I want a honda odyssey - am I on crack?

Ok, my wife and I are in a position where we need a new (to us) car. Our family is growing and rear-facing carseats are annoyingly huge. We are a multiple car family (duh-GRM), but in reality we could get away with only one since she is stay-at-home-mom and I work from home 90% of the time. This will technically be 'her' car but I anticipate we will do 90% of our family's driving in whatever we pick. I want something bigish too, since we do a 3000 mile road trip about once a year and need to bring hunting/camping/fishing stuff. Annual mileage is relatively low (around 10,000 or so).

Goals (in priority order):

• 5k ish buy in, maybe 1k more for deferred maintenance
• no station wagons (her rule, how did I marry her? I guess I can live with one fault...)
• room for family (I did look at a Mazda5 and it just didn't quite cut it... so bigger than mazda5)
• great gas mileage and low running/maintenance costs
• ability to tow (bonus)

Right now I think the 2005ish Honda Odyssey is the winner, because of all the normal minivans it is the MPG king (with the cylinder deactivation models it gets rated like 28 mpg hwy or something). I know of trans issues, but I am willing to take the risk.

Am I on crack? Should I be going down a different path?

The transmission issue is not if, it's when.

I would avoid the VCM engine because it comes with expensive active motor mounts, and really doesn't help with FE that much.

If you're OK with that, then have fun!

No, you're not on crack. Though I'd be shocked if anyone actually got 28mpg with it unless they were in a strong tailwind with the cruise at 55mph.

Same answer I give everyone looking at minivans, check out the Sedona. 23-24mpg highway, 18 in town, but fits all other needs, plus 3500lbs towing.

No no NOO not crack we call it VTEC around here!!!

I would go with the Chrysler T&C/Dodge Caravan's though. Just can't beat the originals. Try to find one after 2011 or before 2008. Ones in the 08-10 range are dicey.

My brother had one:

• transmission
• rear main seal
• heater controls
• various other things

Notice the use of the term had, they traded it on a 2014 Ford Edge and were not sad to see it go.

I had a previous-generation Ody and I wouldn't wish that thing upon my worst enemy, but my understanding is that the trans issues were mostly fixed in 2005 when the 3rd gen rolled out.

We looked at various minivans about a year and a half ago, and we looked at a new Sedona as part of that. It was basically a 3rd gen Ody that they had run through a Xerox. So, if you like the Ody (which is a good minivan if you can avoid the trans issues) the Sedona might be a way to get what you want and save a few bucks.

rcutclif wrote: I know of trans issues, but I am willing to take the risk. Am I on crack? Should I be going down a different path?

I suppose crack use is at least one possible explanation for not caring about the trans issues. Overall, an Odyssey is a great vehicle. Decent power, tons of space, actually handles fairly well for a minivan.

But the trans issue is a big deal. Potentially a very expensive fix. 28 mpg is unlikely, no matter what the window sticker says. Maybe on a trip, cruise set, no traffic, all highway. Around town, you can get better gas mileage out of an F150 these days. No, really. 17/18 mpg is what you are looking at.

FWIW - I currently own an Odyssey. My next family truckster will be a Mazda 5.

Great MPGs and tow ability?? I wouldn't trust anything FWD based to tow anything more than 2000 lbs. For your wants and needs would Explorer be the answer?

Crack. Lots of options in the minivan field that don't carry the Honda premium on price.

thanks for the feedback all. I am currently reading up about sedonas. I agree that the honda's drive a premium price, but boy do they have features! (the anti-marketing side of me is pissed that I fell for this, the other part of me still wants the features).

in terms of tow-ability, I can still use my 84 f250. If there was a magical minivan that could get good gas mileage and tow 3k-5k, then I would consider selling the truck.

Sedonas are VERY inexpensive. However we have had/have three Grand Caravans and there's a reason we keep buying them.

rcutclif wrote: in terms of tow-ability, I can still use my 84 f250. If there was a magical minivan that could get good gas mileage and tow 3k-5k, then I would consider selling the truck.

They are called a Ford Flex or Explorer.

FWD-biased, uni-bodies - they aren't trucks.

Bobzilla wrote: Crack. Lots of options in the minivan field that don't carry the Honda premium on price.

The Odyssey is probably the best-driving one on the market, but the price premium is real. I never cared for the Windstars and Freestars we had back in the early 2000s, but they were SO much cheaper than an Odyssey, it didn't matter. And that was when they were new.

You're talking about spending $5k, so I'd go by condition more than model. They all have their weak points. Find the nicest minivan you can regardless of which one it is, IMO.

NGTD wrote:

rcutclif wrote: in terms of tow-ability, I can still use my 84 f250. If there was a magical minivan that could get good gas mileage and tow 3k-5k, then I would consider selling the truck.

They are called a Ford Flex or Explorer. FWD-biased, uni-bodies - they aren't trucks.

Or the Lambda crossovers from GM. I think those can tow a bit more than 5k, actually.

I'm not sure about the Honda's mpg, but my 2014 Dodge Grand Caravan has returned over 29mpg going from Daytona to Jacksonville and back on A1A. ( 180 miles round trip-- mostly 45- 50mph zones)

On my way home from the PRI show it returned 26mpg with plenty of time spent above 80mph. ( From Jax airport to Daytona on Rt. 95) It's all about the gearing. At 80mpg I'm just over 2000rpm.

I'm not sure if the Oddy's mpg is much different, but I know my Dodge can do it. FWIW it's rated to tow 3500 lbs

I have also driven a Chrysler Town & Country and those are nice minivans. But I don't know how good they are compared to the Odyssey or Sedona.

