Idle thoughts - survival rate of malaise-era cars?

Got to thinking this weekend about how many cars we see from the mid-60's to early-70's, and how few from the malaise era (roughly 73 to mid-80's).  I'm guessing the "normal" 4 doors, wagons, vans, etc, probably died off at the same rate, but it just seems like the more special cars of the 70's just didn't stick around as much as the ones from the 60's.  Production numbers shouldn't be too hard to get, but I wonder if there is a way to get registration info to confirm this beyond anecdotally. 

It was reinforced today when I went to the Cavalcade of Customs (Cincinnati's yearly indoor car show).  The vast majority of 1970's cars there could be split into 3 groups - muscle/pony cars from the beginning of the 70s, 2nd gen F-bodies (mostly Trans Ams), and a smattering of Corvettes.  I seem to recall the Mustang II sold in huge numbers, but there was only one there.  In the entire show, I did not see a single GM colonnade car.  I'm not sure if I saw any 78-81 or 82-88 G-bodies, either, but I know a lot of those got chewed up on dirt tracks.

Any local cruise in will have no shortage of 64-70 Mustangs, 1964-72 Cutlasses, 442s, GTOs, Malibus, Chevelles, and such.  But after that it kind of hits a wall.  I'm not sure how long it has been since I've seen a mid-70's Hurst Olds, a Mustang II King Cobra, or a 301 Turbo Trans Am.  I know they were slower than the cars that came before them, and a lot of the special editions were little more than tape stripe packages, but there were improvements in ride quality and handling, and personal luxury coupes really came into their own.  Build quality couldn't have been that much worse (if any) than what came before.

I'm guessing the lower horsepower will doom them to being also-rans forever, but I hope there are enough out there being taken care of that someday I can snag a 73 Chevelle Laguna, or a 76 Cutlass 442 as a weekend cruiser.

I'm still hoping to score a cheap 70s Ranchero someday. And some of the early 80s boxy Fords are interesting to me as well. But yeah, nobody bothered to save those cars usually. Probably all the way up to the mid 90s, the standard cars of the time got thrown away and crushed. I mean, for sure some 60s generic cars got crushed too, but probably not as high of a percentage. Because you could take a base model Tempest or whatever and make it look like a GTO. It's a bit harder to make a malaise-era car that cool.

Between the safety standards ruining the looks and the emission standards ruining the performance they basically all sucked. Yeah a few survived but only because they could overcome those two strikes. 

I'm just going to leave this here.  This car belongs to Dale Jr and is allegedly his favorite.  You can say whatever you like about these....  my dad crewed one of these in a few USAC stock car races too.  I might be able to find photos of that car.

Stampie said:

Between the safety standards ruining the looks and the emission standards ruining the performance they basically all sucked. Yeah a few survived but only because they could overcome those two strikes. 

This. They didn't survive because they weren't worth saving.

I think they're out there in plentiful numbers, it's just that no one drags a 77 Diplomat out of a junkyard to save it.

And then there's me.  I capitalize on the fact that no one wants them and I buy them cheap.  Let's keep this thread short.  Classic muscle is great, but it's bloody expensive for really old-school tech.  Many of them have high compression engines without hardened exhaust seats and need some re-engineering to get them to run on modern gas.  If I'm going to tear into an engine to make it driveable, might as well start with something that costs $1500 instead of $15,000.

So, do me a favor and let's keep this thread really short so no one else catches on to the coolness of wheezers.  I call these cars "Superman Lunchboxes."  They're so uncool that they're cool.  If you're the kid who gets bullied, your superman lunchbox is a target for wedgies.  If you're the popular kid and you get a superman lunchbox, suddenly it's so wickedly cool.

60k miles, 140hp, $2500

100k miles, 125hp, $1750

7400 miles, (not a typo), 78hp, $1500

123k, 302 V8, $250

58k miles, garage kept, 454, A/C, pristine time capsule with bias ply tires from 1978, $4000

I forget how many miles, but 140hp and $1325

Stampie said:

Between the safety standards ruining the looks and the emission standards ruining the performance they basically all sucked. Yeah a few survived but only because they could overcome those two strikes. 

But they are perfect platforms for a super easy engine swap.  Heck, if you're getting a 1964 GTO, it's going to have 10.5:1 compression and open chambers that worked great with leaded gas and only made 330 gross hp (275 or so SAE net).  You're going to have to swap heads anyway and neuter it further or keep race gas around.

And I think this is beautiful:

Tom_Spangler said:

This. They didn't survive because they weren't worth saving.

Yes!  Please keep this mentality going so I can afford my next 1976 land yacht.

It's tough to find anything north of the mason-dixon/Ohio river that isn't a POS older from the past 10-15 yrs. 

Overall build quality was still abysmal compounded by the aforementioned crash and emissions ratings.

In reply to Curtis73 :

Those old 80's 442's get big money.  $2500?  

Curtis73 said:

Stampie said:

Between the safety standards ruining the looks and the emission standards ruining the performance they basically all sucked. Yeah a few survived but only because they could overcome those two strikes. 

But they are perfect platforms for a super easy engine swap.  Heck, if you're getting a 1964 GTO, it's going to have 10.5:1 compression and open chambers that worked great with leaded gas and only made 330 gross hp (275 or so SAE net).  You're going to have to swap heads anyway and neuter it further or keep race gas around.

