Going to look at an E46 330i

I'm going to look at a BMW E46 330i (ci?) on Friday.   It'd be my first bimmer.   The goal will be DD, occasional HDPE, and just "something for me to play with".

What should I know/look at?  I'm hearing subframe bushings, VANOS seals, and crank vent?  Also cooling system leaks/problems, but a local BMW enthusiast/mechanic said he hasn't seen the leaks and problems I keep reading about online.    Price is $3300ish
 

Also:  Without the 330i (ci?) badges on the back to tell me.  What can I look at mechanically to verify the model/displacement? 

https://kw.opensooq.com/en/search/76866664/bmw-330-2003-manual
 

Thanks guys.

Just get the VIN and plug it into one of the countless online BMW VIN decoders and you'll get every piece of info on the build sheet.

Aside from the stuff you've mentioned and the universally-applicable (i.e., look out for dodgy bodywork), here's the thing with the M54: if the cooling system grenades, and there's a reasonable chance that it will if left alone (usually the expansion tank, sometimes the plastic bleed screws or a radiator tank, or the water pump or thermostat...none of it is really trustworthy), there's a significant possibility the head will warp, in the process ripping the threads for several head bolts out of the block. If you ever see the temperature gauge over the halfway mark (it's buffered, so past half is already bad news) shut it down RIGHT BERKELEYING NOW, lest your lovely inline six become an expensive boat anchor. Because of this, cooling system replacement (I recommend 100k mile intervals on the I6) is more a preventative measure than fixing something that's failed.

If that's the actual car you're looking at, it's a base 330i, not even a sport pack car. Seats give it away (no adjustable thigh support).

Window regulators, fuel pump, aforementioned cooling system bits, all are areas to look for. Check the rear subframe and suspension mounts for tears as it's an early car with the wrong offset wheels on it (look like 5 series wheels).

The rear subframe itself is know to be extremley weak.

The later ones nearing the end of that generation should've gotten it reinforced from the factory, but I'm not 100% sure on that. Either way, I'd get a PPI done to be on the safe side, even if it's a very cheap car.

Nice, nice car.  Wish I had one.

The usual problems with subframe mounting points tearing out of the chassis sheetmetal.  I have seen my friend Adam's do this; it came from the factory without subframe reinforcement plates, and the previous owner didn't track the car at all.  Same for the chassis mounting points for the rear trailing arms.  It's really best to get the reinforcements welded in both spots, if there will be any HPDE at all.

Adam's also got fuel starvation on the track with a half-tank of gas.  But it takes a certain level of track experience before a man can pull enough G to cause the problem.  Bimmerworld sells a fix kit but it's not cheap. 

VANOS fails eventually but the rebuild parts are available for a competent DIYer.  Like any aluminum-head I-6, it has a long head and it won't recover from a major cooling system failure.

Nice car though.  Worth the trouble.

Posting here because I have been searching for a 330i sedan for a while.

The subframe reinforcement - it looks like there are a few different kits out there, what should I be looking for?  How much do I have to move out of the way to weld in the kit?

I have done the job myself once.

Exhaust has to come off.  The rear subframe needs to be dropped entirely.  It's held on to the chassis with 4 long bolts.  The rear trailing arms also need to be unbolted from the chassis (three bolts on each trailing arm).  Also, the two parking brake cables need to be disconnected.  The brake calipers can be unbolted from the hub carriers and the brake lines left connected.  There are a couple of electrical connections on each side too (wheel speed sensors, a brake pad sensor).  Sometimes there's a fuel evap canister or the like to be pulled too.

This subframe unit is the entire rear suspension and differential.  It's pretty substantial, so it's a bee to get off and a bear to get back on.

Next question is, do you drop the fuel tank?  It's plastic, and two of the six plates you will be welding on are within inches of the tanks.  Most welders I know have a feel for their zone of heat distribution, based on their particular torch technique.  I was comfortable welding (and grinding the chassis metal clean) near the tanks.

