Mini Cooper s

I wil lbe looking for a new to me car.

thinking Mini Cooper S  vsa GTI

I have done a bunch of reading and i am kind of torn

for this group i was hoping someone could answer.

looking at gen 2 mini,   or similar vintage gti (mrk 6?) how much performance / fun do you trade off as you go to the clubman or the 4 door

if i need real practicability i think i need to look at the 4 door gti  but i might be abel to convince SWMBO  to OK a smaller car.

I commute 0 miles per day  (zero)  and will mostly use it for errands and trips with the wife.  picking up kids etc.  My girls are 16.  and will have their own car/s soon.  oh and I wna tto get back to autocross with no expectations of being competitive.

I know MINIs better than the various GTIs, but if I were looking for a MINI as a primary car, I'd look for a 3rd Gen (F56). The 2nd Gens (R56) were pretty much the worst for reliability. The 1st Gens (R53) will be all over the map and at this point are so old you are buying the owner more than the car, so good cars tend to command higher asking prices.

For better or worse, the MINI reputation for unreliability means that the early F56 models depreciate fairly quickly.

2nd gen after 2010 was a bit better.  It still has the normal BMW problems but it has significantly fewer weird Mini problems.  The extra rear room in the Clubmans is nice.

My local MINI specialist shop will tell you the 2nd generation cars are their bread and butter because of their unreliability. I'd suggest a late 1st gen or go to a 3rd gen. I own an R53 and it certainly is a fun car, but it's 16 years old now. Stuff will start failing soon.

Google "R56 death rattle"...enjoy the read.  I owned one and it was an absolute hoot to drive, but I got rid of it before the grenade went off.

The GTI won't be any better, in any generation.  From a reliability standpoint, steaming pile of dog E36 M3.

I had a 2nd Gens (R56)  S and loved it. I got rid of it when my son became too tall to sit behind me in a car seat.

I hate FWD, but that was a awesome handling car. The clubman may have more room, but you lose so much more in looks then you get in space.

Ian F said:

I know MINIs better than the various GTIs, but if I were looking for a MINI as a primary car, I'd look for a 3rd Gen (F56). The 2nd Gens (R56) were pretty much the worst for reliability. The 1st Gens (R53) will be all over the map and at this point are so old you are buying the owner more than the car, so good cars tend to command higher asking prices.

For better or worse, the MINI reputation for unreliability means that the early F56 models depreciate fairly quickly.

Are the f cars worth looking into? As much as I hated working on my r53 s, that was a scooty little bastard and I kind of want another. 

1st gen scares me because of the age.  maybe i should jus buy the best first gen I can find if i want a mini.

1 comments on the size of the "other minis"  clubmen etc.

whats the japanese crossshop.  Civic SI?.

Yeah, the Si is a good place to look. Depending on budget, size, etc, I'd also cross-shop the Mazda 2, Ford Fiesta, and Honda Fit for the Cooper, and the Mazda 3 for the Clubman (if you want more space, the hatch 3 and Si will have a lot more than the Clubman).

Every time I read one of these posts about Minis, I really wish they weren't such a hassle to own.  

well I started the thread to talk about size,  but it hink peoepl are scaring me away from the mini.  is it really any worse than a volkswagon? (thining GTI)  or should i just  move on and get an civic SI 

Most folks on this forum will scare you away from the MINI. It's not well-loved here from a "reliability" and ease of ownership perspective. It is well-loved in terms of driving dynamics, and so many of us wish that it were easier to live with. How much of that perceived difficulty to live with is reality, and how much is perception, is hard to say. 

The GTI isn't too different. I believe the GRM hive-mind might have a little more love for them in terms of ease of ownership, but not a whole lot. Is the MINI actually worse than the GTI, or any BMW for that matter? Again, I believe that is probably a matter of perception. But that's just my perception!

I will say, when I worked at a used-car sales start up called Shift, I saw a lot of MINIs come through, as they are well-liked in the SF area due to ease of parking and looks. It struck me that many needed a lot of money in repairs before we could sell them. It stood out to me, and to pretty much everyone who worked there. More than a VW? It's tough to say. There were probably more MINIs for sale than VWs, so that may have skewed my perspective.

Hondas don't tend to come with that baggage, perceptual as it may be.

In reply to scooterfrog :

Maybe. I own a 2006 R53, but with a couple of caveats. First, it's not my primary car. I basically use it like one of my classic cars; only driven a few times per month. Second, I've been playing with these cars since my ex- bought one new in 2003, so I have a fair amount of experience tearing them apart and putting them back together and have invested no small amount of money into special tools to make that work easier. 

In reply to Mndsm :

From what I've been told through the local club and MINI specialists I've known for quite some time, the F-series cars are significantly better than previous generations.  Friends who have them have reported few issues with them.

In reply to Ian F :

See, now I want an F-series! Damn it. 

We bought my wife a 05 R53 years ago. Bought it used with about 50k from friends who bought it new and had it dealer maintained. It was an absolute blast to drive. It had enough weird problems that were directly tied to poor engineering that we traded it in at 100k, I don't feel like rehashing the list. I couldn't trust it as my wife's DD. I loved to drive it, but I wouldn't own another one. 

