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tripp
tripp Reader
2/28/17 7:01 a.m.

I am just embarking on the adventure of adding a 1200 sqft detached building for a garage with a bathroom and loft at the house. Not sure if people are interested in some pics and lessons learned as I go through this. Also not sure if this should be in the build thread or here.

Any advice along the way is appreciated. Just put the deposit down on the steel building over the weekend. Waiting to hear from the concrete guy for the foundation.

Long term goal is fully wired shop bathroom and changing area for our pool in the last 10 feet and have a loft over the back 35 feet leaving the from 25 full height to give room for a lift or taller vehicle/trailer.

appliance_racer
appliance_racer New Reader
2/28/17 7:04 a.m.

I'm definitely interested in following your progress

dculberson
dculberson PowerDork
2/28/17 7:06 a.m.

Sweet. I want to follow along too. I have an existing 1600sf out building that I'm ever so gradually renovating and need inspiration.

RossD
RossD UltimaDork
2/28/17 7:14 a.m.

Please share.

Tyler H
Tyler H GRM+ Memberand UltraDork
2/28/17 7:19 a.m.

Did you buy plans to start? I often think about building the garage of my dreams with a nice loft apartment, convincing my wife to live in it for a couple of years, then putting a house out front.

Calling it a garage kills the deal somehow. Maybe it needs to be a 'guesthouse' with a 4-car garage?

Don49
Don49 HalfDork
2/28/17 7:28 a.m.

Tyler,

Try Calling it a "carriage house". Sounds so much classier!

tripp
tripp Reader
2/28/17 8:02 a.m.

I just did a prefab steel building. Including a 16x12 roll up door and a few Windows the building was about $15k installed. Figures that was about as cheap as I could do and time is too much of a premium for me to be able to tackle building it (20 month old son and another due in June).

I will get some pictures posted as the process goes along.

STM317
STM317 Dork
2/28/17 8:46 a.m.

This is relevant to my current interests.

Greg Voth
Greg Voth Dork
2/28/17 9:01 a.m.

Very interested in your experience especially since you are relatively local.

Ian F
Ian F MegaDork
2/28/17 10:13 a.m.
Tyler H wrote: Did you buy plans to start? I often think about building the garage of my dreams with a nice loft apartment, convincing my wife to live in it for a couple of years, then putting a house out front. Calling it a garage kills the deal somehow. Maybe it needs to be a 'guesthouse' with a 4-car garage?

It's not a bad plan - I know many of us have had similar dreams, including myself. The elephant in the room is the local ordinances and building rules of where said lot happens to be. Sometimes it's better/easier to buy a lot with an existing house in need or renovating, build your shop/apartment to live in while renovating the house.

Most important is to check the rules before buying the property. I have a couple of friends who learned that lesson the hard way. They bought a house on a big lot thinking it would have plenty of space to build a shop. The twp put up so many barriers to the project they ended up selling the house and buying one in a less restrictive twp a few miles away.

tripp wrote: I just did a prefab steel building. Including a 16x12 roll up door and a few Windows the building was about $15k installed. Figures that was about as cheap as I could do and time is too much of a premium for me to be able to tackle building it (20 month old son and another due in June). I will get some pictures posted as the process goes along.

Did that price include the foundation and pad?

Tyler H
Tyler H GRM+ Memberand UltraDork
2/28/17 10:46 a.m.
Ian F wrote: Most important is to check the rules before buying the property. I have a couple of friends who learned that lesson the hard way. They bought a house on a big lot thinking it would have plenty of space to build a shop. The twp put up so many barriers to the project they ended up selling the house and buying one in a less restrictive twp a few miles away.

Sage advice. Luckily I live in the South where the weather, taxes, and building codes are fair. I can build whatever kind of dump I want. Downside is that my neighbors can too.

The0retical
The0retical Dork
2/28/17 11:05 a.m.

In reply to Ian F:

I got so much crap from my wife when I insisted that we were moving to Monroe county and one of the 4 townships right by the Northampton county line.

Being able to build a 1000 sqft structure without a permit is a pretty nice feature and they're fairly lax about issuing permits if you seem to have your act together. Northampton seems to want to project the perfect little community image on a county-wide scale.

tripp
tripp Reader
2/28/17 11:29 a.m.

In reply to Ian F:

Another $5400 was estimated for the foundation and pad. Meeting the concrete guy this week to get a firm number as I probably want to increase pad thickness just to be overkill and also planning to expand the driveway and pool deck to pull it all together.

plance1
plance1 SuperDork
2/28/17 9:24 p.m.

Skimmed over ur post. Been in construction for 20 years. Get building shop drawings to the concrete guy so he coordinate and not screw up. Pad thickness is great but subgrade prep and stone thickness and compaction is more important. Tell concrete guy that you want whatever thickness you pay for, you will core drill when done to check. They tend to cheat. Find out how long he will wait to sawcut, find out his reasons. Find out if he will replace concrete that doesnt crack in the joints , where its supposed to. Dont share bids with other bidders. Find out if he is including mesh, you want wire mesh, not mesh mixed with the concrete. Find out strength hes using. See if hes including sealer. If so, is this ok? Or are you going to want some kind of special finish later on that might not be compatible with the sealer.

tripp
tripp Reader
3/1/17 3:13 a.m.

