.

The mazda 6 is a smaller car than both this and the new sho....... My parents just snagged a new nearly loaded asto.....err, I mean ford fusion 2 weeks ago. I think it was 32k out the door prior to the 15k they gave them for a '12 focus sel.

Javelin wrote: And KIA isn't the problem here, it's Dick Hannah. Every berkeleying one of his dealerships are like this.

Maybe, but that is the same kind of E36 M3 that Bill Baisey KIA in Frederick, MD tried to pull on us. That's why the wife is driving a new Subaru Legacy!

Javelin wrote: I figured you guys would nail it. Yeah, this slimehole dealer tacked on $2K transferring the MSRP from the real Monroney sticker to their own BS sticker (which was on *every singe ca*, yes they were asking for a $2K "Market Adjustment" on SOul's, Rio's, etc). And KIA isn't the problem here, it's Dick Hannah. Every berkeleying one of his dealerships are like this.

It's a negotiating ploy. They do that to make you think you have to work your ass off just to get back to MSRP. It's there to keep the civilians from thinking they'll get any type of discount.

I don't read stickers except to get the option list and the holdback. Then I determine the invoice price (minus holdback) and negotiate from cost.

It's a negotiating ploy. They do that to make you think you have to work your ass off just to get back to MSRP. It's there to keep the civilians from thinking they'll get any type of discount.

I don't read stickers except to get the option list and the holdback. Then I determine the invoice price (minus holdback) and negotiate from cost.

And research the factory rebates (direct) as well. I found out that VW was giving the dealers a $5,000 rebate to move the 2013 CC models until the end of the year. Some dealers would acknowledge this, others would tell me it was less than that (liars). You have to know what they paid for the car,minus any incentives they are getting on the back end before you negotiate what you are willing to pay.

Jerry From LA wrote: I don't read stickers except to get the option list and the holdback. Then I determine the invoice price (minus holdback) and negotiate from cost.

Where do you find that information on the sticker?

Kia would have to work really hard to get me into another one of their vehicles. SWMBO had a first year Rio when we got together and damn thing was a SERIOUS POS. Randomly lost power going down the road, as in running 70mph and it would suddenly just fall on it's face. You had to shut it off and then fight it to start again to get it back to normal. Sometimes it would do it again right away and other times it wouldn't do it again. Dealer couldn't get it to replicate it, so no help there. 61k miles and the AC went out, dealership refused to cover it under warranty. Saw the paperwork from when SWMBO bought the car, they litterally took her car, and gave her nothing for it. I didn't point it out to her, but I wasn't shocked.

I parked the car near the end of our driveway, took the tag off it, called the finance company and told them where they could come get the car. Bought her a 500$ B2200, added a stereo, quickie overhauled the AC system, and a pair of 300ZX buckets. She drove it for 2 years. 3 years later I sent the Rio to the scrap yard because they didn't even want to come get it. I know they've gotten better, but it's very hard to look past that.

They don't call them "Dick" for no reason.

Spinout007 wrote:

Jerry From LA wrote: I don't read stickers except to get the option list and the holdback. Then I determine the invoice price (minus holdback) and negotiate from cost.

Where do you find that information on the sticker?

You won't . There are a variety of guides and websites where that info can be found. the guides show the markup for the base car, then the markup for the options which have a higher profit margin. Consumer reports will even tell you if the car is being spiffed or under a manufacturer rebate program or any other incentives. However, you'll pay a fee (maybe 20 bucks) for the privilege. I taught a friend how to do this. He got thousands off the sticker, then got half of the dealer incentive too.

Also, most people negotiate from a down-and-monthly-payment standpoint. The dealer plays along and gets thousands more over sticker because the consumer cared only about how much they budgeted for the payments. They don't realize they could get more car for the same money.

Gotcha, thanks for the heads up, I'll keep that in mind if ever go car shopping again.