Ian F wrote: In reply to jsquared: "GRM" does not always mean "DIY". Many of us either can't or don't want to do stuff like this ourselves. Personally, as much as I love cars, my enjoyment from working on them has fallen off drastically.
I second that! I even took my Cooper S to the shop today to have somewhat simple work done. I just don't have time anymore either.
racerdave600 wrote:Ian F wrote: In reply to jsquared: "GRM" does not always mean "DIY". Many of us either can't or don't want to do stuff like this ourselves. Personally, as much as I love cars, my enjoyment from working on them has fallen off drastically.I second that! I even took my Cooper S to the shop today to have somewhat simple work done. I just don't have time anymore either.
This as has been discussed many times, there are many on the forum without the inclination to work on their cars and/or with the means to pay a trusted source to do it.
It's been years of this coming up, I really wish it would go away. (Sorry realized this didn't sound like I was agreeing with you when I was.)
There's a massive difference in the knowledge level and what you can have a real conversation about between someone who can and chooses not to, and someone who can't. It's not always obvious which is which without poking and prodding which always seems sort of predatory when the answer comes up as 'cant'.
A lot of forums have sections that are only for people who 'can'. I spent ~8 hours diagnosing an issue on one of my cars in the last week. I didn't post anything about it because 99% of the general forum population can't really help me.
I agree that just because someone chooses to pay to have something done is not by itself a bad thing, but knowing much other people know about how the car works is helpful in deciding what you should try to talk to them about. Sometimes there might be some poking/prodding that isn't about guilt tripping but just trying to establish how to talk to someone.
shrugs
I drove the FRS and MX-5 Club Sport PRHT on the same day a few weeks back. The FR-S interior feels cozy, but the MX-5 with the top up was nigh confining. While I liked them both, the FR-S just makes a lot more sense. Still haven't bitten the bullet, though.
MrChaos wrote: using geicos online quote thing, which I know isnt the most accurate. but I used real, but fake, info. 2015 Mustang: $90/mo 50/100 coverage 2014 FRS/brz(both were the same): $95/mo 2013 NC Miata: $70/mo 2006 Corvette: $65/mo 2008 Miata: $60/ mo
So buy a Corvette, it's the sensible option!
As long as you're paying with cash.
I've driven the FRS/BRZ and the Miata and of those two I think I would go with the FRS/BRZ over the Miata. If you're looking at the Genesis then I would say Mustang GT 5.0 instead of the Genesis, but as a few of the other folks pointed out the Genesis is a different car from the other two.
Swank Force One wrote: I'm not trying to say either one is a rocket, i just found it funny how this forum loves to point out how slow some cars are, then not say anything of the sort about the Miata. The point was simply that the MX5 shares the same "con" of being underpowered, and it was curious that it wasn't listed.
I have often wondered about this. How does the Miata get by without a single comment about being underpowered, while it is a fixation in the Automotive community that the Triplets are gutless wonders? Where did the expectation of huge power come from and why is it not demanded of the Miata?
In reply to NOHOME:
I think with the miata, iirc the power to weight ratio has not changed since it was released so it is expected that the miata is under-powered so it really isnt that much of a con since you are expecting it. While the FRS/BRZ was supposed to be the new sporty car from toyota and the Camry v6 is still faster than the FT86 twins so the engine choice was going to always be an issue in the FT86 twins imo.
Also since the twins are the same to insure as the mustang, it immediately knocks them out of contention for me.
MrChaos wrote: In reply to NOHOME: I think with the miata, iirc the power to weight ratio has not changed since it was released so it is expected that the miata is under-powered so it really isnt that much of a con since you are expecting it. While the FRS/BRZ was supposed to be the new sporty car from toyota and the Camry v6 is still faster than the FT86 twins so the engine choice was going to always be an issue in the FT86 twins imo. Also since the twins are the same to insure as the mustang, it immediately knocks them out of contention for me.
I would go as far as to say that if you're really shopping the twins, the Mustang probably isn't for you. I traded a fairly new GT on my 370Z after only owning it for 3 months. It's not a sports car. It's a decent car mind you, but its not a substitute for either a Twin or a Miata. Of course they aren't a substitute for a Mustang either. Now the new Mustang may be different. 
