AMiataCalledSteve
AMiataCalledSteve HalfDork
4/29/24 8:29 a.m.

I came across a listing for this old lap timer:

I plan on getting into Time Trials in the upcoming years, but I'm still in the beginning stages of my research. Is something like this worthwhile to buy, or would it just be a waste of money?

wvumtnbkr
wvumtnbkr GRM+ Memberand UltimaDork
4/29/24 8:32 a.m.

Aren't there apps for phone now?

David S. Wallens
David S. Wallens Editorial Director
4/29/24 9:20 a.m.

Wow, I remember those. 

Tom Suddard
Tom Suddard GRM+ Memberand Publisher
4/29/24 9:27 a.m.

I wouldn't bother with that. It's so, so, so cheap and easy to get lap times + data these days that you'd just be frustrated by that. 

Also, it's not guaranteed you'll be able to set up your beacon at start/finish at every track.

codrus (Forum Supporter)
codrus (Forum Supporter) GRM+ Memberand UltimaDork
4/29/24 10:41 a.m.

I would not spend any money on that, and probably would not even bother with it if it was free.

IMHO they are basically useless for driver development.  They give you one data point per lap (the time), there's no predictive timing in it.  You can't use it to determine if you were faster or slower on any particular corner, so unless you're already a super consistent driver it's very difficult to turn that one data point into something you can take action on.

As for the value of that lap time if you mount a video camera in the car you can get the same thing from there, and if you're going TT you'll need a transponder for official lap times anyway.

By comparison, something like an AIM Solo or a Garmin Catalyst gives you a continuously-updated predictive lap time.  This means you can look at it before a corner, note that it's predicting a 1:45.0, go through the corner, see a predicted 1:44.9 and know that whatever you did there you gained a tenth over what you'd been doing before.  You still need to figure out what you did right (or wrong!) but it's updated on a corner-by-corner basis which makes it much easier.  Those devices will also log the data so that you can analyze it offline later.

KevinLG
KevinLG New Reader
4/29/24 10:53 a.m.

I bought an old race car that has one in it. Never used it, and never will. Even the cheapest phone app will be a better choice.

JG Pasterjak
JG Pasterjak Production/Art Director
4/29/24 11:43 a.m.

Yeah walk away unless you're a collector. GPS-based lap timers are pretty much the standard now and most tracks won't even let you set up your own beacons anymore.

AMiataCalledSteve
AMiataCalledSteve HalfDork
4/29/24 12:26 p.m.

Cool, thanks for the info everyone! I haven't had a reason to track data yet, so this is good stuff to know.

GameboyRMH
GameboyRMH GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
4/29/24 12:41 p.m.

I've pieced together a phone-based data logging system for my Toyobaru on a shoestring budget, if you want an idea of the minimum cost for a decent system:

Phone: You probably already own one but maybe $80 from ebay or a pawn shop. Install TrackAddict on it.

10Hz Bluetooth GPS receiver: You need this for getting consistently reliable position data and decent GPS speed data, they go for $130-$250 new but I got a used one for around $80

BT-OBD module: Another thing you might already own, can be had for around $20

Bit of foam to hold the phone in place: You'll want to mount the phone flat in a cubby near your handbrake to get good accelerometer readings. You can probably save some from the trash but if you go the expensive and ultra-messy route with craft foam like I did, maybe $10

AMiataCalledSteve
AMiataCalledSteve HalfDork
4/29/24 2:45 p.m.

In reply to GameboyRMH :

What if you don't have OBDII? My Miata is too old and the stock car is, well, a stock car.

wake74
wake74 Reader
4/29/24 8:51 p.m.

I'm about as cheap as they come when it comes to racing (the fact that I just shipped my Hewland MK9 off to Scott Young for a rebuild and a replacement CWP is making me twitch thinking about that bill), and I wouldn't use that system. I pieced together an old TraqMate system for my vintage FF. That allows me to pull in TPS, RPM, and Steering, and includes GPS. And Peter has some really good instructional videos as it was his go to back in the day. It has a small display which is needed in an FF, as there isn't really a place to mount a Phone, or I'd probably just run Harrys for the predictive laps.  


BUT and it's a big ol' BUT, older systems are a huge PITA when it comes to actually using the data and adding the video. Modern systems where you just pull out the card and have immediate video sync with data are so much nicer. It's such a PITA to sync the video at the track, most of the time I don't bother doing it between sessions, which defeats the purpose.

 

 

GameboyRMH
GameboyRMH GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
4/29/24 9:07 p.m.

In reply to AMiataCalledSteve :

Maybe see if you can find an old Race Capture Pro Mk1, it's a serious-business data logger and the only newer features it doesn't have are things you can't use anyway. I have one on my AE92.

preach
preach GRM+ Memberand UltraDork
4/30/24 4:56 a.m.

I was hoping:

ShinnyGroove (Forum Supporter)
ShinnyGroove (Forum Supporter) Dork
4/30/24 7:33 a.m.

I use my GoPro 10 Black to record laps sometimes.  A few months ago I pulled the video into RaceRender and found that the camera had also been capturing telemetry- GPS and accelerometers I think.  Anyway, it was perfectly fine to make video overlays with speed/braking data, which is enough to make it useful for coaching. Just another easy way to get better data than those ancient lap timers will give you. 

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