Isnt there a GRM way to make a B5 A4 reliable (no jokes please)

I’ve seen so many Audi engines used for swaps into everything from Fieros to homemade hill climbers.

What would one have to do to improve a B5 A4 1.8t into a car you can trust to go anywhere, anytime. Cheaply...

Im desperately clinging to this idea.

I am with you on this. I love these cars but would never get one as a dd unless it had a warranty. 

Maybe that really is the answer. Get one from CarMax with the warranty. 

The 1.8s are suppose to be good motors. What I don’t know is if the whole unreliable reputation Audi has with older cars is a bit blown out of proportion due mostly the internet. 

I have had Porsche’s in my driveway for about 25 years and people always said they were unreliable needy expensive cars. I found them to be no more of a problem than any other car. The biggest issue with VAG cars is they don’t take well to ignoring regular service and maintenance. If you ignore the cars needs it will result in expensive repairs down the road. 

In reply to dean1484 :

So it’s not just me?

What would a Lemons car have done to it stay on the track?

(I’m one of those odd people that prefer to daily drive semi-gutted cars and trucks)

A lot of the B5 problems were electrical in nature, many related to the early implementation of CAN bus, IIRC. Comm loss with emissions modules causing perpetual CELs, etc.

The early 1.8Ts had severe sludge issues, and also like to leak coolant from the back of the block. They burn through turbo components and I also see a lot out there with bent rods for some reason. When new, VAG also over-estimated the timing belt service interval which lead to mass hysteria when the original run of timing belts all broke when the cars were 10k out of warranty, but 40k before the book said service was due!

The 2.8 is more or less stout but gets abysmal fuel economy and is a nightmare to work on. Think "entire front end of the car has to come off for thermostat replacement."

Both engines like to leak oil and have garbage ignition coils with an astronomical failure rate.

IMO the biggest issue with buying a B5 anything these days is finding one that has been maintained well its entire life and keeping it that way. They have always been very maintenance-sensitive cars and trying to make an abused one solid again could turn into a $10k project very quickly. It was getting hard to find nice ones 10 years ago, I can't imagine what the situation is now.

I guess the question is, what do you define as "reliable?" Able to start and drive long enough to get you where you need to go, warning lights be damned? Then just buy the car, put 2.0T coil packs on it and stay on top of timing belt/oil changes. It will constantly be freaking out about the ABS module and be throwing emissions codes most likely but it will get you where you need to go.

In reply to pointofdeparture :

But will it pass Massachusetts inspection with the CEL on? I couldn’t care less about the actual lights on the dashboard 

Maintain the car?

That has always worked for my B5-owning customers with high miles.

Most VW enthusiasts on the Internet are not car-maintainers but more like, "Ehhh....  it needs tires.... and it's low on gas.... *inhales deeply, sighs*  That's a lotta work, I'll just part it out."

For serious, the biggest problem with the B5 is that it was a very cheap way to get an upmarket European car.  A 1.8t quattro  cost slightly less than an Impreza 2.5RS!  So there were a lot of very cheap people who would buy them and run them into the ground, either from new or as second or third owners.

The automatics are reliable if you change the fluid, the engines are dead-nuts reliable.  If you replace the diverter valve when it fails, you won't cook the plastic air injection hoses or pump exhaust gases into the air pump, which reliably kills it.

But there are a large number of "enthusiasts" who think an MIL is a normal thing, and in fact celebrate it.  No, it is not normal, you are just abusing your car.  When the dipstick tube or PCV hoses break, buy new parts and fix it right, don't just tape it up or ignore it.  And change your damn oil too, the factory OCI is waaaaay too long.

My definition is not having to call in sick to work because it won’t start or breaks down on the side of the road. My 2006 GMC has needed work but I’ve always gotten there and back.

 I’d be buying a manual 1.8t if I was going to bite the bullet. My brain is saying “you need a Camry”  but heart is saying “berkeley that, buy something you like.”

My cousin had a 1.8t. He literally kept 3 sets of ignition coils in the trunk because of that--not having to call in sick to work. 

Otherwise, it was maintenance intensive, and th e CEL was just about always on, but once he figured out that he needed a spare set of ignition coils with him AT ALL TIMES he was fine and it never stranded him.  That, however, is a pretty obscene step to take towards making something daily-driveable for a car that was, at the time, 7 years old. 

ebonyandivory said:

My definition is not having to call in sick to work because it won’t start or breaks down on the side of the road. My 2006 GMC has needed work but I’ve always gotten there and back.

 

 I’d be buying a manual 1.8t if I was going to bite the bullet. My brain is saying “you need a Camry”  but heart is saying “berkeley that, buy something you like.”

So you're planning on going from the most reliable GM truck platform to the least reliable VW platform? Ugh, hard pass. B5s are beautiful cars however!

Dave M said:

ebonyandivory said:

My definition is not having to call in sick to work because it won’t start or breaks down on the side of the road. My 2006 GMC has needed work but I’ve always gotten there and back.

 

 I’d be buying a manual 1.8t if I was going to bite the bullet. My brain is saying “you need a Camry”  but heart is saying “berkeley that, buy something you like.”

So you're planning on going from the most reliable GM truck platform to the least reliable VW platform? Ugh, hard pass. B5s are beautiful cars however!

Well yes, but not the way you’re thinking. I’m giving my truck to my son who’s about to get his drivers license and I’m looking for a cheap-to-buy fun-ish, manual awd or rwd and I’ve always had a soft spot for turbo Audi’s.

Im sure everyone here can identify with my plight.