And I think this is beautiful:

I agree. I think a 70 high compression Cadillac 472 would be cool in a 78 small body Cadillac coupe de ville. But you know what?  That same engine will be so much berking cooler in a 28 Model A.  Yeah these years are good values but to they are priced low for a reason. 

They weren't saved in near the numbers. As a huge fan of the fox chassis they seem to be the most saved cars from the era. While it's mostly mustangs there's a lot of people out there that really like the fairmont Ltd and thunderbirds

for some reason there are a lot of late 70's Lincoln Continentals and a few Big Thunderbirds for sale near me.

AnthonyGS said:

I'm just going to leave this here.  This car belongs to Dale Jr and is allegedly his favorite.  You can say whatever you like about these....  my dad crewed one of these in a few USAC stock car races too.  I might be able to find photos of that car.

I'd like to have a 1973 Pontiac Grand Am version of Dale's Laguna.

When I was in college, my parents had a '73 Ods Cutlass Salon, it wasn't fast but it was a pretty nice car.

Maybe it's because of the time period and socioeconomic area I was raised in but the malaise era is far and away my favorite era of vehicles.  

I recently went to a demolition derby and was so angered that they were still using those big ol land yachts. They are getting rarer and rarer it seems.  

I still long for an early 70's coupe deville. 

'73-77 GM A-bodies are hard to find because their frames were the basis for a lot of circle track chassis.  The ones that survived, anyway.

I'd be willing to bet more cars from that era get saved 

They're starting to become cooler to my crowd as time goes on. I dont think they'll ever hit it as big as the 60s cars, but I think they will be saved

MrChaos said:

for some reason there are a lot of late 70's Lincoln Continentals and a few Big Thunderbirds for sale near me.

If you encounter an original & clean 77-79 Town Car for around Challenge price please let me know. All the ones I see are either well-used or $5k.

TurboFocus said:

I'd be willing to bet more cars from that era get saved 

They're starting to become cooler to my crowd as time goes on. I dont think they'll ever hit it as big as the 60s cars, but I think they will be saved

You've apparently never heard of demolition derbies.  A lot of these cars were destroyed in the 80s, especially the four doors and wagons.

The other thing with malaise era cars is a lot of them had big-blocks because second-generation emissions control was basically "remove all horsepower from the engine, then make the engine larger to compensate", so people would buy them for the value of the engine, then pull that and scrap the rest.  That $500 land yacht was a 5000lb shell encasing a Buick or Olds or Pontiac 455, or a Chevy 454, or a Ford 460, or a Chrysler 440, just waiting to ger modified and swapped into a 60s musclecar.

How about a V8 4-speed 1979 Firebird near KC for $2500?

In reply to Knurled. :

I've heard of those but when I look around I can count 3-4 people I know that have 80s vehicles and 0 from the 60s.

"Malaise" isn't exactly a glowing descriptor. When an entire era can be described that way, people aren't likely to want to keep things around to remind them of said era.

I just looked at 70's domestic cars on the local craigslist.  Mostly pickups, vettes, & trans ams with a few Novas thrown in. There were a couple random others that would meet the criteria of this thread though.

eastsideTim said:

Got to thinking this weekend about how many cars we see from the mid-60's to early-70's, and how few from the malaise era (roughly 73 to mid-80's).  I'm guessing the "normal" 4 doors, wagons, vans, etc, probably died off at the same rate, but it just seems like the more special cars of the 70's just didn't stick around as much as the ones from the 60's.  Production numbers shouldn't be too hard to get, but I wonder if there is a way to get registration info to confirm this beyond anecdotally. 

It was reinforced today when I went to the Cavalcade of Customs (Cincinnati's yearly indoor car show).  The vast majority of 1970's cars there could be split into 3 groups - muscle/pony cars from the beginning of the 70s, 2nd gen F-bodies (mostly Trans Ams), and a smattering of Corvettes.  I seem to recall the Mustang II sold in huge numbers, but there was only one there.  In the entire show, I did not see a single GM colonnade car.  I'm not sure if I saw any 78-81 or 82-88 G-bodies, either, but I know a lot of those got chewed up on dirt tracks.

Any local cruise in will have no shortage of 64-70 Mustangs, 1964-72 Cutlasses, 442s, GTOs, Malibus, Chevelles, and such.  But after that it kind of hits a wall.  I'm not sure how long it has been since I've seen a mid-70's Hurst Olds, a Mustang II King Cobra, or a 301 Turbo Trans Am.  I know they were slower than the cars that came before them, and a lot of the special editions were little more than tape stripe packages, but there were improvements in ride quality and handling, and personal luxury coupes really came into their own.  Build quality couldn't have been that much worse (if any) than what came before.

I'm guessing the lower horsepower will doom them to being also-rans forever, but I hope there are enough out there being taken care of that someday I can snag a 73 Chevelle Laguna, or a 76 Cutlass 442 as a weekend cruiser.

There is a fair number of higher end cars like Jaguar and Mercedes Benz from that era.  A few extra tubes and air pump etc didn't deter ownership and pride in those. 

Same with Corvette although one year the 350 small block had 350 horsepower the next it was 160 horsepower.  Pretty much the same engine except instead of advertised horsepower it was actual horsepower. A lot of people would rather be lied to. 

I had to read the thread title a few times to realize it didn't say mayonaise or hollandaise.

I'm hungry.