I currently have a '12 R56 S and previously a R53 S. The early cars are more reliable, but the F cars are the way to go.  I helped a friend purchase a new one last year, well 2016 to be exact, to replace her totalled R56, and it is better in every way.  Seriously, not only is it more reliable and more BMW, but it sounds better, rides better, is faster, and just a nicer place to be.  Her F56 stock will easily outrun my lightly modded R56S and is more fun to drive.  The '14 and '15 models are depreciated enough to be decent buys now too. 

scooterfrog said:

well I started the thread to talk about size,  but it hink peoepl are scaring me away from the mini.  is it really any worse than a volkswagon? (thining GTI)  or should i just  move on and get an civic SI 

They're both a barrel full of monkeys fun to drive.  My Mini always put a huge smile on my face every time I sat in it.  But truth is they're both horrid from a reliability standpoint.

If that type of car interests you, Civic Si may be the closest reliable thing.  Mazda is always a good choice.

OK  well my wife nixed the manual option  because my girls and her cannot drive it.  (girls are new drivers)  that means no civic SI.  she said the next car can be a manual.

but cooper s and GTI both come with good to excellent automatics.

i have looked at a bunch of how to on the mini  and they all start with "go into service position"  or remove the front clip.  that's the same as my passat.  i exepct the gti would be similar.

i have never worked on an engine bay with space.

she also said the mini is not too small

looking t a 2006 (r53 ?)  this weekend

VW's get a bad rap on this board because people buy cheap, neglected ones and then expect them to work perfectly.  Any used German car needs to be maintained.  If you buy one that's neglected, its going to empty your wallet in a hurry.

Mk6 GTi's are great cars, just make sure you buy one that's been maintained and has the paperwork to prove it.

I bought a 07 S with 47k the previous owner had neglected it and the turbo oil feed line had a leak, emptying the crank case.

I got it with a new motor however the shop that did the work short_cutted all the ancillaries.

So it immediately went back for a cam chain tensioner, and a boost diverter valve, a water pump (OEM is plastic).

I put a slightly larger rear sway bar on it to loosen it up, and LOVE it!

I dislike the OEM stereo (kaka) and it does not remember the sport mode setting on a restart.

It's grown on me, I'd buy another at the right price.

If I had to pay someone to work on it, I might feel different.

Difficult to work on, you have to peel off layers to get to things.

A catch can for the PCV gack is next on my to do list, don't know where Im going to put it though.

scooterfrog said:

but cooper s and GTI both come with good to excellent automatics.

looking t a 2006 (r53 ?)  this weekend

I've heard of the R53 automatic described in many ways, but "excellent" has never been one of them.

I daily a 2006 Cooper S (R53). Staring down the barrel of 100k miles, owned since around 50k. Pretty sure '06 was the last year for the supercharged S, for better or worse (I like it).

It does want some specialty tools (accessory belt removal tool). Its a BMW, what do you expect?

I hadn't done much of anything with it until about 1000 miles ago, when I pulled the front end down for the 100k service (supercharger oil change, belt, pulley upgrade, oil and coolant change). If I'd had the belt tool on-hand and hadn't screwed up my harmonic balancer puller, I'd have been able to get it all back together in under 6 hours, by myself. 

There are a few little frustrating issues (rattles, cheap-feeling interior trim that is stoopid expensive, passenger air bag sensor, busted seat lift mechanism), but most of them I'm living with because I'm too lazy to fix them or they're low in my priorities list.

I love it. Doesn't put as big a smile on my face as my Beetle, but the smiles are more consistent. I don't worry about it leaving me stranded and it has all the creature comforts the Beetle doesn't.

In reply to Ian F :

regarding hte trasnmission

i was thinking that the gti dsg is excellent,  

the mini i need to drive i heard its not bad.and manual was nixed, 

JohnInKansas said:

I daily a 2006 Cooper S (R53). Staring down the barrel of 100k miles, owned since around 50k. Pretty sure '06 was the last year for the supercharged S, for better or worse (I like it).

It does want some specialty tools (accessory belt removal tool). Its a BMW, what do you expect?

I hadn't done much of anything with it until about 1000 miles ago, when I pulled the front end down for the 100k service (supercharger oil change, belt, pulley upgrade, oil and coolant change). If I'd had the belt tool on-hand and hadn't screwed up my harmonic balancer puller, I'd have been able to get it all back together in under 6 hours, by myself. 

There are a few little frustrating issues (rattles, cheap-feeling interior trim that is stoopid expensive, passenger air bag sensor, busted seat lift mechanism), but most of them I'm living with because I'm too lazy to fix them or they're low in my priorities list.

I love it. Doesn't put as big a smile on my face as my Beetle, but the smiles are more consistent. I don't worry about it leaving me stranded and it has all the creature comforts the Beetle doesn't.

german cars i get.  i had an 1994 325is(e36) wth 280 k Miles  (everything is a wear part) and a passat now. that my daughter brushed  with a telephone pole.

get in the service position ...  the 06 is what i am looking at this weekend.

You seem like you really want a Mini or a GTI.  You don't have to convince us, if you can rationalize it for yourself then do it.  You'll have an absolute blast driving them.  Just don't say you weren't warned...LOL.  From a reliability standpoint, both are E36 M3 piles.  The R53 auto trans is anything but reliable....it's actually one of the weakest points on the car.  Awful reputation.

The R53 automatic is Awful, really, don't do that. Get an F56 or a GTI.

You will not enjoy autoxing an auto R53.