I was trolling craigslist the other day and came across a '05 subaru legacy 2.5 gt wagon with a five speed. The owner is willing to swap for a nice e36. It so happens I have a nice e36. So what's the catch? The legacy has a bad transmission.
I feel like I can do a tranny swap. I've done one on a bug -- that's got a boxer 4... It's the same right 
What do you think, grm?
I've seen a LOT of '05-'09 Legacy GTs with engine issues. Many of them were well below the 100,000 mile mark.
The_Jed wrote: I've seen a LOT of '05-'09 Legacy GTs with engine issues. Many of them were well below the 100,000 mile mark.
Were they NA or turbo? I've heard the NA have head gasket troubles. What should I look for? It's got 160k miles (for comparison my e36 has 188k)
Make sure you get a transmission with the same gear ratio as the rear differential, or swap the rear differential at the same time. I think the regular Forester manuals share the same front/rear diff ratios as the Legacy. Foresters with the winter package also had rear LSDs, I forget exactly what the trim lines were- I think XS in 2003-2004 and just X with package options after that.
The 2005 Legacy GTs are turbo. Some got bad tunes, others didn't. Get a compression test done on it, and probably a leakdown before any trade. You know what you've got, make sure you know what you're getting into.
Brett_Murphy wrote: Make sure you get a transmission with the same gear ratio as the rear differential, or swap the rear differential at the same time. I think the regular Forester manuals share the same front/rear diff ratios as the Legacy. Foresters with the winter package also had rear LSDs, I forget exactly what the trim lines were- I think XS in 2003-2004 and just X with package options after that. The 2005 Legacy GTs are turbo. Some got bad tunes, others didn't. Get a compression test done on it, and probably a leakdown before any trade. You know what you've got, make sure you know what you're getting into.
Is there some reference on the Internet with the gear ratios for different models? Wikipedia says that all the turbo models had the same ratios.
Here's the cl listing : http://sfbay.craigslist.org/eby/cto/5619270043.html
It's tuned via a cobb access port, so maybe that avoids the bad tune issue?
The_Jed wrote: I've seen a LOT of '05-'09 Legacy GTs with engine issues. Many of them were well below the 100,000 mile mark.
I briefly owned a 2005 GT wagon that ate three turbos in 125,000 miles. The third turbo took out the engine. I couldn't find a replacement engine for it for less than $3500.
This was a one owner, mommy box with no modifications. All work was done by the Subaru dealership, most under warranty.
Never again.
Keep the E36.
As cool as the Legacy GT Wagons are, they have lots of problems. And this one has a bad transmission to boot. I just watched a friend dump a stupid amount of time and money making his 2005 LGT wagon a usable car again after the engine puked right around 100k. It was also an unmodified car. He got smart and ditched it soon after that. It's not a matter of if the engine will go, it's a matter of when, no matter what tune it's running.
The problem with the LGTs is the banjo bolt that controls oil feed to the turbo has an inline wire-screen filter. If the PO was negligent with oil changes or PCV maintenance, any sludge will clog up the filter and starve the turbo.
Later WRXes (09+) also have a similar banjo bolt filter design but I've heard of fewer failures on them, probably because they fixed something but might also be because Subaru started mandating synthetic oil and extremely short OCIs.
That's most of where you see the reliability problems coming from - most shops will keep farting another turbo in over and over while happily ignoring a car with huge blow-by and an oil cooler filled with turbo swarf.
If you get the car, take the banjo bolt out, remove the filter and clean everything out. Most people delete the filter altogether at this point. It's all pretty well documented on the enthusiast forums, and then stick to a regimen of a good quality filter and synthetic oil.
Transmission pull and replacement isn't too hard. I would probably get a new Group N transmission mount, Extra-S gear oil and some transmission crossmember bushings ready for when you do it. You might as well go nuts and get one of the TiC "Clunk Killer" kits and do the differential and outrigger bushings while you've got all that room under the car to mess with it. Could probably also do one of the shift bushing setups at this point, like the old TiC "Holy Shift" kits, since it'll be ever so slightly easier.
You do need to match the final drive - 02-07 (and probably more) WRX transmissions are not the same final drive as the 05 LGT (4.11 IIRC). It's a good way to chew up a rear diff at minimum. There are some rebuild gear sets (PPG, Andrewtech) if you're feeling particularly brave, but I'd probably just find another trans from a wrecked car and hop it in.