My B5 is still the most unreliable car I've ever own, and I've DD a 15 years old Alfa Milano in Canadian winter.

And understand that this was 13 years ago. I cannot believe that they have gotten better with age. Mine was a 1.8T.

Like others have said, the coils are absolute complete garbage. They don't last long, they break often and even when new, they struggle to start the car when it's cold outside (below 0 deg). That last part might not be a problem for you, but it was for me in Canuckistan. I never had a car that refused to start as often as that one.

Also, mine leaked oil from everywhere.

And don't forget the front end which will need to be completely rebuild very often. 

All that for a car that wasn't very fun to drive and that was really cramped inside.  

But from what I understand, they seem to have been hit or miss car. Some people have very good luck with them, while others have experiences like mine.

How lucky do you feel?

How bad would it be if you missed a day of work because of car issues? That’s the main question. My boss would be ok with one day, a bit grumbly, but wouldn’t tolerate another day. I’d be looking for more work, or a better car. 

In reply to _ :

I work for the state of Massachusetts in the medical field. It’s not great to call in sick obviously but I have more sick days than I’d ever use. It’s more of a pride in my work reputation thing than getting in trouble.

(Every time I see your avatar I see this:  )

I had an early B5 A4 (97) that still had the 12v V6.  It was not fast, but handled pretty well and went 193k before I sold it with only replacing the front control arms (2 or 3x) and the headlight switch a few times also.  

The clutch took teaching 2 younger brother on it and the motor survived running it out of oil after holing the oil pan on a rallyx run.  Only sold it because it was needing the front arms again and the throw out barring was going.  Being a MN car, I didn't want to deal with the dissasembly.

So, in conclusion, look for an early 12v car.  They do not have the issues of the 30v or the turbo.  Manual is solid.  They also have the flat sided door handles and unequal length mirrors.  Also the best green is in those year(s).

I’ve owned several b5’s, one 1.8t Passat, 2 s4’s and one 1.8t a4.

none ever stranded us but I maintained them obsessively.

These cars don’t tolerate fools well.  They’ll cost you money to keep up and be reliable.  As said earlier if you buy a neglected one it’ll bury you financially to get it where it needs to be.

these are cheap cars to buy, but not to own....

In reply to ebonyandivory :

I hear ya, I still lust after a longroof b5 even after my father rage through his ownership experience. What a beautiful POS that was.

mtn said:

My cousin had a 1.8t. He literally kept 3 sets of ignition coils in the trunk because of that--not having to call in sick to work. 

Y'know, if you replace the plugs every 30k or so, the coils live a nice long life.

But I guess keeping spare parts and tools in the trunk is cheaper than a few sets of plugs.

This falls under the category of "usual VWAG abuse".

In reply to Knurled. :

That’s interesting. The coils were malfunctioning due to higher than designed for load due to worn spark plug electrodes? At least to some degree?

In reply to Knurled. :

Even on new spark plugs, I think the longest I've seen the coils last is 30K. Again, it might be different in the warm south.

I bought a B5 S4 new, back in Y2K, owned it for about 7 years and 72K miles.  It had the usual S4 problems -- diverter valves, coolant afterrun pump, and control arm bushings.  Coils were replaced under warranty although I never had one fail.  My experience with it was sufficiently positive that I've bought 2 more Audis after that (a B6 S4 and I now have a C7 S6).

That said, I bought the B5 and C7 new (the B6 was off-lease w/ 15K) and I maintained them properly.  At this point, any cheap B5 has so much deferred maintenance that it won't be reliable without spending twice much as you would have on a single-owner, low mile B5.

In reply to ebonyandivory :

Lol. I was thinking about changing it to that. 

Edit: done diddly darn did. 

No. Don't. Trust Me.

I had a B5. Had to do a complete Control Arm replacement twice in 100k kms (60k miles). The replacement Control Arm kit was, at the time, $2600 CAD. VW Canada loves to screw it's customers. Same kit from FCP Groton $599 USD. Most complicated PCV system, I have ever seen. Funny enough, I never had a coil fail. 

BCM is under driver's feet, the wires come down the A pillar and then to BCM. Right at the base of the A pillar, they start to break. So mine slowly started to have sub-systems fail. First to go were the power mirrors, then the interior lights. I sold it before any more failed.

BTW, I never drove the car with a CEL and took good care of it.

I could go on, but like I said, NO!!

In reply to NGTD :

I need to find a parallel universe where these, and  Land Rover Discoveries top Toyota and Honda in reliability.

ebonyandivory said:

In reply to NGTD :

I need to find a parallel universe where these, and  Land Rover Discoveries top Toyota and Honda in reliability.

Yeah believe me, I really like how my Passat drove and the mileage for a good size car was great. I have lusted over B5 Audi's, but after the Passat, I just can't do it.

Knurled. said:

mtn said:

My cousin had a 1.8t. He literally kept 3 sets of ignition coils in the trunk because of that--not having to call in sick to work. 

 

Y'know, if you replace the plugs every 30k or so, the coils live a nice long life.

 

But I guess keeping spare parts and tools in the trunk is cheaper than a few sets of plugs.

 

This falls under the category of "usual VWAG abuse".

I can't talk for my cousin and what he did/didn't do, but knowing him and his driving/maintenance habits I'd be shocked if he didn't already know this and do it. He's abusive to tires, wheels, and suspension, but everything of his is typically mechanically perfect, and if not, upgraded to become so. The type of guy that I wouldn't be afraid of recommending a maintenance intensive product to, basically.