Anyone have any idea how the guy is actually doing? I am legitimately curious. He got a real good shot of water/coolant at 200+ degrees but that's pretty cool relative to most things that burn you and it traveled through a few feet of air and some clothing to get to him.
My Kawasaki Concours handles better than most of those death karts. Lets not even get into BWWs and Ducatis.
I'm not sure you can outlaw bad engineering but I know it when I see it.
Remember exploding Pintos and rolling Explorers?
In reply to MrJoshua :
2nd and 3rd degree burns according to his gofundme. Supposed to be getting skin grafts. Right arm is completely bandaged.
Mr_Asa said:In reply to MrJoshua :
2nd and 3rd degree burns according to his gofundme. Supposed to be getting skin grafts. Right arm is completely bandaged.
Ouch-good news and terrible at the same time.
trying to idiot proof things merely makes better idiots.
Toyman01 (Moderately Supportive Dude) said:In reply to accordionfolder :
At no point in the video was that vehicle on a public road so, your point is?
As to your argument, I think motorcycles, bikes, walkers and golf carts on public roads are dumb as hell and actions only done by people with a death wish. That doesnt mean I want them regulated.
Motorcycles were brought up as an example, presumably in the context of public roads, no? There were no motorycles in that video or at that event and the vehicle in the video was road-driven, was it not?
Even in the context of "track events" - I bet you don't spend much time on a racetrack? I'm not talking autoX. As someone who spends a LOT of time on a racetrack if someone is driving a stitched together piece of E36 M3 like that near me I'm going to never use that organizer again. "Let them do dumb E36 M3 and learn their lessons" doesn't really work when their radiator blows scalding them and they smash into me at 100mph, yeah? We have tech because people are dumb as E36 M3 and have no sense of responsibility.
In reply to aircooled :
Oh, I've been "following" that utter piece of E36 M3 since it came out - it appears in a bunch of my feeds since I like track cars/etc. Your forum handle is fairly ironic given the current context as well, lol.
I have watched Cleetus for quite some time and have been cringing at the complete lack of safety with respect to his track. I hope he has insurance and I hope he has a very good legal wall between his personal and buisness finances. Otherwise what was once a rising YouTube star with a track that he has invested tons of money in to to bring back to life will be over.
Another thing is he has a metric ton of corporate sponsorship. I wonder what there exposure is with respect to this.
It's clear he knows they berkeleyed up by his statement at the end of this. Still, hoping the driver makes it through this clean and clear with just some scars to remind him what happened.
watching his videos for some time. When he f's up he usually points it out. IT's why I've kept watching.
bobzilla said:watching his videos for some time. When he f's up he usually points it out. IT's why I've kept watching.
Yeah - the problem is the number of impressionable young eyes watching that don't have someone helping them steer. They want to be just like him, safety 3rd - let's send it boys. I think the same thing when I watch RoadKill, they've come within inches to dying on camera on 3 occasions that I can think of off the top of my head (of episodes they've aired for that matter...) and there are young kids who worship them and their approach. I'm not implying they're bad people or that they should be outlawed - really I'm not sure what point I'm trying to make other than, man, people are dumb.
In reply to accordionfolder :
Have you watched the video? It was a burnout contest. He was out there by himself in a concrete box. No one within 50'. The only person in danger was himself. So again your point?
And I've run Lemons races since 2008, and several TT events since they started, so track time is not something I lack, but thanks for your condescending comment.
In reply to Toyman01 (Moderately Supportive Dude) :
lol, k.
Pete. (l33t FS) said:NOHOME said:While I would not wave this as the flag for transportation safety, how would this be worse than a motorcycle?
Lost control going around a LH turn and was hit by another car. Tossed from the Kart. You need to dig down a few layers of bad decisions before you reach the actual cart as the cause of death.
Bothers me more that society uses the natural repulsive nature of these tragedies to close the door a little further for those that want to build creative vehicles.
How much coolant does a motorcycle hold?
How enclosed in the motorcycle are you?
I did not mention the motorcycle as an example of something that will scald you.
