Learn me: Opel GT

So, I was perusing my local Craigslist looking at random cars, and as I opened a page for an Opel GT, my wife looked over my shoulder and said she wanted one.

Now, the one I found is overpriced, or at least I feel. That doesn't mean there aren't deals to be found.

From what I understand, these things only have trunk access from the passenger compartment, so that doesn't make for a practical car, but it gives me hope that my wife will finally let me put an old car together.

I'd assume that any non-running GT would be well suited for a powerplant swap. I'd normally think about something LS, but I think that's too much power for my wife to drive. Rotary? Miata? SR20DET?

I know it's leaf springs in the front and coil in the rear. Has anyone around here done a subframe swap? Again, thinking Miata.

I have seen a few of these for under $1000 set up for a V8, but I haven't found out which V8. One is 4 linked in the rear with a Ford 9 inch rear and one I think is stock. I'm actually going to look at some for my own curiosity.

What are problem areas for these cars? Any major rust spots to look for? Anything that should send me running?

Major rustspots are easy to find - anything on these rusts, with the possible exception of the glass, but that's not been confirmed yet.

A typical swap in Europe is for a newer Opel/GM engine like the Ecotec.

opels are unibody, no frame. they can take a gm v6 very easily. after swapping a 2.3T into one my advice would be to keep it stock (at least for a while) this will make it easy and fun to restore and mantain. there is good supportand parts are not a problem.

make sure the glass is good. a nice dash would be a huge find. look for rust under the belly pan. and most have been hit in the front (trucks seem to back over the front end/hood), so look for repairs there.

dont even consider the 1.1L or an automatic

you could always buy a corvette and slip it by the miss's (they can look very similar in photos)

Definitely make sure the glass is good, the windshields seem to follow Faberge egg pricing structures. The bodies rust if you look at them crosseyed so search carefully. On mine, the rear 'apron' was pretty much dissolved. The nose had been hit and poorly repaired. When you look at how it's made, the reason for the poor repair is evident: it is a complete PITA to get in there and do anything.

A 13B will fit in one pretty easily. The biggest problem is there is just not a lot of room for a radiator unless you relocate the master cylinder and booster, which is every bit as hard as it sounds. Or go with a laydown up in the very front, a Jeep Cherokee radiator might work but it would be a beeyotch to R&R if needed. I wound up using an aluminum 'Scirocco' radiator in approximately the stock position.

The rear axle is fairly fragile and pretty narrow (IIRC 51") but that's not insurmountable.

The front suspension is a transverse leaf that's... interesting to disassemble. I was able to splice Miata steering uprights into mine pretty easily and at the same time did a flEbay coilover conversion. I'm sure a Miata subframe could be put under the front but after digging through mine I found it simpler and probably every bit as effective to use the stock front control arms and crossmember.

Putting a narrowed Miata IRS under one in the rear turned into a much bigger deal than I thought. I was pretty well on the way to completing it (I actually had it to the 'roller' point) when some other things in my life dictated that it go away.

Ok, so things I'm looking for are glass and rust. If the price is right, I can forgive a dash pad, unless good ones are ungodly expensive.

I would hazard a guess that they are, and they're probably not easy to find (which is likely the case for most parts).

I know wlkelley3 has a absolutely beautiful GT. They have the strange transverse spring front suspension IIRC.

Unless there's a serious lack of room out front, I'm planning on double A arms out front with coil springs. That's why I was thinking Miata subframe and engine transplant. My wife isn't interested in a car if she has to let it warm up for 10 minutes and has less than 5 gears

I had a non-running kadett for a while, same driveline. Cool cars. I think the Miata subframe is too wide as a whole, but I could be wrong. One source for parts - opelgtsource.com there's also a very active web forum, opelgt.com/forum

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rust

The Miata subframe is definitely too wide for a bolt-in. From what I recall, you'd need about an extra 4" of fender.

Bill at Flyin' Miata has a pair of GTs that he's planning to put a Miata drivetrain in. I'm not sure if that will happen before 2030 though.

Keith wrote: The Miata subframe is definitely too wide for a bolt-in. From what I recall, you'd need about an extra 4" of fender.

fender flares can fix anything

File Under: Relevant to Our Interests

Keith - Has anyone compiled a list of classics which the Miata subframe & driveline is a good fit for?

In reply to JoeyM:

Box flares=Race car

Derick Freese wrote: Ok, so things I'm looking for are glass and rust.

You wont have to look hard, the rust will be easy to find....everywhere.

Seriously I love these little cars but they are water soluble in the worst way.

I'm reminded of a neighbor who kept "rolling restoring" his. Every spring he'd sand out some rust, apply some filler and spot paint. After about 5 years he decided to go whole hog with a full restoration. Stripped it down and sent it for acid dipping. Nothing came back :(

Most of those v8 cars only work because the body is held together by the roll cage. I have seen a lot of them, and not one would I drive on the street.

My plan was always to go the other direction. That is, I wanted to take the Opel GT front end, widen it to fit, then mount it on the front of a Miata. Same in the rear. Certainly easier and cheaper, and you get a convertible when you are done that anyone an drive.

nderwater wrote: File Under: Relevant to Our Interests Keith - Has anyone compiled a list of classics which the Miata subframe & driveline is a good fit for?

Not that I've seen, but it wouldn't be hard to do. Compare the track width to that of the Miata and assume that the vintage body could absorb around a 2" increase before you have to start altering the body. On an MGB, you need 2-3" fender flares, more if you want to install anything larger than stock Miata wheels/tires.

As for the driveline, it'll fit just about anything as it's a fairly typical size for a 4 cylinder of 1.5l or larger. The Opel GT has a super-stumpy transmission, that's a challenge. But most engines seem to be fairly close in size. BMC A-Series being the big notable exception.

Woody wrote: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rust

FTFY. Really! Click on it now.

Is the rust issue with the GT any worse than any other German car of the era? I mean, I expect there to be rust, but do these things just spontaneously turn to a pile of iron oxide overnight, or is it something that can be handled with proper care and preparation?

In reply to RossD: I see what you did there, I lol'd.

Oh, and for what it's worth, I think a GT would look good with some flares.

honestly, probably no worse than a Karman Ghia or a 2002. They just lack the aftermarket support to keep the sheetmetal in production.. which is a shame, they are DAMN sexy

Derick Freese wrote: Oh, and for what it's worth, I think a GT would look good with some flares.

They do actually have some tasty little flares on the body already.

mad_machine wrote: honestly, probably no worse than a Karman Ghia or a 2002. They just lack the aftermarket support to keep the sheetmetal in production.. which is a shame, they are DAMN sexy

And also, if you can find panels, the unibody is really complicated, with lots of places for the stuff to hide. I talked to a restorer at the Mitty a few years back that said he'd rather work on a BMW E9. IMO, that's really saying something..

wow.. that is saying something.

They do have some nice flares from the factory, but imagine having a little more bubble flare on there.