The reinforcement kits for the subframe are just stamped metal plates shaped kind of like a eyelid.  They're available as an OEM part from BMW, or knock-offs.  Just shop based on price or supplier loyalty.  The install job is just a matter of welding those patches onto the chassis, to double-up the metal thickness.  (If you find bad cracks, then it's a different story.  Some even require interior work.)

The trailing arm plates are also just stamped out of sheet metal in a sort of a horse-shoe shape.  I'm not 100% sure but I don't think there's anything special about any of them.  If there is somebody out there claiming theirs are thicker metal than the others, that might not be an advantage, because they still need to be welded to the chassis -- for some welders, thick metal on thin metal = burn-through on the thin stuff.  For other welders, no big deal.  The trailing arm plates are a little more of a challenge to weld than the subframe plates, because they need to be welded right around the threaded bolt-holes without screwing them up.  But only a little bit more challenging.

I think my friend Adam paid $400 to get a shop install his.  Having done the job myself, I might well go there and pay the $400 next time.  I could earn back the $400 in the time I spent even if it was just mowing yards at $25 a pop.  DEFINITELY would pay the $400 if I wasn't already pulling the subframe anyway to replace all the bushings.

I recently bought a E46 to do exactly what you're planning, HPDE's and general "play". I ended up with a total cream puff sedan for $6k and I have been absolutely loving the smooth (but sadly underpowered) engine, nicely balanced chassis, and classic German styling. My first track day with her is next week. Can't wait.

Definitely give this one a good once-over under the hood (hoses, gaskets, oil leaks), around the suspension (bushings, LCA ball joints, shocks, toe links) and under the car (rust, crash damage). I found all the sub $4k cars in my area needed significant maintenance and repair before I could even think about track and performance related mods. Doing some quick budget math led me to get a nicer car to begin with and jump straight into mod fun.

One curious thing is the lack of badging. I see three scenarios- 1) It's been painted and they didn't put the badges back on, 2) the PO was going for the sleeper look 3) It's actually a 325 and he wants everyone to think it's a 330. If it has been painted look for auxiliary damage front and rear from a crash. Definitely run the VIN and see if you can get any vehicle history and decode the build sheet. Also, one other way to confirms it's a 330 is the brakes. It should have the larger 325mm front rotors. 

Rock the berkeley on for being in Kuwait and everything. My first thought when reading your post was "How the berkeley is he going to go to a track day in Kuwait!?" Then, I realized that there is actually a track under construction and composed myself.

As far as the car goes, I once rented a 330i ZHP to drive the California coast. It was an excellent trip, but the car left me cold. It was good, even very good (especially for daily purposes). But nothing about it wowed me. 

One of my main issues with the car stems from the lack of an LSD, in my opinion. The car seems to have too much tire in the back to be balanced from a handling perspective, but it still isn't enough to put down the limited power the car makes. Maybe an LSD would cure everything, but that could cost as much as the entire car you're looking at.

Obviously you're geographically limited, but I think I would be more interested in the Mini Cooper S that is also for sale if it does have an LSD. https://kw.opensooq.com/en/search/76931578/2003-mini-for-sale

I think some suggest safety wiring the oil pump nut if it's going to see extended, high RPM use.

Having done the rear subframe reinforcement myself, there is no way it could be done for $400.  Everything from the tailshaft of the transmission back has to come off.

Beware of people to glue them in, or just stick the plates in and screw it back together....that's not the way it works.

Redish Motorsports makes big plates that prevent you from having to peel back the trunk floor and weld like the Turner plates.

All the bushings and all the cooling system need to be done.  

That looks like a great car for the price.  Do your homework and budget for deferred maintenance as necessary.  

Thanks for the replies guys.  Sorry it took me a bit to get back on here.  I kind of started looking at aftermarket parts and fell down a (expensive) black hole...  Yikes.  I'm back now, though, and hopefully i've learned my lesson.

