Have a NC Miata? Mazda did some suspension leg work

Keith Tanner said:

There are those who prefer the NC to the ND. Usually it's due to space and refinement, the NC is more overtly a GT car. However, if you compare the final Club suspension calibration from the NC3 to the original Club suspension on the ND (which was only used on the soft top and only for two years) I can see how you could prefer it. The non-Club suspension was superior in that application. 

NC1: 2006-07
NC2: 2008-12
NC3: 2013-15

Note that these are purely enthusiast designations that line up with the minor restyling jobs. The actual differences are much smaller than we see with the facelifted NBs or the 2019 ND.

Miatas have always had tachs that will outrun the actual engine speed near redline.

I thought it was 2009+ manuals that got the forged  crank, higher redline that started the NC2?

MrFancypants said:

CyberEric said:

Some people think the NC2 is fantastic, better than the ND1. 

I really, really like the NC with some wide wheels, like RPF1s stuffed under it. Looks amazing.

Ive never driven one, only sat in one. I found the cabin to feel tight compared to my NA. But I’m 6’3”, all torso. My legs are tiny. I look like Gumby.

Years ago I drove an NA and an NC back to back. They both felt like Miatas. To this day I don't understand how someone can love driving one and not the other.

I test drove an NC, and liked it a lot- in terms of how I use the car, it was better than my NB.  But not so much better than I would sell my NB to get a new car.  So I kept my car.

At this point, I would consider getting an NC if it had the power hard top.  But I'm fine with my NB.

Keith Tanner said:

MrFancypants said:

CyberEric said:

Some people think the NC2 is fantastic, better than the ND1. 

I really, really like the NC with some wide wheels, like RPF1s stuffed under it. Looks amazing.

Ive never driven one, only sat in one. I found the cabin to feel tight compared to my NA. But I’m 6’3”, all torso. My legs are tiny. I look like Gumby.

Years ago I drove an NA and an NC back to back. They both felt like Miatas. To this day I don't understand how someone can love driving one and not the other.

Spend some real time in both, they feel different. More like each other than like a Mustang, sure, but there's a definite distinction between the two and the longer you spend in them the more they separate themselves. There are lots of good reasons to prefer one over the other.

Sure, if I spent dozens of hours in each I'd be equipped to split hairs. But they're all lightweight, rear wheel drive, two seat convertibles that are very clearly all related. I'm sure you've heard it said that the NC is a good car, but not a good Miata....  a comment that sounds as silly and absurd as if someone said that the Elise is a good car, but not a good Lotus, because it weighs a couple hundred lbs more than a Europa and feels slightly less visceral.

Of course there are plenty of reasons to prefer the older cars, but if you like lightweight, rear wheel drive, two seat convertibles, I just don't see how you can have a negative opinion of the NC.

In reply to MrFancypants :

Are you reading the lack of overly positive response as negative?  I don't think anyone says they suck.  Just that they perfer something else.

alfadriver (Forum Supporter) said:

MrFancypants said:

CyberEric said:

Some people think the NC2 is fantastic, better than the ND1. 

I really, really like the NC with some wide wheels, like RPF1s stuffed under it. Looks amazing.

Ive never driven one, only sat in one. I found the cabin to feel tight compared to my NA. But I’m 6’3”, all torso. My legs are tiny. I look like Gumby.

Years ago I drove an NA and an NC back to back. They both felt like Miatas. To this day I don't understand how someone can love driving one and not the other.

I test drove an NC, and liked it a lot- in terms of how I use the car, it was better than my NB.  But not so much better than I would sell my NB to get a new car.  So I kept my car.

At this point, I would consider getting an NC if it had the power hard top.  But I'm fine with my NB.

I'm sure I'd have made the same exact choice as you. I mean, if I had bought a brand new Miata in 1995 I'd probably still have it. Not due to lack of appreciation for newer models, but because buying a car takes effort, and I'm lazy and don't like spending money to replace something that still works as I like it to.

alfadriver (Forum Supporter) said:

In reply to MrFancypants :

Are you reading the lack of overly positive response as negative?  I don't think anyone says they suck.  Just that they perfer something else.

Nah, nothing said here by anyone. 

In reply to z31maniac :

I was under that impression as well. And that the motor, along with the forged internals, didn’t cut fuel until 7500 rpm. Different than the tach outrunning the actual engine speed.

This NC looks fantastic!

The forged crank did not really change the driving experience. It's a nice technical upgrade, but it's not one that's going to change how the car feels. The MZR was never a revvy engine so a bit more redline doesn't transform it. I will admit that I really don't care where various enthusiasts split the imaginary line between the NC1 and the NC2 and NC3,  as far as I'm concerned they're all the same car with a few small running changes over the course of 9 years of production. Wikipedia puts NC2 as 2008 with the visible change to the nose.

Yes, they're all two seat RWD convertibles. So's an MGB, and you can't tell me there isn't a difference in driving experience. There is a difference between saying "I like this version best" and "only this version is any good, the rest all suck".  

In reply to Keith Tanner :

I really want to drive a 2.5 swapped NC. I want to see if it's going to be the worth the work and cost.