If you really want it to be bulletproof you could also look at replacing the oil pickup tube with something like a Killer B; on the EJ255 it's reputed to be fragile and although I have no anecdotal evidence myself, I have had friends kill theirs from the problem. A decent crank baffle might not be a bad idea while you're in there, either.
Note that the LGT Spec B transmission is different from the LGT transmission - it has another gear (DCCDless 04+ STI transmission) and a different rear diff with freak one-off rear axles.
Transmission codes are written on a sticker on the bellhousing of the transmission, which is often visible with the hood open if you squint. You can use one of the many Subaru transmission code tables to look up trannies that will be compatible, such as this one.
Canada got the LGT wagon for an extra year so you could always look at parts up here.
The LGT wagons are a very special car, enjoy it.
Figuring out the actual final drive ratios of the Subarus is a bit of a search. It'll take a couple of hours, WRX transmissions seem to be the oddballs as to what you can swap them into. It really only matters if you start trying to mix and match transmissions and differentials, though.
You guys are not making it easy with all the pro/con posts. I need clear answers! Tell me what to do, internet! LOL
It's one of those devil-you-know-devil-you-don't things. I know my e36. She's a good car. Fun to drive... but it's not a wagon. With a turbo, manual trans, and AWD.
But, replacing the trans will cost $500, probably another $500 for clutch (because hey, I'm under the car anyway), and it seems like there are some other odds and ends that could do with being swapped around.
Then there's the unknown cost of maintenance for a LGT. Tires will cost more. Gas will cost more.
But it's a wagon... with a turbo, manual transmission, and AWD ...
Here is where to find transmission info:
NGTD wrote: Here is where to find transmission info: http://www.northursalia.com/techdocs/techdocs.html
I get "forbidden" for that link... which only makes me want to go there more!
You do know manual Legacy GT wagons are a one year option. They are unicorns and get a premium.
Have you driven a legacy? I only ask because I wasn't all that comfortable in my friend's car on our road trips. I also didn't really love the way it drove in general.
The E36es I've piloted I did like. I know which I would rather road trip in and drive daily.
Oh, and previously mentioned friend sold his soon-to-grenade legacy gt early this year with ~110,000 miles on it. (he was having it dyno tuned and the tuner started hearing bearing noises and cut the session short).
clutchsmoke wrote: Have you driven a legacy? I only ask because I wasn't all that comfortable in my friend's car on our road trips. I also didn't really love the way it drove in general. The E36es I've piloted I did like. I know which I would rather road trip in and drive daily. Oh, and previously mentioned friend sold his soon-to-grenade legacy gt early this year with ~110,000 miles on it. (he was having it dyno tuned and the tuner started hearing bearing noises and cut the session short).
my mom had a 3L outback wagon. I liked that car and borrowed it for a road trip to Illinois one time. I thought it was pretty good.
Maybe I'm just getting the 2 year itch, Y'know?
I got the e36 because it's classed well, but ask me how many times I've autocrossed in it... None. Maybe I should sell it and buy a civic 
I'm a Subaru nut and I would not buy a used '05-'09 Legacy GT. I recently pulled the trigger on a '98 OBS with 220,000 miles without a moment's hesitation. Of course it was a 2.2, 5-speed.
The wife drives an '05 Outback 3.0R and we LOVE that engine. Changing the spark plugs, though, is a motherberkeleyer.
If I were in your shoes I would stick with the devil I know.
Thanks internet. I talked to my wife about it this morning, which is usually a death sentence for this sort of ill-advised, harebrained scheme, and it was in this case, too. She said something about "not if but when it breaks". I hate it when she's right.... and she always is :D
You're certifiably crazy to think about swapping a nice E36 BMW for a Subaru that has a bad transmission.
Don't you think you could sell your E36 for far more money than a non operational Subaru is worth? Why do you think the guy wants to swap? It isn't because he thinks he's giving you the better end of the deal...
docwyte wrote: You're certifiably crazy
probably
to think about swapping a nice E36 BMW for a Subaru that has a bad transmission. Don't you think you could sell your E36 for far more money than a non operational Subaru is worth? Why do you think the guy wants to swap? It isn't because he thinks he's giving you the better end of the deal...
a 95 325is is worth $3k-ish
a 2005 subaru legacy gt wagon with manual is worth??? between 6-9 thousand. So for the price of the new trans I'd have a car worth easily 2x my current car's value.
But there's that whole "price of a new transmission", price of towing, price of unknown other work, price of "when (not if) it breaks". More expensive gas, more expensive tires, and so on, and it's clear it's a dumb idea. But I've had other dumb ideas before, and some of them even work out. 
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