02Pilot:  Countless indeed!  Thanks for that, I didn't even think of a vin decoder.  and holy friggin carp on the cooling kits for this darn car.  For the E46 330i, ECS has kits that start at $500 and go all the way up to $1500...  I was expecting to replace things, I cant say I was expecting those prices on a 15-year-old car.  Ouch.

Chris_V:  Ah yes, I've heard about the notorious regulators but I hear the window motors are pretty cheap and easy to replace.   I'll have to check out the wheels.  Looking online it's hard for me to tell, but I dont see any obvious size benefit as it looks like the e46, e49 and e60's were all shoed in similar sizes   (BMW numbers confuse me...) depending on trim, etc.  

Fuzz:  For the subframe i found reinforcement kits were just under $300.  I'll look around for someone who might know this chassis for an inspection (but I'm not getting my hopes up.  Kind of a rare beast here).  

JBasham:  hahahaha, yeah.  I think it'll be a LONG time before I run into fuel issues because of aggressive driving on my part.  I'm a terrible driver on my best days.  I haven't looked at VANOS rebuild kits yet, but thanks for the heads up!  I'm a bit worried now about the subframe.  I was thinking I could get the subframe off and do the welding and bushings done all at once in my driveway over a weekend or three.  What are your thoughts about driving the vehicle to a non-BMW place that just happens to have a welder and letting them go at it?  (specialist options are kind of limited here).

Rick:  You mentioned yours was a bit underpowered.  Is yours a 330 or something different?  This was kind of a concern of mine after I saw what this beast weighed :P. Still sounds like a fun car though.

White fly:  Thanks man!  yeah, that came as a complete shock!  I think I might have seen something about the track being built a year ago maybe,  but things here tend to fall off the radar and not get done so I kind of forgot about it.  I've been jonesing for something for an automotive outlet when this popped back up in my feed.  Much frantic car shopping followed, but I did not see the cooper.  Thanks for that!

Tyler H:  "Budget for deferred maintenance as necessary".  Do you know me or what???  This has gone from "oh man, look headers are pretty cheap, I wonder if I could swing a set of coilovers..." to "oh...  that money needs to go to the cooling system, and the rear subframe"  :P

Good times, and thanks again guys.  I'll let you know what happens on friday







 

The cooling system kits may cost ~$500 or so (upgrading to the Stewart water pump adds a bunch, but it's only worth it if you plan to keep the car for life IMO), but it's once every 100k miles, so it's not that bad in the grand scheme of things. Replacing the suspension (shocks/struts, control arms (integral ball joints), and various bushings) will cost considerably more, and needs doing around the same time. A BMW tech I know is fond of saying that a modern BMW needs $1000-$3000 of maintenance per year (varies by model, yours would be at the bottom of the range), and for every year that's not done, you end up owing the car that money, so calculate deferred maintenance costs in you decision.

I drove an M54-powered 525i for ten years, a heavier car than the 330i with less power, and never really found the lack of power to be much of an issue. The engine is happy to run up to and at the redline all day long; if you're willing to wring it out, the car will feel quite lively.

I wouldn't invest in any power upgrades.  Put a shorter final drive with LSD in it and it will pep right up.

These are great cars, but they need a little more maintenance than a Toyota.  Not all that much though.  Cooling system, bushings, and regular oil changes covers most of it.  Everything that can go wrong is well documented and DIY-able.

Its not easy to visually inspect the trunk floor for subframe tear-out, but you should be able to verify that it isn't already bad.

Refresh the underbits and flog it?  I think I can handle that

Hungary Bill said:

Refresh the underbits and flog it?  I think I can handle that

Yep. 

That's basically going to be my plan of action for the 135. Address known weak spots (oil cooler, charge pipe, bubble rear subframe bushings), wider wheels and tires, nice suspension setup.

I drove a 2003 325i every day for 11 years and I wouldn't call it "underpowered".  It's not a burnout machine, but it doesn't leave you beating on the dashboard and screaming COME ON YOU PIECE OF CRAP either.

My car weighed a touch over 3200 lbs and made 184 hp / 175 tq.

