Good news: Touchscreens in cars are going away

Thank goodness. I hope Auto Makers are Reading this. I will not buy a New Car with a Touch Screen. I do not want a Car with a Screen at all. Give me Buttons or Switches that do not move. So, I can Learn the location of these buttons and know where these buttons are.

Also, I hope the Over bearing Computer that is very distracting goes away too. When I want the Head Lights to be Off I want them to be Off, for example. I do not want a computer to tell me to turn the lights on and then not turn the Head lights even after I selected and pushed the button to Turn Off the Head Lights.

DirtyBird222 said:

ddavidv said:

I always enjoyed it when the one in my Fusion fleet car would just go all 'blue screen' and render the radio completely useless. Fun times.

Don't you worry. My 2022 Raptor does the same thing. Ford hasn't missed a beat. 

I forget if it is all of Ohio or only certain local PDs, but there are now laws in effect that it is illegal to operate a touchscreen while driving.  It is intended for phones, but the way it is written, touchscreens in cars also count.  And the way cell phone laws are enforced, picking up your phone to look at the time while at a red light counts as "operating a cell phone while driving", so...

Man I love when politicians write vague laws that can totally be misconstrued by LEOs to write tickets purely for profiteering. 

There is a reason some departments won't hire a LEO recruit with an IQ over 115.    Thinking and judgment not allowed.  Just do what the commander says...

th9791 said:

Thank goodness. I hope Auto Makers are Reading this. I will not buy a New Car with a Touch Screen. I do not want a Car with a Screen at all. Give me Buttons or Switches that do not move. So, I can Learn the location of these buttons and know where these buttons are.

Also, I hope the Over bearing Computer that is very distracting goes away too. When I want the Head Lights to be Off I want them to be Off, for example. I do not want a computer to tell me to turn the lights on and then not turn the Head lights even after I selected and pushed the button to Turn Off the Head Lights.

 while you may not want a car that turns on headlights automatically, the person who drives at night without turning on headlights or drives without headlights in the rain, etc. endangers others...  

There is definitely a fair bit of "good nannies" that help to keep the passengers of the car and the fellow drivers they share the road with safer.  Nannies, abs, traction control, etc. can all be implemented without having complex menu driven touch screens.  

I feel like the design peaked right before Covid. The two BMWs I've had just before that both had really nice infotainment. They had a touchscreen for when you wanted to interact directly, like I sometimes do with carplay. They had physical hvac, volume, and a row of presets that could memorize just about anything in the infotainment. From a radio station to a quick link to the performance gauge screen. The screen had more complex configuration displays that would be impossible to do with just buttons. The wheel control was great for pretty much everything not carplay. Just the perfect blend of physical and touch controls IMO.

I have my doubts about manufacturers rolling back touch controls unless they are forced to by law. Those big screens look really impressive when you're on the show floor shopping for a new car. Its not until too late that people realize how annoying they are. If they are cheaper too, well its a win win until it starts showing up as people not picking the brand again with new leases.

I would not mind touch screens if properly used. When I was looking at the Volvo V60, I could not, for the life of me, figure out why they put the HVAC controls in the touch screen, but left the seat controls as actual buttons? Same with things like mirror adjustments. Put the stuff we use the most on buttons, and put second and third tier stuff like seat and mirror adjustments on the touch screen.

They're a hazzard and were only installed because they're a cheap interface. I'm glad they're going the way of the dinosaur. 

While I don't like them either, I think the chances of them disappearing from cars is as likely as smartphones going back to buttons.

Beginning in 2026, a 5-star Euro NCAP rating will require that the car has 'physical' or 'one-touch' controls for a few basic functions (horn, turn signals, wipers, hazards, emergency eCall).  I think they have not firmly defined what that means exactly, but it is something.  Buncha press stuff about it from March this year.

There is a big range of options between "everything onna touchscreen" and "12V switches plus separate levers connected to damper flaps using push-pull cables".

Mechanical controls get pretty tricky when customers (or sales/marketing) demand 32 climate zones per person with automatic adjustment of temperature and humidity based on machine learning, facial recognition, and skin conductivity.

EVs have a problem with vacuum actuators, and they really can benefit from automatic preconditioning while still hooked up to a charger.

One of the clever engineering solutions is "Magic Knob" or "Knob-on-Display"

I have no idea why I find the name amusing.