In reply to plance1:

Thanks for the tips. Meeting with him tonight so good to have questions

pushrod36
pushrod36 Reader
3/2/17 6:46 a.m.

outlets everywhere! Both at ~4' and ~12" from the ground. Then throw a few on the ceiling for drop-down cords.

also, make sure to discuss whether you would like to floor to drain towards the door or be flat. They will assume you want a slope towards the door.

tripp
tripp Reader
3/2/17 8:18 p.m.

Any thoughts on chain pots in the floor for anchoring points if I need to straighten some body work or drag a dead car off a trailer?

Waiting on the quote from the concrete guy. He said he uses 3000psi fiber reinforced cement/concrete (I know there are differences but I use the terms interchanably due to my lack of knowledge).

Trying to determine how to tie a bathroom into the septic probably going to need a grinder and pump to make the run around the house work for the septic. Any suggestions?

tripp
tripp Reader
3/2/17 8:21 p.m.

Here are the chain pots I was considering: http://www.autobodytoolmart.com/champ-floor-anchor-pot-1600-p-11538.aspx

icaneat50eggs
icaneat50eggs Dork
3/2/17 10:19 p.m.

first I'd bump up to 4000 psi, it's a slight increase in material cost for that much added strength.

I'd avoid using fiber reinforced for a shop. if the guy doesn't finish it well it can be pretty rough.

tripp
tripp Reader
3/3/17 4:39 a.m.

Thanks for the in out I will check what options I have

fidelity101
fidelity101 SuperDork
3/3/17 8:32 a.m.

We need a garage build section by itself these days, I approve!

(note I have no authority)

jfryjfry
jfryjfry Reader
3/3/17 11:47 a.m.

Don't forget drainage in the shop in case you want to wash something. But if it's going to slope I would suggest having a flat spot for the lift so they don't have to shim it much if at all to get it level.

frenchyd
frenchyd Reader
3/6/17 2:38 a.m.

In reply to tripp:

For those who might want something other than the cheapest build possible and don't mind some simple D.I.Y. work you might look into I.C.F.s. (Insulated Concrete forms) I've built with them and can tell you they make working with concrete almost too simple..

They are big foam blocks that go together like giant Leggo's. I made sure the ones I bought were protected against insects and rodents. I forget what they use but if something were to get past the sealant there is something in the foam that kills them before they can infest the foam. Mine came with a nice video and complete instructions.. Plus the required bracing/scaffolding needed. The place I got them from worked from my sketch of what I wanted to achieve and sent me the exact number of blocks I needed in exactly the configuration they had to be. I also bought the rebar from them and the tie wrap tool that made wire tying fun rather than complicated..

For window and door openings I went to a local sawmill and bought white oak and wrapped them in plastic for rot protection.. Since it was rough and green, at the mill I only paid 40 cents per bd. ft.

I started work on my project and in one day had the first two levels done with some corners up to full height. However I went to a race that weekend and so badly wrenched my back I was bedridden for over three weeks.. Since winter was coming on I put out a call for some help. I got my 14 year old daughter and 30 year old sister-in-law. Needless to say absolutely no construction experience at all.

They watched the video and in one weekend finished up everything.. On Monday the Building inspector checked everything and signed off without a single issue.. My wife got two young men at the local grocery store (Bag Boys) to aide in the pour when the pump guy came on Wednesday morning (again no experience) but I did get the guy who sold me the forms to show up and supervise the pour.

Everyone one arrived Wednesday morning ate the rolls and coffee and the pour went off without a single hitch..by 10:30 they had nearly finished up and everyone was gone by 11:00

The medication finally started to work and I saw the finished project for the first time on Thursday. The Bag boys and my daughter took down the bracing and scaffolding that weekend and loaded my truck and trailer to return to the place I bought the forms from (along with the rebar bender, and vibrator pump)

Sheetrocking the inside walls was almost too simple.. There are nylon strips to screw into every 4 inches but before I did I put wire in conduit to bury it. I used an old dull router bit to tunnel chase's in for the conduit and boxes and except for filling the shop vac with foam beads and the mess of getting them out of my hair that went off pretty quickly too. Since much of the outside was buried when I back filled I coated all of the blocks with a sealant.

The front I put brick tabs on for the stone I used to veneer the foams but I could have stucco'ed it or used that Dryviet stuff that looks like stucco if I'd want to save some money.. You could also put wood or aluminum/plastic siding up if you prefer.

Like I said it's not the cheapest way to build but it sure was simple.. It has a great fire rating since concrete can't burn. (use fire rated sheetrock for the best rating) massively stronger than typical stick (2X4, 2X6 ) building, In case you suffer from Tornado's or earthquakes. And a great R value.. Because of the thermal mass involved it's actually higher than it's rated.

tripp
tripp Reader
3/6/17 4:18 a.m.

How expensive is the foam block building? Curious as I was trying to find the best value in a structure and steel prefab won out because of ease availability and having seen so many others go that route.

tripp
tripp Reader
5/26/17 4:46 a.m.

I had the pad poured about a month ago, and the building went up this week.

The lessons learned so far: -I should have done a bigger footer where I plan to put the lift in. I did a 1x1 footer across the building with 2x1 footers running down the side. I should have gone 2x2 for the cross building footer just to be safer for the lift -steel buildings go up very fast. They started Monday and are done. I should have gotten in writing that the doors we bought would be installed but managed to work through that confusion.

I will try to get some pictures posted soon.

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