I brought up the motorcycle as an example of "Voluntary Assumption of Risk". Kinda the same as going to a baseball game and being injured by a foul ball. You signed up for it by buying the ticket.
If every single bad thing that happens has to be somebody else's fault, then society is kinda berkeleyed no?
In reply to NOHOME :
It's not so much that it has to be someone else's fault, it's that by staging an event, you are assuming a level of responsibility for what happens at the event.
I recently got in a Lotus 7 replica that I used to track 15-20 years ago. My first thought was "What was I f---ing thinking?" A little love tap on the boards and I could have been crippled for life. My point is that our views regarding risk assumption change. That event was a bunch of people exercising their god-given right to act stupid. I don't see the appeal, but I don't care for professional wrestling either.
As an aside, there was a motorcycle mag that I used to read which would have a crash report in every episode focussing on how the safety gear held up. Pretty gruesome stuff in general, but it was the descriptions of the gloves that used to really creep me - very clinical descriptions along the lines of "The seams parted at the thumb causing dislocation and grinding down to the bone". Thankfully, there's better stuff available now.
Is the guy who asks "is this safe?" A wet blanket on the fun?
We all have to remember to take a step back every now and then and ask what if...
95% unrelated but this discussion has me wondering something about self-assembled vehicles, like an Exocet. How much is the original builder / owner on the hook for whatever might happen to a future owner down the road if they crash it and things go badly for the driver as a result? Can a vehicle like that be sold without the seller having to worry forever about the possibility of being named in a future lawsuit?
In reply to einy (Forum Supporter) :
Haven't done anything like an exocet myself, but any car I have modified gets a bill of sale tacked on, basically having the owner acknowledge that it's been modified and it's up to them to judge the suitability of the modifications and indemnify me of any responsibility.
2 copies, one for each of us and I put mine in a file. Never needed it pulled back out, but better safe than sorry.
In reply to einy (Forum Supporter) :
That's a question I have asked with no real good response. It is also what has made me pretty sure the MG/LMP360 will get cut up when I'm done unless someone can really explain to me how someone will be unable to sue me for my retirement if they crash it.
I'm frequently wrong about things and am not in Lawyering or Insurance. I don't know what the limits of LLCs are and have learned from this site I am a bit more risk adverse then most people so YMMV.
nocones said:In reply to einy (Forum Supporter) :
That's a question I have asked with no real good response. It is also what has made me pretty sure the MG/LMP360 will get cut up when I'm done unless someone can really explain to me how someone will be unable to sue me for my retirement if they crash it.
I'm frequently wrong about things and am not in Lawyering or Insurance. I don't know what the limits of LLCs are and have learned from this site I am a bit more risk adverse then most people so YMMV.
I hereby cast aside any liability for nocones for anything he might have done or not done on the LMP360 and give up any right to sue him, his retirement, his kids, his grandparents, or anyone that knows him. I also revoke the right of anyone related to me, knows me, or even heard of me to sue him and all those people listed above. on the sale of the LMP360 to me. I assume all risk and pass that assumption of risk onto anyone that might inherit the LMP360 from me because I'd only sell it over my dead body.
Does that put me first in line to buy it once you are done?
In reply to Stampie (FS) :
Problem is, your insurance companies may sue, without your say in the matter.
In reply to Pete. (l33t FS) :
What if I promise to never insure it?
One of the first things we got to see at tech school was photos of a mechanic who opened a hot radiator cap. My radiator stays far from my body and my car will always have a firewall. I've never understood the death cart rage.
my zephyr was built primarily for burnout competitions. They don't tech cars at all around here
A few years ago at Castrol raceway a sprint car racer got burned when a hose or something burst and the driver got sprayed with hot water. They called in another ambulance to do a transfer. And that's with a full blown fire suit.
On the original video, I'm not sure why it wasn't black/red-flagged when coolant started spouting off. I can see it at least 30 seconds before it exploded. Of course, I don't know if that sort of protocol exists on a burnout .... competition? I'm not really sure what that is..
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