The Mach-E already uses more or less the same thing: glue a physical knob onto the touchscreen to act like a human touching it.  Multiple size options, can have rotational detents plus axial clicky function.  Most of the KOD press stuff is from 2022, some of the patents go back to the 90's.

• https://www.microchip.com/en-us/products/touch-and-gesture/maxtouch-touchscreen-controllers/kod-family#
• https://bnl-bearings.com/rotational-touchscreen-controls/
• https://www.electronicsweekly.com/news/design/dumb-stick-knob-adds-rotary-encoder-touch-screen-2022-06/

Coming from a fair amount of time behind marine electronics, pure touch screen sucks, but it doesn't take much in the way of knobs or buttons to make it all work great. I prefer the way Simrad integrates a knob and a few buttons in in a way that's intuitive and redundant. Calm seas, dry hands, do it all on the touch screen. Bracing yourself against the helm while running and taking spray, get most of it done with one hand on the knob and buttons. My current low trim '21 F150 is that way. Touchscreen radio/phone, but most of those functions are redundant with hard controls on the steering wheel. HVAC is still physical controls below the touchscreen. A reasonable blend. I'm guessing the up-market trims are more touchscreen than not.

A fun quirk I've noticed about the WT trim Chevy's: the HVAC is the traditional fan speed knob and temperature blend knob. One zone, no temperature display/thermostat...but it appears to share some backend computing with the higher trim trucks that have a thermostats rather than pure blend knob and fan speed. You can set the fan to the lowest setting and the blend knob to full cold, and if the truck is 99degrees, the fan speed will ramp itself up well beyond "low". It's both nice and infuriating. Maybe I cut it down to low transiently to hear what my kid was saying from the backseat. Or maybe I want to sweat?

Happens in my personally owned beater that I think is a '16, [happened] in the '18 I had as a company truck at one point and in my co-worker's current '21 company truck.

The was a recent study from one of the Scandanavian countries about distractions and eyes off the road of various cars- most of the recent stuff, especially the Teslas, were beaten by a 2004 Volvo V70. I've noticed this in particular with my Model 3, where warning messages or minor notifications always default to the space above the HVAC """"controls"""" (basically above your cupholder) which led to a moment recently where my autopilot had to stop because dirt got on a camera somewhere, but to notify me to take control it flashed a message on screen that demands me to take my eyes off the road. 

Had Tesla added a screen for the driver up front instead of the dedicated HVAC controls for the rear seats- or just added the same screen- these complaints would go away, but until then I have to resort to the aftermarket and the legion of CANbus sniffers.

In reply to ClearWaterMS :

The Head Lights are one just one Example. Learning to Drive and Paying Attention to what is going on around you will make the Roads Safer. Not being despondent on Computer Systems to do this for you. This encourages people not to pay attention. Making the Roads more Dangerous.  

I have literally not looked to replace my 2013 DD because of how much I detest the TV screen in the middle of the dash.

In reply to ClearWaterMS :

Headlights are just one example. One should be aware of there surroundings. Not relying on the in Automobile Tectology to keep them out of trouble. The Number of Vehicles I have seen driving without lights before automatic lights where available on Automobiles was very few. Systems like ABS, Traction Control are better because this does not require Driver input to make these systems work. The Touch Screen / Inotanment System requires a lot of attention to operate. Taking a Drivers attention away from what is happening around them. This is a distraction and a very costly item to fix if it goes wrong. If you are used to relying on all these driver aids. What do you do when these driver aids fail? These Driver aids only work if the Driver is aware of there surroundings. If the ABS or Traction Control Failed for example and the Automobile started to slide out, on a rainy day or night. What then. Even if all these systems are working properly. If one is not aware and paying attention to there souroundings they are much more likely to have issues.              

Stuck my head inside a 2024 Mustang this weekend.

Not interested. 

In reply to ddavidv :

i'm pretty sure that's about the size of the screen of the first laptop I ever used

I don't know anymore... 

My 2017 Dodge minivan seems to have a decent mix of tech and old-school controls.  I rarely have to use the touch screen on the ICE. Changing the radio channel and hitting "cancel" when I get a text message and the system just HAS to tell me about it.  

For the HVAC, I pretty much set the temp and never touch it.  Occasionally I'll hit the Defrost buttons but otherwise it's in Auto mode. 

Regarding the Mustang above, I'd need to see it in person and play with it for a bit. I appreciate the actual Vol knob, although I would prefer it in a location closer to the driver.  Given steering wheel controls, I only use the dash knob maybe 30% of the time. 