Joe Gearin wrote: I'm not sure about the Honda's mpg, but my 2014 Dodge Grand Caravan has returned over 29mpg going from Daytona to Jacksonville and back on A1A. ( 180 miles round trip-- mostly 45- 50mph zones) On my way home from the PRI show it returned 26mpg with plenty of time spent above 80mph. ( From Jax airport to Daytona on Rt. 95) It's all about the gearing. At 80mpg I'm just over 2000rpm. I'm not sure if the Oddy's mpg is much different, but I know my Dodge can do it. FWIW it's rated to tow 3500 lbs

Honda's aren't geared like a domestic, or the Koreans. They've always pushed the rpms up from what I consider ideal or normal. 70mph in the Ody is 2300rpms, meaing that at 80 it's over 2500rpms or higher.

edit: looks like 80 = 2700rpms.

Tom_Spangler wrote:

NGTD wrote:

rcutclif wrote: in terms of tow-ability, I can still use my 84 f250. If there was a magical minivan that could get good gas mileage and tow 3k-5k, then I would consider selling the truck.

They are called a Ford Flex or Explorer. FWD-biased, uni-bodies - they aren't trucks.

Or the Lambda crossovers from GM. I think those can tow a bit more than 5k, actually.

Not anymore - GM de-rated them to 5K lbs. When they first came out IIRC they were rated to 6.5K lbs.

But they still fit what the OP is describing.

I have an '05 Ody and its checked all of the boxes we had. We have 3 car seats and a booster, and this has carried us back and forth on several family vacations loaded w/ gear. My wife drives to school, appointments, etc during the week so I'm not sure about the city mileage, but the 28mpg sounds high to me( I would love to see how its done ).

We had a 1994 caravan and considered the newer ones but bought the ody. The transmission failure rates dropped started in 2005, but I hear there are issues w/ the new VCM and excessive oil usage.

FWIW, I like the newer caravans and have heard alot of good things about the Kia's. Bottom line is to find the best maintained "whatever you buy" that will last for how long you need it to, and has the least amount of issues.

Unless I missed it, how many kids do you have and how old are they??

rcutclif wrote: If there was a magical minivan that could get good gas mileage and tow 3k-5k, then I would consider selling the truck.

There was a Town and Country with a V6 and transmission that could tow like that, and got decent gas mileage. The GRMS staff had one, and some friends of ours had one as well. It was perhaps the only minivan I found myself actually interested in. I asked the friends to let me know if they ever decided to sell it, so they traded it in as a cash for clunkers. Sigh.

Maybe some of the folk here will be able to identify which unicorn minivan this was (year and specific model).

mrwillie wrote: Unless I missed it, how many kids do you have and how old are they??

Well, only one and he is 3 months old. Number of kids is not the problem, its the stupid rear-facing car seat.

There is simply not enough room to be comfortable sitting in the seat directly in front of the car seat in most vehicles, which means when all three of us go for a ride two sit in the back and one drives. I hate trying to chat with my wife like this.

For the record, we have tried this in a 2012 focus hatch (owned), a 2014 Maxima (rented) and a 06 Mazda5 (test-drive). While possible to sit in front of the car seat in all three, none were very fun for me. Either cram your knees into the dash or sit straight up. Maybe we are being weenies, or are doing the car seat wrong, but I really feel like there was some collusion between car seat manufacturers and car manufacturers to ensure that the only vehicles with just enough room were the minivans and bigger.

Seriously look at the Korean cars. LEg room and rear seat space is very suprising and something the Japanese/domestics don't get. I'm 6' with a 32" inseam and I can comfortably sit behind my seat with extra knee room when the driver's seat is set for me. Very large cars inside.

We're currently on Ody #3, we've leased an 08, 10 and currently have a 2012. I liked the 08 the best overall.

The 28 is doable, but only on long trips with minimal or no stops between fillups; I've seen 27.5 with the 2012 with the variable cylinders, cruise set at 75, dropping quickly once the cruise comes off. The 'older' two would get 25-26 with the same payload and trip profile. They all get crappy city mpg like 15-16, partly because its a 4500lb bus, partly because my wife drives like Clarkson.

Heaviest thing I've pulled with one is a few compact cars on tow dollies, which is probably around 31-3300 for Civic + UHaul dolly(?).

I vote for checking out what else is out there, and buying the best maintained in your price range, regardless of brand.

I will say if you have kids the power sliders are almost a must have when they get to the age where you're shuttling them around and doing drop-offs.

The Odyssey is a great vehicle, assuming you buy one after the transmission issues are fixed. Our 2007 has only been back to the dealer for a couple minor recalls and services that I didn't feel like doing myself (timing belt and tranny fluid changes mainly). It's comfy, reliable, has lots of space, and drives well. I refuse to use the terms "sporty" and "minivan" in the same sentence, so let's just say that Honda's corporate philosophy on vehicle dynamics shows up even in their minivan product. It's much less annoying to drive than the Sienna or the Chrysler products.

28 mpg is smoking crack -- ours basically never breaks 20. Part of that is the pisswater they sell as gas here in California, though. The VCM is only rated at like a 1 mpg improvement, so I wouldn't get one specifically for that reason. OTOH, I think only the base model 'LX' cars had the non-VCM motor, at least in 2007, so odds are that you'd end up with one anyway.

Do the Hondas cost more than the Chryslers, Kias, etc? Yes. Are they worth it? IMHO, also yes.

For your price range, all I could find was clapped out Hondas our Toyotas, where as i was able to get a pretty nice 2005 town and country with stow and go and 125k for 4000. I did spend about another grand on minor rust repair(in front of the rear wheels, common area), tires, tune up, shocks and brakes.

Rustier Hondas were about 4 years older and way more beat for the same price.