I've only driven the 2.3. Effective but not entertaining. I can't remember if the 2.5 is an even longer stroke or if it has a larger bore. 

A fully built high compression 2.0 would be the interesting one to me. The brits have done a lot with that package. 

In reply to z31maniac :

The guy who brought you the NC has a 2.5 swapped car.  (I'll be autocrossing it tomorrow)

It has a noticeable bump in torque over the 2.0 but the cams are tuned for lower revving and it really falls on its face at 6k.  It's a healthy little car though and is into the upper 14s in the 1/4 mile.  

In reply to Keith Tanner :

I would love to go the easy route with a Rotrex on the current engine, but the only available kit seems to need a lot of work to be reliable.

The NC is a really capable chassis, and in a few more years when NBs start up the other side of the depreciation curve and NCs are at the bottom I think we'll be talking about them quite a lot.

In reply to Keith Tanner :

Of my entire career, one of my favorite engines I've worked on was the Duratec 4 cyl.  Kinda makes me a little sad when I hear that the engine in the Miata has had mechanical issues....  If the MZR/Duratec could easily be swapped in place of the BP, I would totally do that (if my engine ever failed...).  
(as a tangent, two of the other favoriates are the V12 in the DB7 and the Ecoboost V6)

The other surprise to me is that all of the best mods for that engine are in England and not here...  Curious.

I don't have a problem having to change the suspension on an NC to make it a good car. There are good options in the aftermarket that fix the problems with the factory set up. Most people around here want to change what came from the factory no matter what car it is.

alfadriver (Forum Supporter) said:

In reply to Keith Tanner :

The other surprise to me is that all of the best mods for that engine are in England and not here...  Curious.

I think that's because England didn't really have the small block Chevy :) But priorities are different there, and revvy fours are viewed more favorably. Note that those Brit tuners don't seem to go past the 2.0.

As for MZR in an NA - I have considered it. I've even collected enough parts to do the work. It would have to be more fun than a tuned 1.6 B6.

z31maniac said:

In reply to Keith Tanner :

I would love to go the easy route with a Rotrex on the current engine, but the only available kit seems to need a lot of work to be reliable.

A centrifugal really wakes up the top end. Weird power curve for street use IMO, it's the hardest form of FI to use on the street in my experience. But if you want that MZR to want to pull to redline, it's the answer. We tested a couple of variants over the years.

Sorry y'all, not trying to be contentious. I just have this weird moment in my life that's stuck with me. In 2008 I was looking for a new car and the NC was on the list to test drive. I did my research and from articles and forums and whatever, it was just a lot of hate for the car. After I test drove it I couldn't understand what the big deal was.

Keith Tanner said:

One big difference between the NC and the earlier cars - the NA/NB feel like they're going faster than they really are. This is part of what makes them so much freakin' fun. The NC is faster than it feels. If you want to win a track day, it's a good tool for that. If you just want to put a stupid grin on your face, it suffers a bit compared to its ancestors because it's a little too competent.

I never thought about it in these terms but it is a good way to decribe the difference.  My NA felt fast but wasn't.  My NC moves, but hides it a bit more.  As much as people say the NC is more livable, which it is, I'd still like some better seats and sound supression to make it a better distance cruiser compared to something with a roof.  But I didn't buy it to be a cross county car, its a toy and that is fine.

I'd like all Mazdas better if they could figure out how to put a real top gear in them.  My Miata is screaming along at nearly 4,000 rpm to keep up with interstate traffic.   My MX-6 always had me reaching for another gear on trips.  The NC is a bit better but still very busy.

Would an overdrive trans really be so much to ask for?

In reply to KyAllroad (Jeremy) (Forum Supporter) :

I don't know, man.... driven an E36 M3 lately? 3500 RPM to go 70.  My MK7 GTI is 2K.

Keith Tanner said:

alfadriver (Forum Supporter) said:

In reply to Keith Tanner :

The other surprise to me is that all of the best mods for that engine are in England and not here...  Curious.

I think that's because England didn't really have the small block Chevy :) But priorities are different there, and revvy fours are viewed more favorably. Note that those Brit tuners don't seem to go past the 2.0.

Aren't there tax implications for displacement greater than 2 liters in most of Europe? That would explain why they might focus so much on just the 2.0.

In reply to KyAllroad (Jeremy) (Forum Supporter) :

The miatas i've driven with the 3.63 swap were my favorite miatas. In fact, one of them was a 3.63 / 6spd and i wished it were a 5spd. BUT, it had turbo torque (which is a factor 5v6spd in miatas, sadly). Turns out your gearing doesn't need to be as annoying when you have any torque.

STM317 said:

Keith Tanner said:

alfadriver (Forum Supporter) said:

In reply to Keith Tanner :

The other surprise to me is that all of the best mods for that engine are in England and not here...  Curious.

I think that's because England didn't really have the small block Chevy :) But priorities are different there, and revvy fours are viewed more favorably. Note that those Brit tuners don't seem to go past the 2.0.

Aren't there tax implications for displacement greater than 2 liters in most of Europe? That would explain why they might focus so much on just the 2.0.

I'm not sure that's the case for the UK. They certainly spend a lot of time and effort trying to make the biggest Rover V8 possible.