Of course if you're old like me, insurance is cheap on just about everything. 
In reply to NOHOME, I don't understand it either. Its the same as the negativity on the MINI, but no one complains about the same problems with BMWs, and yes they have almost the exact same problems.
NOHOME wrote:Swank Force One wrote: I'm not trying to say either one is a rocket, i just found it funny how this forum loves to point out how slow some cars are, then not say anything of the sort about the Miata. The point was simply that the MX5 shares the same "con" of being underpowered, and it was curious that it wasn't listed.I have often wondered about this. How does the Miata get by without a single comment about being underpowered, while it is a fixation in the Automotive community that the Triplets are gutless wonders? Where did the expectation of huge power come from and why is it not demanded of the Miata?
Same happens with the RX8, which is MILES faster than the Miata, and from the same company, for pete's sake.
well now with these official pics of the ND mx5 cup car I might have to wait for it...
Just to clarify, I was attempting to be a bit tongue-in-cheek! Didn't mean to touch off any grassfires
Ooooo! Want ND Miata! 
Harvey wrote: Ooooo! Want ND Miata!
it is so pretty
Like rwdsport said, drive all of the cars to see which one you like driving the best. For a DD, it's not always about the numbers. The Genesis Coupe may have the best numbers of the three, but if it's second on your list of how much you like driving it, you should pass. If you're buying new, make sure it's a manual so we can buy it from you in 4 or so years. 
Don't automatically rule out a C6 Corvette, 370Z, and a RX-8.
Then after you drive them all, tell us how they felt to you.
MrChaos wrote:Harvey wrote: Ooooo! Want ND Miata!it is so pretty
The FRS goes to the crusher in 2023. By then I will have 6 years of used ND Miata to chose from. Assuming I can still get into a sports car at that stage of my life, I will go looking for one.
New Mustang... New MX5... 2015 is shaping up to be a good year. 
While I'm sure the ND miata will be a very nice car, it's just not one for me - I don't do convertibles and I've yet to meet a stock miata I fit in comfortably. Miata's were made for short people...the Twins were made for taller people like me, but even then I still need the seating position to be 2" lower and the steering wheel closer than how it comes stock.
The inspiration for some of the changes I'm doing to my FRS (in a more streetable fashion) comes from the TRD Griffon...a remarkable 86 project track car that is going for the record of fastest NA car at Tsukuba. The cornering speed it has is incredible...much attention and development was done on the aero and suspension and adding lightness:
Ian F wrote: New Mustang... New MX5... 2015 is shaping up to be a good year.
I have been wanting to drive an Ecoboost mustang, so that if I like it I can buy some stock to get x-plan in 6 months. I might have to modify my story if I want a salesman to let me drive it, though.
I don't know who these people are or what forum they think this is but Miata all the way.
It is always the answer.
Swank Force One wrote: Same happens with the RX8, which is MILES faster than the Miata, and from the same company, for pete's sake.
The Rx-8 was sold as a sports sedan, there is an expectation of more power in that market. The Miata pretty much has the "inexpensive, 2-seat convertible" market to itself (well, there was briefly the MR-Spyder, which had similar power).
Personally, I think they shoulda ditched the useless rear doors and rear seats from the Rx-8 and saved 500 pounds of weight, then the renesis wouldn't have felt as anemic. It would also have been nice if it had made all of the power it was supposed to when first announced.
I don't know anyone who owns an Rx-8 who actually uses it as a 4-seater.
I don't think the Miata so much "gets a pass" as the people who cared gave up complaining about it 20 years ago because it became obvious Mazda wasn't listening. :)
Flight Service wrote: I don't know who these people are or what forum they think this is but Miata all the way. It is always the answer.
Except when the answer is Cappuccino?
Oh how I wish I were a tiny Japanese man sometimes that could squeeze into one of those...
I could get this and then a miata later http://www.japaneseclassicsllc.com/1989-nissan-skyline-r32-gts-t-type-m-4-door-5-mt-12995---available-now.html
In reply to codrus:
I did, 2 kid seats in the back...
Vracer111 wrote:Flight Service wrote: I don't know who these people are or what forum they think this is but Miata all the way. It is always the answer.Except when the answer is Cappuccino?
Probably the first time in history that phrase has ever been said without being sarcastic.
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