Ian F (Forum Supporter) said:

I don't know anymore... 

My 2017 Dodge minivan seems to have a decent mix of tech and old-school controls.  I rarely have to use the touch screen on the ICE. Changing the radio channel and hitting "cancel" when I get a text message and the system just HAS to tell me about it.  

For the HVAC, I pretty much set the temp and never touch it.  Occasionally I'll hit the Defrost buttons but otherwise it's in Auto mode. 

Regarding the Mustang above, I'd need to see it in person and play with it for a bit. I appreciate the actual Vol knob, although I would prefer it in a location closer to the driver.  Given steering wheel controls, I only use the dash knob maybe 30% of the time. 

Dodge minivans/chrysler pacificas are the lead offenders in never having headlights/running lights on a night. 

I'll be the dissenter.  I LOVE touchscreens in cars.  My racecar had a tablet for a dash.  It was sooo easy to look at different things even while racing with gloves on.

In reply to Ian F (Forum Supporter) :

This. My '23 BRZ Limited has a touch screen for certain things, mostly phone/media, but has physical controls for the HVAC, a volume knob besides the steering wheel controls, and seat heater buttons on the console. 

I use my phone for music, so if I'm by myself, I just pick a playlist on Spotify and go. It's nice because I can use the steering wheel control to skip a song playing from my phone through the Bluetooth interface (I haven't tried the Android Play or whatever, it needs to be physically connected vs BT). 

But hell, I see tons of people complain about the soft touch indicator, that gives you 3 blinks for a lane change vs staying on. BMW has been doing that for almost 4 decades. Our '18 Mazda 3 has it, etc. 

I don't buy new cars with warranties, so...

DirtyBird222 said:

Dodge minivans/chrysler pacificas are the lead offenders in never having headlights/running lights on a night. 

With my van, that's partly because it's easy to turn off the lights from "auto" for whatever reason and then forget to turn it back on.   I do that once in awhile. 

For some reason, the DRLs seem bright to some folks.  I've been flashed during the day a few times over the years from people thinking I have hi-beams on, when it's just the DRLs that I can't turn off. 

I agree with the Wizard video about cars getting difficult to fix.  It'll definitely take time for the aftermarket to decide if it's worth the effort to make replacement parts for some vehicles. At least with my GC, it's old enough that a standard double-DIN head unit will fit in the radio slot and the touch-screen has nothing to do with the HVAC controls. 

In theory, aftermarket companies could make replacement head units with HVAC and other controls, but it will depend on them being able to get the coding information from manufacturers.  That last part may be a challenge, but I could see it falling under "right to repair" legislation. Especially if a car goes out of warranty and also reaches that age where manufacturers are no longer required to have replacement parts. At that point, there could be a legal mandate for them to release coding information to the aftermarket to create replacement parts.  It's unlikely those parts will be inexpensive, but at least something may be available. 

z31maniac said:

In reply to Ian F (Forum Supporter) :

This. My '23 BRZ Limited has a touch screen for certain things, mostly phone/media, but has physical controls for the HVAC, a volume knob besides the steering wheel controls, and seat heater buttons on the console. 

I use my phone for music, so if I'm by myself, I just pick a playlist on Spotify and go. It's nice because I can use the steering wheel control to skip a song playing from my phone through the Bluetooth interface (I haven't tried the Android Play or whatever, it needs to be physically connected vs BT). 

But hell, I see tons of people complain about the soft touch indicator, that gives you 3 blinks for a lane change vs staying on. BMW has been doing that for almost 4 decades. Our '18 Mazda 3 has it, etc. 

Sort of surprised your car doesn't have CarPlay/Android Auto via Bluetooth. That was pretty established tech by 2023 model year. I seldom use it in my day to day commute, but frequently use it on road trips or headed somewhere I'm unfamiliar with. 

ddavidv said:

Stuck my head inside a 2024 Mustang this weekend.

Not interested. 

Overall I agree with touchscreens  being awful. A few weeks ago I did have a chance to test drive a new Mustang and it wasn't as horrible as one would think. The screens are low enough to not block your vision amd once you set the guages to the Fox body mode the right hand screen can be reduced to just a radio station and clock.  Had very nice salesman  go through all the features and find the most important setting..."off'. Whole lot of R&D money and effort for things so many of us don't want!