This car weighs a whisper under 3200 lbs and makes 225 hp / 214 tq.

It's not going to be a slug.

Huh. Okay I'll go back and ask Adam again what he paid. Maybe I'm remembering $400 wrong.

As for getting it done at a non-specialist shop, that seems doable. It isn't rocket science by a long shot. As for trying to do it yourself one weekend in a parking lot? Maybe. You will need a good floor jack to get the subframe back on, and I think it would be hard to jiggle into position if you're on blacktop instead of smooth concrete. Then there's the welder -- seems like nasty work with one of those 110v flux core MIGs. I know a couple guys that could pull it off, but I'm probably not one of them.

Hungary Bill said:

Rick:  You mentioned yours was a bit underpowered.  Is yours a 330 or something different?  This was kind of a concern of mine after I saw what this beast weighed :P. Still sounds like a fun car though.








 

Sorry fellas I didn't mean to imply its a slow car by any means. 225hp in ~3200lb does move along nicely. I came from a 400hp, 3700lb car so it just isn't as impressive when you give it the beans. I've been happy with the power, but I do plan on a header/exhaust upgrade and a diff ratio swap to wake it up a bit more. In stock form it is plenty fast enough to beat your average minivan off the line...

JBasham said:

Huh. Okay I'll go back and ask Adam again what he paid. Maybe I'm remembering $400 wrong.

As for getting it done at a non-specialist shop, that seems doable. It isn't rocket science by a long shot. As for trying to do it yourself one weekend in a parking lot? Maybe. You will need a good floor jack to get the subframe back on, and I think it would be hard to jiggle into position if you're on blacktop instead of smooth concrete. Then there's the welder -- seems like nasty work with one of those 110v flux core MIGs. I know a couple guys that could pull it off, but I'm probably not one of them.

DIY might be off the table.  I'm having trouble finding someone who will sell me argon.  I have an Eastwood 220v DC TIG, but without the gas I'm up a paddle without a creek (that's going to up the budget a bit)

Initially I was hoping I could use my motorcycle jack for the up and down of the subframe, but the driveway is all pavers.  Not smooth.

Cheers

So Adam got back to me about the pricing for his reinforcement plates install.  Total was $1000.  He delivered the car, the plates, and a complete set of rear suspension bushings to the shop.  They agreed to install all of the above.

My bad on the $400.  Pre-parenthood, I had a brain AND a memory.

JBasham said:

So Adam got back to me about the pricing for his reinforcement plates install.  Total was $1000.  He delivered the car, the plates, and a complete set of rear suspension bushings to the shop.  They agreed to install all of the above.

My bad on the $400.  Pre-parenthood, I had a brain AND a memory.

Even at $1k, that's very reasonable. I did the job post-parenthood.  I don't have a brain and rely on pictures rather than memory.  :)

The car was a winner.  Solid underneath and in the engine bay.  A young guy owns it and it shows in some areas.  The interior is showing it's age for sure.  It was a smokers car (bleh).

I couldnt get my cheap-o code reader to work, the vin decoder i had cued up didnt cooperate either BUT i saw 330i on one of the factory placards so that was good enough for me.  Even if it isnt a 3-liter, the car was PLENTY quick.  I was pleasantly surprised.

It's been resprayed and i see some waviness down the passenger side but no secondary damage to anything important.

wheels are m3 wheels.  225's up front 245's in the back.  I might see about changing wheels and tires so they're not staggered.

It's also a 5 speed (i was expecting a six).  No clunks or creaks over bumps or when i accelerate.

I figure this beast is just molested enough i can hoon without guilt but not no bad as i couldnt drive it daily in relative comfort.

I take possession monday.   The bimmerworld shopping cart is already loaded with goodies.  This should be fun.

Thanks again everyone!

So I hope you stole it price wise. 

Try https://www.bmwvin.com for decoding. Generic code readers barely scratch the surface on what's available from the various modules; ECS Tuning sells a reader preloaded with BMW-specific software, including the airbag system.